Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

[baa7]

If you're having a problem with this particular issue, try the following: Edit select teams and place select star players on multiple lines.

The sim engine has a tough time simming accurate stats for a number of key players. Crosby, Malkin, Datsyuk and Zetterberg are four examples. Due to inconsistencies in the sim engine, some stars players are lucky to rack up 50-60 points in a season. That in turn is one reason why a team like Detroit will miss the playoffs on a regular basis when you sim a season.

To counteract these sim engine issues, place Crosby as the C on lines 1 and 3, and Malkin as the C on lines 2 and 4. Put Datsyuk and Zetterberg as the C and LW on lines 1 and 3. You can do this for any player of course. But you have to be careful who, as sim stats pretty much pan out correctly for many players. Ovechkin is one example: his stats are fine. If you put him on two lines, he'll win the scoring title by 50 points.

Do it, then run a couple of sim seasons. Check standings and stats and see the difference for yourself. Just keep in mind it's not a complete fix. Detroit and Pittsburgh will still miss the playoffs, even with those guys racking up 100 points a season. But this will give those teams a better chance of reaching the post season, and will definitely improve your scoring leader stats.

[phillyfan23]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

If you're having a problem with this particular issue, try the following: Edit select teams and place select star players on multiple lines.

The sim engine has a tough time simming accurate stats for a number of key players. Crosby, Malkin, Datsyuk and Zetterberg are four examples. Due to inconsistencies in the sim engine, some stars players are lucky to rack up 50-60 points in a season. That in turn is one reason why a team like Detroit will miss the playoffs on a regular basis when you sim a season.

To counteract these sim engine issues, place Crosby as the C on lines 1 and 3, and Malkin as the C on lines 2 and 4. Put Datsyuk and Zetterberg as the C and LW on lines 1 and 3. You can do this for any player of course. But you have to be careful who, as sim stats pretty much pan out correctly for many players. Ovechkin is one example: his stats are fine. If you put him on two lines, he'll win the scoring title by 50 points.

Do it, then run a couple of sim seasons. Check standings and stats and see the difference for yourself. Just keep in mind it's not a complete fix. Detroit and Pittsburgh will still miss the playoffs, even with those guys racking up 100 points a season. But this will give those teams a better chance of reaching the post season, and will definitely improve your scoring leader stats.

these are all good ideas, but how do you know this will help simmed standings. Simmed stats I can definitely see it helping, but my concern is the games I play. So at the 60 th game of the season, it'd be nice seeing both Crosby and Malkin have 80 some points and top 5 in the league, but then if I see the Pens are 7 games under 500, it makes all those efforts of editing pointless.

I'd much rather have inaccurate stats but acurate standings instead of the other way around.

Also, it's not only pittsburgh this is happening to, detroit, boston philadelphia, chicago. So we must edit thse teams too. What happens when you play these teams? You don't want to see crosby and malkin for 40 minutes a game. It's unrealistic and makes them ineffective really. So before and after each game we play these team we have to edit. Just too much work to try to get the game playable.

what happens to the 3rd line center of the penguins.....jordan staal. He might end up with 8 points in the league and he's a very integral part of that team. While this mayu solve the scoring leaders issues, it creates problems in other areas, and it's still not a guarantee that it will solve simmed standings.

If this fixes simmed standings, player stats across the board, I wouldn't have any problems editing lines 20-30 times in a season, but my gut feeling says that this will help scoring leaders, killl 3rd and 4th line players and make very little difference , if any, for simmed standings.

[phillyfan23]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

ok just simmed a season after placing crosby/malkin and datsyuk/zetterberg on the 3rd lines of their teams.

crosby and malkin finished 1st in scoring. They were tied for 1st both with a whopping 158 points. By the way Jordan Staal finished with 6 points.

Zetterberg finished the year with 122 points and datsyuk with 117 points.

Before we were getting too low for these players, now too high.

Next I checked the simmed stadnings for these 2 teams.:

Pit was 4th in the conference
Detroit missed the playoffs by 8 points

I wouldn't care abut the inflated stats if detroit and pittsburgh standings were helped out, but it seems like this idea has no bearing on simmed standings, just scoring stats that's now just too high.

[baa7]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

my gut feeling says...

I just simmed a season with Crosby and Malkin on two lines. Crosby averaged 31 minutes a game. There were two other players (Dmen) with more ice time than Malkin, and he averaged 25 minutes a game. (Last year in the NHL, Crosby averaged 22 minutes per game of ice time, Malkin 22:30.) Malkin ended up third in scoring with 113 points. Crosby was eighth with 101 points. Pittsburgh finished second in the East standings behind Washington.

You could go with your gut, or you could give it a try.

[baa7]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

crosby and malkin finished 1st in scoring. They were tied for 1st both with a whopping 158 points. By the way Jordan Staal finished with 6 points.

My roster is edited. I lowered shot accuracy ratings down so that my sim stats are in line with NHL averages. With the default ratings, there are 400+ extra goals scored in a season than there were in the NHL last year. My edits also reduced assists down to a level that's much closer to NHL totals.

And of course this will help teams make the playoffs. Better players + more points = a greater possibility the team will win games. And no, it doesn't completely fix the screwy sim results, which I mentioned in my first post. That's why I used the word "improve" in the thread title.

[phillyfan23]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

My roster is edited. I lowered shot accuracy ratings down so that my sim stats are in line with NHL averages. With the default ratings, there are 400+ extra goals scored in a season than there were in the NHL last year. My edits also reduced assists down to a level that's much closer to NHL totals.

And of course this will help teams make the playoffs. Better players + more points = a greater possibility the team will win games. And no, it doesn't completely fix the screwy sim results, which I mentioned in my first post. That's why I used the word "improve" in the thread title.

i wish we had roster share for nhl series.....it'd be nice to have what u edited for base rosters if gameplay balance isn't effected.

I just don't want to edit 500 players in the game to get realistic results, if they had global editing, this would take 15-20 minutes. Also, I'm not sure how it will effect the game difficuty so it might not be worth it at all for me.

with regards to your edits, what other players actually need substituting into the 3rd line? if we really look for them, I'm sure great players on bad teams need to be shuffled into their 3rd lines as well. So in essence you're helping both good teams and bad teams into the playoffs. I just think the balance is way off no matter what you do as far as simmed standings are concerned. If there is an improvement, the simmed standings went from an F to a D+. However, I am sure you got the simmed stats down to a tee. I remember reading you were off like 20 goals for total goals compared to last season?

by the way, i just simmed 3 more seasons, and all three seasons had croby,malkin,dats,zett as point leaders. That was expected, but not once in those seasons did detroit and pittsburgh make the playoffs simultaneously.

I see the simmed standings in NBA live 10, and I just cry because this is the only thing preventing me from starting a season.

[Steven547]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

Check out my post in the "Simmed Stats" thread. I ran an experiment by changing just a few ratings and was getting good results, which also affected the team itself.

[Axeshun]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

I don't know why the hell my post didn't go through earlier but basically what I was gonna say is that I'm getting some pretty good results after editing players around the league. I've only tested through the first season so there's no telling how well it'll work later on in a dynasty though.

I know this is a long and grueling process but for me it's perfect because I seldom ever finish a season anyways. I always end going half way and starting a new one so I'd suggest editing the rosters for anyone who plays like me. Basically just create as much disparity between superstars and mediocre/4th liners as you can. It will improve overall stats and standings. I've only done the forwards so far and I'm on to the defensemen next but so far the results are looking quite good.

Good teams are where they're supposed to be, making the playoffs and the garbage/upcoming teams are struggling. Star players are putting up points (too many at one point but I digress).

P.S. I've noticed that putting star players with good linemates DOES make a difference. For example In one season I had Heatley on the second line in SJ and he had around 80-90 points and in the next season I had him with Throton and he hit 150+ points.

[phillyfan23]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

I don't know why the hell my post didn't go through earlier but basically what I was gonna say is that I'm getting some pretty good results after editing players around the league. I've only tested through the first season so there's no telling how well it'll work later on in a dynasty though.

I know this is a long and grueling process but for me it's perfect because I seldom ever finish a season anyways. I always end going half way and starting a new one so I'd suggest editing the rosters for anyone who plays like me. Basically just create as much disparity between superstars and mediocre/4th liners as you can. It will improve overall stats and standings. I've only done the forwards so far and I'm on to the defensemen next but so far the results are looking quite good.

Good teams are where they're supposed to be, making the playoffs and the garbage/upcoming teams are struggling. Star players are putting up points (too many at one point but I digress).

P.S. I've noticed that putting star players with good linemates DOES make a difference. For example In one season I had Heatley on the second line in SJ and he had around 80-90 points and in the next season I had him with Throton and he hit 150+ points.

this is a good idea....because the gameplay will still be balanced. Takes a lot of work, but it would be worth it if there is even more player separation and the standings are fixed.

What formula did you use for the lower rated players?

I'm thinking any player rated over 85 stays the same.
player rated 80-84 gets 3 overall points taken off
76-80 gets 6 overall points taken off
and below 75 get 10 points taken off.

what about goalies? did you leave them alone or also editing was done?

This would work I think because a team like the redwings would have say 50 overall points taken off while the Islanders would have 100 overall points taken off.

gonna take a good week to do this, but if your results are good for the simmed standings, this is something I would do.

[Keirik]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

inserting the obligatory "please EA do something via patch so we dont have to try and do assinine things like this to get realistic sim stats?"



by the way, has anyone ever tried simming just one game at a time and see if that helps sim stats at all, instead of just simming long stretches?

[baa7]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

P.S. I've noticed that putting star players with good linemates DOES make a difference. For example In one season I had Heatley on the second line in SJ and he had around 80-90 points and in the next season I had him with Throton and he hit 150+ points.

LOL, that's almost like cheating. Rearrange all your lines and test how they do until everyone is racking up 80+ points, then start you rseason. Crazy sim engine.

[Axeshun]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

What formula did you use for the lower rated players?

I'm thinking any player rated over 85 stays the same.
player rated 80-84 gets 3 overall points taken off
76-80 gets 6 overall points taken off
and below 75 get 10 points taken off.

what about goalies? did you leave them alone or also editing was done?

This would work I think because a team like the redwings would have say 50 overall points taken off while the Islanders would have 100 overall points taken off.

gonna take a good week to do this, but if your results are good for the simmed standings, this is something I would do.

Actually you're pretty close, here's what I did...

First I compiled a list of the top forwards in the league and separated them in 3 categories, elite, superstar and allstar.

Elite (High 90's): Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin, Kovalchuk etc.

Superstars (85-89): Lecavalier, Richards, Marleau etc.

Allstars/2nd liners (Low 80's): Perry, Hemsky, Havlat, Briere etc.

3rd/4th liners & Goons (70's): Not only does this seperate them from the superstars but it also brings out the depth in some teams like Dallas who'd have Modano on the third line when he's still a decent player or the Red Wings for example.

Also it's not completely necessary but I went out of my way to edit the speeds/accel on the bigger players, guys like Laraque had speeds of 75-80 and I lowered it to 70.

For defensman I'm working on that now and Goalies should be pretty easy so I'll probably be done by later tonight. I'll update you guys with my results.

LOL, that's almost like cheating. Rearrange all your lines and test how they do until everyone is racking up 80+ points, then start you rseason. Crazy sim engine.

Nah I wasn't really cheating actually, it's because the first few sim tests I did were edited ratings but I left the line combination's alone. On the next few I fixed every team in the league so that there lines were accurate as possible and that's when Heatley exploded, lol.

[Axeshun]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

Okay so with all 30 teams edited from forwards, defensemen to goalies I simmed 3 seasons in season mode with these settings..

Control all 30 teams

No trades
No injuries
No assistant coach changes

SEASON 1


EAST

Pittsburgh
Florida
Buffalo
New York R
Ottawa
Boston
New Jersey
New York I

WEST

San Jose
Vancouver
Chicago
Calgary
Dallas
Minnesota
Los Angeles
Colorado

POINTS

1. Kovalchuk - 117
2. Heatley - 113
3. Kopitar - 108
4. Malkin
5. Thorton



SEASON 2

EAST

Pittsburgh
Ottawa
Washington
Philadelphia
Atlanta
New Jersey
Boston
Buffalo

WEST

Vancouver
San Jose
Anaheim
Detroit
Los Angeles
St. Louis
Nashville
Minnesota

POINTS

1. Kovalchuk - 103
2. Heatley - 101
3. Setoguchi - 101
4. Pominville
5. Ovechkin



SEASON 3



EAST

New Jersey
Pittsburgh
Toronto - Wtf!?
Florida
Tampa Bay
New York R
New York I
Boston

WEST

Vancouver
Anaheim
San Jose
St. Louis
Calgary
Nashville
Dallas
Minnesota

POINTS

1. Malkin - 102
2. Heatley - 99
3. Zetterberg - 98
4. Thorton
5. Crosby




Conclusion: I still need to make a few minor tweaks to the players, some strange point leaders at times. From the results of the 3 seasons you'll notice Washington, Philadelphia and Detroit only make the playoffs one time each. I think I need to edit a few players on Detroit and possibly Washington but the one common denominator in all of this is a good goalie... I think we might have been going at this the wrong way. There are many of the weaker teams still making the playoffs ahead of superior teams because they have better goalies.

- Pittsburgh makes the playoffs 3/3 with Fleury rated high 80's.
- New Jersey makes the playoffs 3/3 with the best goalie.
- Boston makes the playoffs 3/3 with a Thomas rated 90.

- Vancouver, San Jose and Minnesota all make the playoffs consistently because..... they have a good goalie.

- Theodore sucks in Washington.
- I think I might have underrated Osgood.


... Thoughts?

[baa7]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

There are many of the weaker teams still making the playoffs ahead of superior teams because they have better goalies.

That's makes sense, good one.

Here's the problem though. Osgood is simply not a top-flight goalie. I spent two hours today sifting through goalie stats from the past two NHL seasons. I re-rated goalies according to a combination of their goals against average and save percentage. Osgood is way down that list. If you bump his ratings up to Thomas/Backstrom/Luongo territory in order to improve sim stats, he'll be unrealistically good in user-cpu games.

[baa7]

Re: Here's how to improve sim standings/stats

On the other hand, the bigger issue here is the sim engine. If it takes upping Osgood's ratings in order to fix the shortcomings with the sim engine, it's probably the best way to go for some.

And I'm doing that already with some of my edits, and with my lineup adjustments. I decided a few days ago that I don't care how I have to fudge things as long as the stats work out as a result. But that's dependent on making sure I don't screw up the gameplay in the process, which is my #1 priority. Raising Osgood's ratings for me is coming close to sacrificing realistic gameplay for sim realism. I'm not sure I'd want to make Osgood unrealistically good, just to ensure Detroit made the playoffs.