Pound for Pound: XBOX > XBOX 360 for Sports Games

[mgoblue]

Quote: Originally Posted by jfsolo

Its funny, I take the opposite view. I think the adherence to the "fun factor" maxim is what holds these games back. Things like poor throws and penalties in football, walks, and errors in baseball, bad passes and fouls in basketball, are all kept way below realistic levels so as not to frustrate the casual crowd and reduce the fun factor. It wouldn't matter as much if so many of the sliders in games weren't essentially non functioning. I understand the economic reasons why they do what they do, but trying to keep the game balanced keeps the game good, but prevents it from being great, IMO.

I've said it before...the minute that football, basketball, baseball, etc games become "full simulations" I'll stop playing them. I play games to have fun in my spare time. Real sports you have to watch tape, learn defenses, spend hours learning different pitchers, plays, etc. I like more realism in my video games, but if I was a good enough football player I'd be playing in the real NFL, you know?

I've just realized I'm not as hardcore a sports game fan as some of you. I'm not going to memorize 50 plays for a NBA game. I don't tinker with rosters for hours, f with sliders, etc. I don't spend days agonizing what trades I'm going to do in my dynasty, looking at stats to figure it out. I'm not going to watch video game "tape" to learn the opponents. Pure realism just isn't for me, and I'm realizing that now.

I want some things like more incomplete passes, but sometimes the "real thing" just wouldn't be fun in video game form. I don't want a game to become "work" and take hours. Some of the realistic things people like just seem like work to me...I get paid to work, I don't get paid to play games.

Quote: Originally Posted by mgoblue

I've said it before...the minute that football, basketball, baseball, etc games become "full simulations" I'll stop playing them. I play games to have fun in my spare time. Real sports you have to watch tape, learn defenses, spend hours learning different pitchers, plays, etc. I like more realism in my video games, but if I was a good enough football player I'd be playing in the real NFL, you know? I've just realized I'm not as hardcore a sports game fan as some of you. I'm not going to memorize 50 plays for a NBA game. I don't tinker with rosters for hours, f with sliders, etc. I don't spend days agonizing what trades I'm going to do in my dynasty, looking at stats to figure it out. I'm not going to watch video game "tape" to learn the opponents. Pure realism just isn't for me, and I'm realizing that now. I want some things like more incomplete passes, but sometimes the "real thing" just wouldn't be fun in video game form. I don't want a game to become "work" and take hours. Some of the realistic things people like just seem like work to me...I get paid to work, I don't get paid to play games.

That's a great post... the thing that all these "sim", couch jockey guys don't realize is that if a football game, for example, was truly as realistic and fast paced as an actual game, then not a single one of them would be good enough to play it.

[bukktown]

Quote: Originally Posted by dickdalewood

the thing that all these "sim", couch jockey guys don't realize is that if a football game, for example, was truly as realistic and fast paced as an actual game, then not a single one of them would be good enough to play it.

I don't know about that. None of us have the physical size/ability to play pro football. But all you need to play a video game is a brain, eyes and motor skills.

[catcatch22]

A few years back I was heavy into sim racing. Had the wheel and pedal thing going with all the realistic physics alterations to all my favorite racing PC games. Then I realized this is way too hard. The racing games got better on the pc and so I needed a better wheel. Then I started racing competition online and then with new more realistic physics engines the racing was down right impossible without days of 3 hour practices, literally. It was just too much work. The mods made the pc racers too realistic. It became unplayble to me. What happened was that the games became too real, to drive with that much skill I might as well send a tape of myself going thru Monaco to Red Bull Ferrari or tape of me going thru Sears Point to Chip Ganassi Racing. I know there are difficulty levels and such but as a man you want to be able to at least challenge on the most realistic level or you feel like you are not really playing the game.

There was this one gifted pc racer I befriended and he was just great at it and was just unbeatable when he wanted to be, he kind of became sort of like a legend in the racing circles I was in. I could challenge him here or there and even outperformed him a few times, but I couldn't do it without hours and hours of practice.

There is definitely a limit to where they should go with the games, however I hardly feel they have gone above it yet! The sports games that we have on the consoles have yet to reach some of the rediculous realism reached in alot of the pc racing games. Once it reaches that level then its time to quit. Its not like these games are asking you to throw the pitch itself like in that southwest commercial, or actually throw the punches like on the Wii. Your just pressing buttons and stuff. There is no physical execurtion. I wouldn't mind more realism just not to rediculous proportions. There is nothing wrong with a "project gotham racing" type of sports experience.

Great post. I've tried extremely hard to enjoy these games but I can't. I haven't played XBOX 360 in about a week now and that would have NEVER happened with the old box. Everything gets so clunky, animations ruin plays which in turn ruin games.

[Cardot]

Quote: Originally Posted by mgoblue

I've said it before...the minute that football, basketball, baseball, etc games become "full simulations" I'll stop playing them. I play games to have fun in my spare time. Real sports you have to watch tape, learn defenses, spend hours learning different pitchers, plays, etc. I like more realism in my video games, but if I was a good enough football player I'd be playing in the real NFL, you know? I've just realized I'm not as hardcore a sports game fan as some of you. I'm not going to memorize 50 plays for a NBA game. I don't tinker with rosters for hours, f with sliders, etc. I don't spend days agonizing what trades I'm going to do in my dynasty, looking at stats to figure it out. I'm not going to watch video game "tape" to learn the opponents. Pure realism just isn't for me, and I'm realizing that now. I want some things like more incomplete passes, but sometimes the "real thing" just wouldn't be fun in video game form. I don't want a game to become "work" and take hours. Some of the realistic things people like just seem like work to me...I get paid to work, I don't get paid to play games.

Great post. I agree 100%. I want a realistic game, but am by no means hard-core sim like many folks around here. I can't imagine playing 15 minute quarters in a football game, and letting the play clock run down every play to get realistic TOP. Nothing wrong with that, just not my cup of tea.

Ofcourse by admitting this, we are branding ourselves as the dreaded "Casual Gamers" who like NBA Jam type games where guys catch on fire and scores are 6X what they should be. LOL.

[fistofrage]

Quote: Originally Posted by mgoblue

I've said it before...the minute that football, basketball, baseball, etc games become "full simulations" I'll stop playing them. I play games to have fun in my spare time. Real sports you have to watch tape, learn defenses, spend hours learning different pitchers, plays, etc. I like more realism in my video games, but if I was a good enough football player I'd be playing in the real NFL, you know? I've just realized I'm not as hardcore a sports game fan as some of you. I'm not going to memorize 50 plays for a NBA game. I don't tinker with rosters for hours, f with sliders, etc. I don't spend days agonizing what trades I'm going to do in my dynasty, looking at stats to figure it out. I'm not going to watch video game "tape" to learn the opponents. Pure realism just isn't for me, and I'm realizing that now. I want some things like more incomplete passes, but sometimes the "real thing" just wouldn't be fun in video game form. I don't want a game to become "work" and take hours. Some of the realistic things people like just seem like work to me...I get paid to work, I don't get paid to play games.

I understand where you are coming from. My main problem with the next gen games is that they are nlacking things that were on the PS2. That burns me. The other thing is, I do think that the game should be made for casual gamers right out of the box, and then we can adjust sliders to increase penalties, reduce turnovers, etc. The problem is, the sliders don't work on 2k sports or EA games. That is my frustration. I don't care that there are no non-shooting fouls on default in 2k sports, but damnit if I crank the sliders all the way up to 100, give me my fouls. I am not looking for a 100% accurate sim. I just want to get numbers in the ballpark of real life games in some key categories. For football, YPC, Completion %, Turnovers, score, etc. In basketball Shooting %, turnovers, rebounds, etc.

I've complained to no end about the sports games on the 360. But if you look at what I'm complaining about its stuff we already had on the PS2. I laid down hundreds of dollars for my elite, extra controller, games, and accessories. If the games had been even a graphical improvement with just a few minor enhancements to the PS2 version, I would have been happy. But the sports games on the 360, particularily NCAA football(previously my favorite game) are flat out worse than on the PS2. In fact in 2005, 2006, 2007 the only games I purchased on the PS2 without even renting first was NCAA football & college hoops. At this point, I won't even waste $8 renting NCAA football. Its literally 3 years away from getting back to the gameplay and presentation that was on the PS2.