Opinions on head movement?

[ZombieRommel]

What do you think of its current implementation in-game? Love it? Hate it? What would you change? Be sure to note if you're a Fight Night player or not in your comment.

Note: Don't read into this. I'm just personally interested in community opinion and this topic doesn't get discussed often.

[SUGATA]

EA UFC 2 Sway PROS (save it):
1) FWD add GA, BWD add GDA
2) FWD add received dmg bonus
3) BWD add received Body dmg bonus

GDA - grapple DIS advantage
GA - grapple advantage

EA UFC 2 Sway CONS (needs to be to fixed):
1) Bug which is breaking counter strike after Sway:
http://www.operationsports.com/forum...way-click.html
2) Control input issues which restricts its fast and tight usage:
http://www.operationsports.com/forum...2-how-fix.html
3) Strike tracking against Sways needs to be nerfed to buff sway.
4) Needs to buff Left/Right sway effeciency - must to become a tool for evading half circular Head strikes if away the strike.
+
must to get received dmg bonus (like 1.10 lunges) is toward the strike.
5) Needs to allow Sway strike (sway off strike) - strike from sway position, w/o (as we have now) returning to initial state and only then strike begins, which opens us for getting hit from follow up opponent's strike = difficult to counter from sway successfully).
6) Make quicker initial startup animation of Sway (more evasive on start).

[zeric]

It's pretty bad. Lean back is especially broken. Strikes should only be avlided by the lean back, if you initiate the leanback as, or after they throw their strike. So if they are already leaning back, they should get hit by incoming strikes.

[King_Clarke1]

Quote: Originally Posted by ZombieRommel

What do you think of its current implementation in-game? Love it? Hate it? What would you change? Be sure to note if you're a Fight Night player or not in your comment. Note: Don't read into this. I'm just personally interested in community opinion and this topic doesn't get discussed often.

I loved the Fight Night series (and the Knockout Kings games) and played them quite a bit. I was number 4 in HW OWC for FNC and number 5 HW in FNR4. I relied heavily on head movement to beat most people I played against.

In UFC 2 I do not use the head sway function that often due to the lack of precise rotational movement. The sway in this game (and its predecessor) forces you to either be completely crouched forward, leaning straight back or absolutely left or right. I like to occupy the space between these positions... and you simply can not do that effectively in this game.

In FNC I used to strike off of the sway (aka roy jones) but in this game it feels like I have to wait for the sway animation to stop before I can strike competently. I have seen people strike off of the sway in this game; however, it does not look very clean.

[Yaari]

It's been a while since I played but there didn't really seem to be a reason to use anything other than leaning backwards?

I'm happy they went with the free movement like we had in the Fight Night games. That was great. But I'd like it to be a little better balanced.

[SUGATA]

What is the most usable sway? Bwd
How often you use others direction sways especially left right? Rare
I have an idea how to bring balance and depth into all sways:
1) BWD sway - main defensive sway
+ the only Sway that maintain evasive properties against several follow up strikes by just keep holding Sway (other sways evades only one strike or 2 fast jabs, then strikes are tracking holder sway)
+ evade all head strikes
- get increased body damage from all body strikes
- gain GDA
- has slowest sway off strike speed (no boosted strike, for Boosted name check my Boosted strike mechanics thread)
2) FWD sway - offensive defense
+ evade all head strikes except riding up like Uppercut
+ gain GA
+ has faster sway off strike speed (half boosted strike)
- get increased body and head damage from all body strikes and rising up head strikes appropriately.
3) Left/right sway - best offensive sway
+ evade all head strikes except half circular on sway side
+ has the fastest sway off strike speed (boosted strike)
- no effect on GA/GDA
- get increased body and head damage especially (even more no) from half circular strike from sway side.

4) Side steps:
+ evade all head or body strikes except half circular strikes from the sway side
+ boosted strikes after side step
- get increased received dmg bonus from side step side opponent's half circular strike or full circular spinning strike.

5) BWD dash:
+ evade ALL strikes
- gain GDA

6) FWD dash:
- no evades at all
+ boosted strikes
- getting increased head or body dmg during dash
- gain GA


Resume: any sway type and side step and dashes will have their own pros and cons and their own usage strategy > more gameplay depth and yomi to read learn anticipate and then counter opponent

[Boiler569]

I definitely use the back sway in UFC 2 as it can be quite useful and you can counter off it in spectacular fashion --- but no real reason to sway side to side --- I used to occasionally learn forward to gain GA, but I don't risk that much anymore due to the higher damage for leaning forward.

UFC 2 had much better head movement than UFC 1 and EA MMA --- why? --- you can CONTROL when you move (it's not a canned, pre-scripted animation). That means everything to me; when you fight against top guys you need to be in as much control as possible, rather than relying on the computer or locking yourself into an uninteruptable action.

All that said ---- UFC 2 still has a longgggg way to go compared to Fight Night, which had superior head movement for a few reasons:

* HIT DETECTION --- simply put, the hit detection during head movement (and even in general) needs some big time help for UFC 3. If hit detection isn't 95%+ accurate (i.e. Result of Strike matches the Animation you see on the screen) --- it really hurts.

This isn't *just* in terms of complicated head sways interacting with varied strikes, and registering accurately.

For example, in UFC 2 --- if you sway backwards --- you are nearly invulnerable to the first uppercut/hook or two to the body.

Yes, kicks to the body, straights and jabs, and sometimes uppercuts/hooks will connect...but lots of the times, if you sway backwards, hit detection to your body glitches out, giving you too much of a benefit

They amped up damage to someone who is leaning back to help compensate, which was legit, but the underlying problem remains.


*More diverse head movement --- hard to explain, but it seems that the options for head movement are quite limited in UFC 2. You can go left, right, forward, backward, but there aren't really 'in-between' positions.

Not that in-between positions might necessarily matter, if the hit detection isn't on point


* FORWARD MOVING head movement --- if you played Fight Night you likely remember being able to 'move forward' while moving your head off the centerline --- i.e. bob and weave.

Now, this WAS a canned, pre-scripted animation, so you lost your ability to 'adjust' mid stream. BUT to make up for that lack of control, it allowed you to MOVE FORWARD and CLOSE THE DISTANCE while also moving your head.

This is the most important aspect of head movement that UFC 3 needs to represent, in my opinion!

As Frazier vs. Ali, Foreman, Lenox Lewis --- I never would have had a CHANCE to compete, if I didn't have the forward-moving head movement mechanic.

Everyone talks about how lunging strikes need to be implemented/improved (I agree) --- but head movement to close the distance = more important

[King_Clarke1]

Quote: Originally Posted by Boiler569

I definitely use the back sway in UFC 2 as it can be quite useful and you can counter off it in spectacular fashion --- but no real reason to sway side to side --- I used to occasionally learn forward to gain GA, but I don't risk that much anymore due to the higher damage for leaning forward. UFC 2 had much better head movement than UFC 1 and EA MMA --- why? --- you can CONTROL when you move (it's not a canned, pre-scripted animation). That means everything to me; when you fight against top guys you need to be in as much control as possible, rather than relying on the computer or locking yourself into an uninteruptable action. All that said ---- UFC 2 still has a longgggg way to go compared to Fight Night, which had superior head movement for a few reasons: * HIT DETECTION --- simply put, the hit detection during head movement (and even in general) needs some big time help for UFC 3. If hit detection isn't 95%+ accurate (i.e. Result of Strike matches the Animation you see on the screen) --- it really hurts. This isn't *just* in terms of complicated head sways interacting with varied strikes, and registering accurately. For example, in UFC 2 --- if you sway backwards --- you are nearly invulnerable to the first uppercut/hook or two to the body. Yes, kicks to the body, straights and jabs, and sometimes uppercuts/hooks will connect...but lots of the times, if you sway backwards, hit detection to your body glitches out, giving you too much of a benefit They amped up damage to someone who is leaning back to help compensate, which was legit, but the underlying problem remains. *More diverse head movement --- hard to explain, but it seems that the options for head movement are quite limited in UFC 2. You can go left, right, forward, backward, but there aren't really 'in-between' positions. Not that in-between positions might necessarily matter, if the hit detection isn't on point * FORWARD MOVING head movement --- if you played Fight Night you likely remember being able to 'move forward' while moving your head off the centerline --- i.e. bob and weave. Now, this WAS a canned, pre-scripted animation, so you lost your ability to 'adjust' mid stream. BUT to make up for that lack of control, it allowed you to MOVE FORWARD and CLOSE THE DISTANCE while also moving your head. This is the most important aspect of head movement that UFC 3 needs to represent, in my opinion! As Frazier vs. Ali, Foreman, Lenox Lewis --- I never would have had a CHANCE to compete, if I didn't have the forward-moving head movement mechanic. Everyone talks about how lunging strikes need to be implemented/improved (I agree) --- but head movement to close the distance = more important

Totally agree. Co-signed 100%