The Gameplay & Defensive Tips Thread

[therizing02]

Since this is a tips thread, I'd like to know how people are stopping this kind of silliness from the CPU. When I read how great the CPU is at attacking I have to laugh, because regardless of the level, Pro, WC, or Legendary, this is how it goes for every team. This first video is Robben dancing through the Real Madrid defense and finding a wide open Mueller for volleyed goal. Pro level



This second video is more of the same type of CPU garbage. The OP of this thread was an insightful post, but the part about contain and sort of push the CPU attackers into other defenders, onto their wrong foot, etc, is nearly impossible. I'd like some tips on how to defend this....

[BL8001]

The first goal is Tactic #2.

But both of those vids, it's clear to see its the coded defending logic that let's you down. You can do what you can do on defense and then there are times like these where you throw your hands up and say No Mas.

Because plain and simple you cannot do this vs the CPU defense. Try to pass it back and forth in the D of the box on the CPU.

You can't and you know why? Because they step out on you and forcibly try to push you away from the goal.

The humans CPU controlled defenders never do this.

[Zac]

Quote: Originally Posted by BL8001

The first goal is Tactic #2. But both of those vids, it's clear to see its the coded defending logic that let's you down. You can do what you can do on defense and then there are times like these where you throw your hands up and say No Mas. Because plain and simple you cannot do this vs the CPU defense. Try to pass it back and forth in the D of the box on the CPU. You can't and you know why? Because they step out on you and forcibly try to push you away from the goal. The humans CPU controlled defenders never do this.

And its very frustrating. It would be so nice if my defenders acted exactly like the other teams defenders. My (your) guys will never give that little quick poke step out tackle to disrupt the attack. Yet they do it to you perfectly every time you attempt to do that same type of quick pass build up in the box.

[wordtobigbird]

Quote: Originally Posted by therizing02

Since this is a tips thread, I'd like to know how people are stopping this kind of silliness from the CPU. When I read how great the CPU is at attacking I have to laugh, because regardless of the level, Pro, WC, or Legendary, this is how it goes for every team. This first video is Robben dancing through the Real Madrid defense and finding a wide open Mueller for volleyed goal. Pro level This second video is more of the same type of CPU garbage. The OP of this thread was an insightful post, but the part about contain and sort of push the CPU attackers into other defenders, onto their wrong foot, etc, is nearly impossible. I'd like some tips on how to defend this....

Not going to pretend I know a lot about this sport or the game because I'm still new to both but I don't have problems defending this stuff. IMO you are giving the CPU wayyy too much space. On the first video you let him run all the way down the sideline before anyone even gets close to him. And then when the ball gets loose why dont you run and try to get it instead of just letting him get it? Once he got that loose ball and the other defender backed off it was a wrap. In the 2nd video, same thing, too much space. They are just passing the ball back and forth in front of you and youre not doing anything. Now I don't know which player you are controlling but you arent putting any pressure on the ball. You are going to have to attack the ball carrier with your player or teammate contain. In the first video, I would have used that midfielder and cut off his sideline run and at least make him cut or pass or something. Or stay close to him and push him into the defender and use teammate contain to double team hi in the corner.

It looks like the defenders are just standing around watching, including whichever one youre using. But if you use one and use teammate command with another there should be at least 2 guys attacking the ball regardless of if the CPU AI does it or not. But if you are going to play like this you definitely need to go into the tactics and change yours. Your defenders will be much more aggressive if you change the settings.

[therizing02]

Quote: Originally Posted by wordtobigbird

Not going to pretend I know a lot about this sport or the game because I'm still new to both but I don't have problems defending this stuff. IMO you are giving the CPU wayyy too much space. On the first video you let him run all the way down the sideline before anyone even gets close to him. And then when the ball gets loose why dont you run and try to get it instead of just letting him get it? Once he got that loose ball and the other defender backed off it was a wrap. In the 2nd video, same thing, too much space. They are just passing the ball back and forth in front of you and youre not doing anything. Now I don't know which player you are controlling but you arent putting any pressure on the ball. You are going to have to attack the ball carrier with your player or teammate contain. In the first video, I would have used that midfielder and cut off his sideline run and at least make him cut or pass or something. Or stay close to him and push him into the defender and use teammate contain to double team hi in the corner. It looks like the defenders are just standing around watching, including whichever one youre using. But if you use one and use teammate command with another there should be at least 2 guys attacking the ball regardless of if the CPU AI does it or not. But if you are going to play like this you definitely need to go into the tactics and change yours. Your defenders will be much more aggressive if you change the settings.

I understand why you would think this. Based on the second video and playing hundreds if not 1000s of games since FIFA 07, I am trying to keep the CPU attackers out of the middle of the pitch because if a CPU player gets the ball at the top of the box you are pretty much done.

So, Robben gets the ball and wants to go down the wing. Fine, I'll contain him all the way to the corner and then make a play on the ball when I get him there. You can see that's what happened. Also, how many times do we as users poke the ball away and it goes back to the CPU player. It has nothing to do with trying to get the ball, because experience tells you you're not going to get that ball because the CPU will always react faster.

I have played close to 50 games at different levels during the trial and through the full release, and so far IMO, this might be the worst edition of this game in years from a CPU attacking and USER defense perspective.

[KG]

Quote: Originally Posted by wordtobigbird

Not going to pretend I know a lot about this sport or the game because I'm still new to both but I don't have problems defending this stuff. IMO you are giving the CPU wayyy too much space. On the first video you let him run all the way down the sideline before anyone even gets close to him. And then when the ball gets loose why dont you run and try to get it instead of just letting him get it? Once he got that loose ball and the other defender backed off it was a wrap. In the 2nd video, same thing, too much space. They are just passing the ball back and forth in front of you and youre not doing anything. Now I don't know which player you are controlling but you arent putting any pressure on the ball. You are going to have to attack the ball carrier with your player or teammate contain. In the first video, I would have used that midfielder and cut off his sideline run and at least make him cut or pass or something. Or stay close to him and push him into the defender and use teammate contain to double team hi in the corner. It looks like the defenders are just standing around watching, including whichever one youre using. But if you use one and use teammate command with another there should be at least 2 guys attacking the ball regardless of if the CPU AI does it or not. But if you are going to play like this you definitely need to go into the tactics and change yours. Your defenders will be much more aggressive if you change the settings.

The problem with the 2nd teammate button is that they take poor angles. You can compensate for this in the middle of the pitch but that close to goal will most likely lead to a 1-on-1 with your keeper. The defending AI of your teammates should help you out a little but and do this for you, especially when you're that close to the box.

Don't even get me started on the CPU Offensive AI. They pass just to pass. No directness at all, especially from Robben who is one of the most direct players in the world.

[FluffyTonka]

Quote: Originally Posted by therizing02

This second video is more of the same type of CPU garbage. The OP of this thread was an insightful post, but the part about contain and sort of push the CPU attackers into other defenders, onto their wrong foot, etc, is nearly impossible. I'd like some tips on how to defend this....

Tactically, you have to slide down on your dpad and get more men beehnd the ball when the CPU are deep in your territory, if you can even select counter attack as a tactic if your buried in your own end. Like I said, you gotta be a little dynamic and constantly change up your tactics this year.


In this video, when the guy on the ball out on the edge of the box, you were controlling the man in front of him. Never do that against good teams, you needed to control the midfielder behind (and goalside to the guy on the ball) then call your help, which would have enabled your defender, and he would have kept in front of the attacker with the ball... get into your jockey stance with your controlled player (the midfielder) and as the off -the-ball CPU attacker makes his run, you need your guy to fill that space and take that option for the cutback pass in.

If the CPU attempts that pass, knock it down with your circle button, or slide right across and kill the pass back into your defenders who are there for the easy clearance.

Once you killed that passing lane, then you could apply pressure and tackle the ball carrier or force him into your defender who would make the tackle.

your left back was already on the flank for the outlet pass and from there if your in counter attack, a lobbed through ball long to your striker, or pass it out onto your winger would have had the ball going the other way.

It's not ice hockey, you don't relentlessly attack the puck carrier, you want to use up the space around the ball carrier, limit or stop his options and then dispossess him or wait for the bad pass into traffic for the turnover.


now all of this is fine for me to say ... but executing is much much harder. Which is what I like about the game. you have to execute for the full 90 minutes and its possible one single lapse is the difference in winning or losing or a draw. pretty realistic imo

Another thing ... the CPU is way to clinical in front of goal. I raised their shot error to 60 (or maybe 65, I should go check) ... They're hitting more woodwork, side of nets and having the complete and utter howler from time to time as well.

To balance up the CPU's advantage on WC level, raising human pass speed to 60 and spd & acc to 53 (for human only) is a must!

Good tactical football basics and a few sliders along with tactics which noticeably work this year, makes it the best football sim since PES 6. hands down.

[Matt10]

I like this thread, but this year we have to take a lot into consideration how important sliders are, and how sensitive the marking value is. Go through a replay and just switch to players, they look at who they are marking.

So you have to choose to either raise marking so there is coverage through the field, or you can leave it low (on default) and rely on man to man marking...all game. That's the issue with Riz's videos - it's not tactics - it's simply the game engine's marking issue.

Riz, I apologize as I know you were testing with my V1 sliders - and those values have since changed in Version 3.