2014 Michigan Wolverines: Team 135

[WaitTilNextYear]

Quote: Originally Posted by Illustrator76

No, it's CLEAR and OBVIOUS that you haven't being paying attention if you actually believe your own posts that Michigan's defense in recent years has been good. I'm not going to sit here and argue with someone who has no idea what he is talking about (e.g. you). Stats can easily lie. Most of those stats were padded by the 3 cupcake games that Michigan plays every year (or by feasting on the low rung B1G teams). Then the B1G schedule begins and Michigan starts getting handled by REAL competition. Remember the Ohio State game last year? Michigan lost after going for 2 because Brady Hoke was thoroughly convinced that Michigan's D couldn't even get ONE stop because they sucked the entire game. What about giving up 33 points to South Carolina (again, REAL competition) in the Outback Bowl? When Michigan actually plays REAL competition, they can't generate a pass rush, they can't stop the run, they can't stop the pass, and their overall defense isn't very good. Period. Believe whatever you want to and continue to fool yourself with stats, but the reality is that Michigan's defense just hasn't performed well against the big boys (you wanna talk stats/numbers? (2013) 30 points to Notre Dame, 43 points to Penn State, 47 points to Indiana, 30 points to Michigan State, 42 points to Ohio State, and 31 points to Kansas State). I guess since Michigan held mighty Akron to 24 points last year you consider that a good thing, huh? ... Case closed. Let it go.

Yea, the case was closed, yet you continue to respond...

You mean we gave up 42 to the same 2013 OSU team that averaged 45.5 PPG? Or 47 to the same 2013 Indiana unit that averaged 38.4 PPG? 31 points to the 2013 K State team that averaged 33.4 PPG? 30 points to the 2013 MSU team that averaged 29.4 PPG? 30 points to the 2013 ND team that averaged 27.2 PPG? The 43 points given up to 2013 PSU in FOUR OVERTIMES?

So just because Indiana and PSU got a bit above their averages, we can't do anything on defense? Exaggerate much? Any accounting for T/O margin/short fields in any of those games and how 4 TOs per game by DG might put the defense in a wee bad spot?

Furthermore, are we the only school that plays "cupcakes"? So, we should get unilaterally penalized for that and no other FBS schools that pad their non-conference schedules should? Or should our season stats be valid because we, like every other big school, play 3 or 4 cupcakes per season? OSU's stats certainly look better after a 70 point win over Youngstown State. Wisconsin looks pretty good after thrashing BGSU. Not just Michigan, sir.

Look I get it. You're upset about the team. But, cumong man.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Quote: Originally Posted by sportsbuck

Is Michigan's defense better in comparison to the RichRod era? Yes, no doubt. Still doesn't mean it's at acceptable levels for Michigan. I want Hoke gone because a strong Michigan is good for the B10, and there's no way Michigan will be strong under Brady Hoke.

Michigan doesn't really know what "acceptable levels" are for Michigan. Some fans think anything less than 55-0 each game is failure. We are a spoiled fan base.

I contend that 9th in rush defense and top 30 in pass defense IS good enough, IF we had some semblance of an offense. We're giving up 20 PPG fergodsakes, how is that bad? It's not like we've played 4 cupcakes either. Utah and ND are both credible opponents. Believe me guys, it's not the defense!!!

As for your Brady Hoke comment, the upcoming conference schedule is going to clarify that quite nicely.

[Psyblast]

Quote: Originally Posted by WaitTilNextYear

Utah and ND are both credible opponents.

And the defense - while yes, was hung out to dry by the offense - still got smashed by both teams.

Michigan has been a failure in every aspect of the game against the only two teams worth a **** that they've played. Except for the run defense. Congrats on that. It won't hold up, nor will it matter as the losses mount.

It's over.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Quote: Originally Posted by Psyblast

And the defense - while yes, was hung out to dry by the offense - still got smashed by both teams. Michigan has been a failure in every aspect of the game against the only two teams worth a **** that they've played. Except for the run defense. Congrats on that. It won't hold up, nor will it matter as the losses mount. It's over.

Hmmm, I might re-check what happened in those games. We shut ND's run game down big time. We turned the Utes into a FG-making machine. Yes, I want to go undefeated and not give up a point too, but I think it's important to remain rational at least when we inevitably don't do that.

[CBoller1331]

Since Michigan isn't good this year, can we turn this into a thread where we just bash Notre Dame?

[Psyblast]

Quote: Originally Posted by WaitTilNextYear

Hmmm, I might re-check what happened in those games. We shut ND's run game down big time. We turned the Utes into a FG-making machine. Yes, I want to go undefeated and not give up a point too, but I think it's important to remain rational at least when we inevitably don't do that.

Oh I'm perfectly rational. Michigan has played two teams with a pulse and been outscored 57-10. One touchdown scored in 8 quarters, and not by the offense. The DBs were clueless against ND, and the "FG-making machine" still did enough to make the defense's best efforts not good enough.

You keep clinging to the rankings of the run defense or whatever. In the meantime, Michigan will spiral the drain as the season progresses, because there is no leadership on this team, and they don't have any respect or fear for their head coach. A disgrace like yesterday should've resulted in a players-only meeting with seniors bringing the hellfire and brimstone. Instead, the attitude is "meh," like the rest of the program. No accountability, no fire, no nothing. Just a program that's flatlining under a MAC-level coach who never should've gotten the job.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Quote: Originally Posted by CBoller1331

Since Michigan isn't good this year, can we turn this into a thread where we just bash Notre Dame?

Probably some issue with TOS there? Maybe we can apply for a TOS exemption from Steve_OS just in this one aspect? lol

Quote: Originally Posted by Psyblast

Oh I'm perfectly rational. Michigan has played two teams with a pulse and been outscored 57-10. One touchdown scored in 8 quarters, and not by the offense. The DBs were clueless against ND, and the "FG-making machine" still did enough to make the defense's best efforts not good enough. You keep clinging to the rankings of the run defense or whatever. In the meantime, Michigan will spiral the drain as the season progresses, because there is no leadership on this team, and they don't have any respect or fear for their head coach. A disgrace like yesterday should've resulted in a players-only meeting with seniors bringing the hellfire and brimstone. Instead, the attitude is "meh," like the rest of the program. No accountability, no fire, no nothing. Just a program that's flatlining under a MAC-level coach who never should've gotten the job.

It is a pretty young team, though. Those leaders (and best) are still developing. Remember, this senior class is from the recruiting class year in which we had a coaching change. A lot of attrition etc.. has depleted us in terms of vocal 4-yr starting senior leaders. I also am kinda glad these kids are being even keeled. Some see it as not caring, but I don't want these kids losing sight of this only being one phase of their very young lives. It isn't really life and death at all.

My main issue was just communicating facts a page or 2 back. Those facts/stats make it clear that our defense is fundamentally different under Hoke, and much better than the RR years. Of that, there can be no debate. And it's not just stats--I was there! It was ugly!

That being put to bed, I get it that a large majority of Michigan fans want Hoke to go and can see why. In YEAR 4, we are not close to where we need to be. Hoke gives non-answers in press conferences and has been bristling. He also doesn't appear to be much of a tactician at all. I completely get all of these things, and if our B1G season goes poorly, I will borrow a spare pitchfork from one of the guys in this thread myself.

Until that time, though, I think an accurate picture of why we are 2-2 in fairly pathetic fashion is really about offense, not converting, getting behind the chains, making bad reads, and turning the ball over. I am very satisfied with the defense so far, and a good run defense is a big deal against B1G opponents. I also think our run offense is actually improving from abysmal last year. But, without improvements in QB play, though, you are probably right about the spiraling the drain.

[Illustrator76]

Quote: Originally Posted by WaitTilNextYear

Look I get it...

No...you don't (that much is obvious). Again, I am done arguing with you. Believe what you want to believe. The proof is in the pudding. Michigan is already having a horrible season, both their Offense and Defense look hapless against semi-decent competition, and Brady Hoke will almost certainly be fired at the end of the season.

Like I said before...Case closed.