What determines a 10-8 grappling round?

[Lauriedr1ver]

Quote: Originally Posted by Good Grappler

No, because half guard isn’t a dominant position. To win a 10-8 from half guard alone, there would need to be significant damage dealt from GnP. Yes, but again, half guard is not a dominant position. So that shouldn’t warrant a 10-8. To win a 10-8 on control time alone, it would have to be from dominant positions. This isn’t very set in stone, and is up for debate. The question here is, at what point am I ineligible from winning a 10-8 round? After 5 sub attempts? After 1 close sub? In my opinion, if even one submission gets to the last gate (near finish), 10-8 should be off the table. And even if the subs never get past the first gate, I should still be ineligible for a 10-8, if they attempt say 3 or more. But again, this isn’t clear even in real life judging. This should take the 10-8 off the table. If we’re talking CONTROL ALONE, then there should be way less tolerance for error. A single close sub should be enough to move it from 10-8 to 10-9. IMO, winning a 10-8 on control alone should require a complete shut out - one rock, one near sub, it’s a 10-9. Basically, to win a 10-8 round using JUST control - without any significant damage or subs - the margin for error should be extremely strict. Even one mistake should bump that 10-8 to a 10-9. Just one near sub should make you ineligible for a 10-8. However, if the fighter doesn’t make any mistakes, and avoids all damage, then it should certainly be possible to win a 10-8 round on control alone, assuming there’s sufficient control time and positional dominance. Whereas if GnP and sub attempts are also being used, the criteria for a 10-8 should be more lenient, because you’re able to “even out” any damage you absorb with damage of your own. Because theoretically, you can get hurt and end up in 10-9 territory, but land some GnP and move back into 10-8 territory before the rounds over.

Only disagreement I have is if someone gets a close sub versus control alone they should win the round. As they have done more to contribute to the end of the fight than you have and therefore should win 10-9.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by Lauriedr1ver

Only disagreement I have is if someone gets a close sub versus control alone they should win the round. As they have done more to contribute to the end of the fight than you have and therefore should win 10-9.

So in that second example, you think the person who attempts the sub with 30 seconds should win the round?


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[Lauriedr1ver]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

So in that second example, you think the person who attempts the sub with 30 seconds should win the round? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

Close subs as in last gates are akin to knockdowns etc irl. Wouldnt you agree?

[Good Grappler]

Quote: Originally Posted by Lauriedr1ver

Only disagreement I have is if someone gets a close sub versus control alone they should win the round. As they have done more to contribute to the end of the fight than you have and therefore should win 10-9.

Yes - if it was an otherwise close round. But we’re talking about 10-8 rounds.

In other words, assume fighter A has done everything right, and is en route to winning a 10-8 grappling round. Then in the last 30 seconds, fighter B gets super close with a submission attempt.

The near sub should drop the score from 10-8 to 10-9, but it shouldn’t cost fighter A the round entirely (assuming it would’ve been a 10-8 had the sub not occured). Fighter A should still win the round 10-9.

I mean, winning a 10-8 grappling round on control alone would have to have some pretty strict criteria, right? You’re not using GnP, you’re not doing any major damage. So you’d have to have an almost PERFECT round to win a 10-8 on control alone. One mistake - like a close sub - is enough to bump that 10-8 off the table.

Basically, to win a 10-8 round on control alone, you can’t get caught in a near sub.

Now if fighter A was winning a 10-9 round, then I can see an argument for a close sub costing the round entirely. But we’re talking 10-8s here.

[Good Grappler]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

So in that second example, you think the person who attempts the sub with 30 seconds should win the round? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

Only if the person caught in the sub was en route to winning a 10-9 round.

If they were winning a 10-8 round, it shouldn’t cost the round entirely. Bump it down to 10-9, sure. But from 10-8 to 9-10 would be too drastic.

A good, simply way to look at it is this:

Close subs can win close rounds, and they can change 10-8s to 10-9s. But they can’t change 10-8s to 9-10s.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by Lauriedr1ver

Close subs as in last gates are akin to knockdowns etc irl. Wouldnt you agree?

I agree with GG’s take. If he’s dominating in the ground for 4:30 and it’s a 10-8 round, a close sub should move it to a 10-9 for the guy on top. One close sub shouldn’t negate 4:30 seconds of domination.


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[Lauriedr1ver]

Quote: Originally Posted by Good Grappler

Yes - if it was an otherwise close round. But we’re talking about 10-8 rounds. In other words, assume fighter A has done everything right, and is en route to winning a 10-8 grappling round. Then in the last 30 seconds, fighter B gets super close with a submission attempt. The near sub should drop the score from 10-8 to 10-9, but it shouldn’t cost fighter A the round entirely (assuming it would’ve been a 10-8 had the sub not occured). Fighter A should still win the round 10-9. I mean, winning a 10-8 grappling round on control alone would have to have some pretty strict criteria, right? You’re not using GnP, you’re not doing any major damage. So you’d have to have an almost PERFECT round to win a 10-8 on control alone. One mistake - like a close sub - is enough to bump that 10-8 off the table. Basically, to win a 10-8 round on control alone, you can’t get caught in a near sub. Now if fighter A was winning a 10-9 round, then I can see an argument for a close sub costing the round entirely. But we’re talking 10-8s here.

Let's compared this to fighting on the feet, a counter punches is getting out punched and has little to no offence causing a 10-8 round in his oppenents favour. But in the last 30 seconds he lands a clean shot and drops his oppenent badly but be manages to survive the round. Doesn't that no sway the round due to him almost finishing the fight?

[Lauriedr1ver]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

I agree with GG’s take. If he’s dominating in the ground for 4:30 and it’s a 10-8 round, a close sub should move it to a 10-9 for the guy on top. One close sub shouldn’t negate 4:30 seconds of domination. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I think its clearly a case of a round sway as he is do I far more to contribute to the end of a fight than his oppenent, if it was bad gnp it would be differnt as damage is the most important category.