Transition based submissions

[johnmangala]

Quote: Originally Posted by VitoBurrito

Transition based submissions would be great if a different company made this game. It will be a glitch filled mess like always if ea was to add something like this

Idk EA did well with the striking imo. If they applied the same effort with grappling it would be good.

My worry is they leave subs untouched or just another mini game.

[DCowboys22]

It’s the most natural progression of the sub system that I can think of. The original EA MMA system was the best sub system to-date.

But a properly implemented, well-thought out transition system, along with an in depth tutorial mode on how it works, will blow anything previously done out of the water.

Imagine not having a giant graphic pop up, imagine not having play a mini game that removes immersion, imagine being able to apply the same grappling skills you’ve used and worked on to apply chokes and limb submissions.

It’s the ultimate

[SMOKEZERO]

Quote: Originally Posted by DCowboys22

It’s the most natural progression of the sub system that I can think of. The original EA MMA system was the best sub system to-date. But a properly implemented, well-thought out transition system, along with an in depth tutorial mode on how it works, will blow anything previously done out of the water. Imagine not having a giant graphic pop up, imagine not having play a mini game that removes immersion, imagine being able to apply the same grappling skills you’ve used and worked on to apply chokes and limb submissions. It’s the ultimate

Sure, but would you really want to hold the stick in various directions 4 more times, just like position passing, to sink in a rnc? No matter how you feel about the submission mini game, that’s closer to the struggle of actually passing guard/half guard than the hold the stick in the direction system. I have zero confidence in a hudless system to deliver strategy or precision.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[johnmangala]

Quote: Originally Posted by SMOKEZERO

Sure, but would you really want to hold the stick in various directions 4 more times, just like position passing, to sink in a rnc? No matter how you feel about the submission mini game, that’s closer to the struggle of actually passing guard/half guard than the hold the stick in the direction system. I have zero confidence in a hudless system to deliver strategy or precision. Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

Yeah it’d be more fun than staring at the gates, breaking immersion with the giant overlay.

I think the gate mechanism can be retooled to be HUDless like I suggested earlier. You just feel a rumble when you match their transition direction.

[SMOKEZERO]

Quote: Originally Posted by johnmangala

Yeah it’d be more fun than staring at the gates, breaking immersion with the giant overlay. I think the gate mechanism can be retooled to be HUDless like I suggested earlier. You just feel a rumble when you match their transition direction.

The rumble feature itself, is best to support the onscreen action, not be the vehicle driving the gameplay mechanic. The whole, “you could close your eyes and defend a submission” approach is a risky undertaking.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[johnmangala]

Quote: Originally Posted by SMOKEZERO

The rumble feature itself, is best to support the onscreen action, not be the vehicle driving the gameplay mechanic. The whole, “you could close your eyes and defend a submission” approach is a risky undertaking. Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

You’d still get your HUD action with my idea if you wanted. The grip/sub meter replaces the giant overlay. It just be in the top corner along with the other meters. Only difference is when you play without your HUD you can still gauge yourself with the rumble.

[DCowboys22]

Quote: Originally Posted by SMOKEZERO

Sure, but would you really want to hold the stick in various directions 4 more times, just like position passing, to sink in a rnc? No matter how you feel about the submission mini game, that’s closer to the struggle of actually passing guard/half guard than the hold the stick in the direction system. I have zero confidence in a hudless system to deliver strategy or precision. Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

Short answer: Yes.

Long Answer: Maybe not 4 transitions for a RNC, but 2, followed by a squeeze mechanic such as EA MMA’s rhythmic button mash.

Especially in comparison to a giant overlay. While that system might simulate the idea of trying to wriggle out of chokes, it’s not at all fun or satisfying. And the elephant in the room - it completely removes you from the fight in every way. Visual, controller input, etc. it’s a complete random left turn away from the game.

Think about the recent Alexei Oleinik fight this weekend. He had a scarf-hold choke on Maurice Greene. He had to smartly squeeze and apply pressure, he had to decide “do I go all out for the sub here or play it safe so I don’t blow my arms out?”

With a decent button mash squeeze “end stage” of the transition system, that becomes a real decision in the game. And to get to that end stage, it took real transition work.

[johnmangala]

Quote: Originally Posted by DCowboys22

Short answer: Yes. Long Answer: Maybe not 4 transitions for a RNC, but 2, followed by a squeeze mechanic such as EA MMA’s rhythmic button mash. Especially in comparison to a giant overlay. While that system might simulate the idea of trying to wriggle out of chokes, it’s not at all fun or satisfying. And the elephant in the room - it completely removes you from the fight in every way. Visual, controller input, etc. it’s a complete random left turn away from the game. Think about the recent Alexei Oleinik fight this weekend. He had a scarf-hold choke on Maurice Greene. He had to smartly squeeze and apply pressure, he had to decide “do I go all out for the sub here or play it safe so I don’t blow my arms out?” With a decent button mash squeeze “end stage” of the transition system, that becomes a real decision in the game. And to get to that end stage, it took real transition work.

I think if the devs use the current sub animations we could get a version of TBS for UFC 4. I doubt we’ll get a full TBS for UFC 4 but maybe we still get something along those lines... HUDless subs.

The only new animations would be the striking in and out of subs, where the rhythmic button mashing would fit in appropriately. I think the actual transitioning should remain like the transitions we have now on the Joystick -> hold a direction until it fills. Only difference is you block transitions by matching their direction.. shortened recovery frames for denying transitions.

Minor transition: Hold a direction until filled, rumble lets you know if you hit the spot to block the transition. Safer but slowly fills or depletes the grip meter.
Major transition: Swoops while the opponent tries to minor transition and you fill/deplete the grip meter. Mistime it and you lose the same amount which would be a lot.