Home

Honest question for those more

This is a discussion on Honest question for those more within the EA Sports College Football and NCAA Football forums.

Go Back   Operation Sports Forums > Football > EA Sports College Football and NCAA Football
MLB The Show 24 Review: Another Solid Hit for the Series
New Star GP Review: Old-School Arcade Fun
Where Are Our College Basketball Video Game Rumors?
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-21-2013, 03:11 PM   #1
Rookie
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Feb 2012
Honest question for those more

Intelligent than I?

How can we not have a more accurate representation of a Saturday in the fall than what we keep getting? Espellially looking at games like Battlefield/cod/gta/skyrim?

Battlefield for example, can produce large open area battles with many different parts working all at the same time, tank battles, helicopters, snipers, jeeps? How can one developer create such an expansive environment & ea/tibirion (sp?) cannot give us stadiums that look & react lifelike, or players that move & react in a realistic manner.

Honestly, I don't see how we can have games like forza & it's photo- realistic visuals on huge tracks & realistic feel to each car, & anywhere cameras & not get a better football game.

Someone who understands the tech side, maybe even a developer chime in & share, I would greatly appreciate it.
Bamanutt is offline  
Reply With Quote
Advertisements - Register to remove
Old 04-21-2013, 04:55 PM   #2
MVP
 
Ziza9Noles94's Arena
 
OVR: 12
Join Date: Jul 2008
Re: Honest question for those more

Those games tend to run on more powerful engines like Unreal.
__________________
I bleed Garnet and Gold. In The 'Slim Reaper' We Trust. Go Noles!
Ziza9Noles94 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 05:05 PM   #3
*ll St*r
 
roadman's Arena
 
OVR: 34
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Midwest
Posts: 26,163
Re: Honest question for those more

I'm not a developer, but most of those games you listed are not made on a yearly sports cycle.
roadman is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 05:07 PM   #4
Rookie
 
NikeBlitz's Arena
 
OVR: 6
Join Date: Feb 2011
Re: Honest question for those more

Forza, GTA, BF or Skyrim are not annual releases.
NikeBlitz is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:06 PM   #5
Rookie
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Feb 2012
Re: Honest question for those more

I totally get the "yearly" cycle thing to some extent, but I think that this game is what, 8 years old?

That's way more time with "their engine" than some of those bigger games. I've heard it's hardware based, but there is no way with some of the games that are out now.

So it's really EA's engine I guess, so will they build new on next gen or just port & polish? Your opinions?
Bamanutt is offline  
Reply With Quote
Advertisements - Register to remove
Old 04-21-2013, 07:13 PM   #6
Rookie
 
smack23011's Arena
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Jun 2012
Re: Honest question for those more

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bamanutt
I totally get the "yearly" cycle thing to some extent, but I think that this game is what, 8 years old?

That's way more time with "their engine" than some of those bigger games. I've heard it's hardware based, but there is no way with some of the games that are out now.

So it's really EA's engine I guess, so will they build new on next gen or just port & polish? Your opinions?
Port and Polish most likely. IE last year was just the tip of what it can do, and this year they fixed it up and next years on the new system it should be worked out and fixed all it's kinks and move on to another engine eventually. As far as in game presentation well im not sure on that. I believe they're just limited to what they can do.
smack23011 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:18 PM   #7
MVP
 
IlluminatusUIUC's Arena
 
OVR: 6
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Mile High Club, CO
Re: Honest question for those more

Even setting aside the yearly release thing (which is a bad argument IMO), COD, BF, Skyrim, etc are not dissected to the same degree that these games are. When was the last time you saw a thread on a COD board complaining that the soldiers didn't need to plant their boots in order to run around the corner? Nobody expects the same level of realism in those games, nor would they want it frankly. In COD, if you are good enough, it is a viable strategy to run around with a sniper rifle and shoot people who are 15 feet away. That's absurdly unrealistic but it makes for fast-moving gameplay.
IlluminatusUIUC is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:48 PM   #8
Dead!
 
CM Hooe's Arena
 
OVR: 45
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Culver City, CA
Posts: 20,945
Re: Honest question for those more

I don't say the following to trivialize any faults in the game or provide an out for Tiburon about anything, but this is my take nevertheless: compared to other sports, making a football game is hard.

A basketball game has few direct player-player interactions (most player-player contact is an illegal foul), has fewer players on the playing surface, fewer set piece plays, and has a less complex rule set. Player differentiation to the user is easier to achieve by applying direct modifiers to the ability of a player to move with the basketball or make a jumpshot.

A soccer game has fewer direct player interactions (most player-player contact is an illegal foul), fewer rules, fewer set piece plays, and though there are 22 players on the field, much of the game involves many of the players standing around, with only a subset of players involved in the success of any given sequence of gameplay. Player differentiation to the user is easier to achieve by applying direct modifiers to the ability of a player to move with the soccer ball, complete a pass, or score a goal.

Hockey is similar to soccer, but with more player-player interactions and fewer actors on the playing surface.

A baseball game has the least direct player-player interactions of all the sports (the only significant player-player contact is at plays at the plate), fewer players on the playing surface, and strictly-defined AI with regard to how defenders should act on a given play (referring to where to throw a ball once in play). Any play in baseball is more-or-less a predetermined reaction to a given set piece; the ball can be hit to a different location, sure, but most often it's ideal to achieve force-outs (with a few exceptions), and always try to prevent runners from reaching home plate. Player differentiation to the user is easier to achieve by applying direct modifiers to the ability of a player to hit a ball with a correctly-timed swing, execute a pitch into the strike zone, or complete a throw to a base.

In a racing game, player-player interaction is minimal as deliberate contact between cars is often considered unsportsmanlike. Optimal racing lines are easy to compute, and difficulty is easy to change via AI tolerance to differentiation from this line, implementation of strategies by which an AI reacts to car-car contact, and ability to maximize car performance. Differentiation of cars to the user is incredibly easy to tune via direction modifiers to car top speed, acceleration, braking power, and handling. There is admittedly potentially an insane amount of complexity in the depth and power of the driving physics model.

A first-person shooter essentially is a real-time free-movement point-and-click adventure game, and as a previous person noted the same level of realism is not expected in an FPS as in a sports game.

Compared to all these, football is hard. The success of a football play for either side is dependent on all 22 actors on the field, and player-player interaction drives the success or failure of any given actor (be it in blocking, WR-DB jostling, breaking tackles, or what have you). Football's rule set is possibly the most complex in all of sports. Football has the greatest number of possible strategies with which to advance downfield given the absurd number of possible plays, any of which could cause a problem for the AI if not implemented or tuned right. Football is a combination of a turn-based strategy game (choosing personnel deployment and alignment before a set piece) and a real-time strategy (any number of different things can happen after a snap; pass? scramble? lateral? change of possession?). Player differentiation to the user is hard because there is no scoring action for a player in possession of the ball other than running; there are no "shots on goal" or "free throws" for example.

Just my $0.02; again, this doesn't excuse any flaws in the game one may deem unacceptable, and this isn't an attempt to trivialize or simplify any other type of video game; making games in general is hard, regardless of genre. I simply submit that making a football game is very hard.

Last edited by CM Hooe; 04-21-2013 at 07:50 PM.
CM Hooe is offline  
Reply With Quote
Reply


« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

« Operation Sports Forums > Football > EA Sports College Football and NCAA Football »


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:53 AM.
Top -