CATCH PUNCH into Clinch by Parry for EA UFC 3

[fishingtime]

Quote: Originally Posted by Dave_S

I think a parry giving you clinch is terrible idea. clinch is already terrible at times.

The option to do this makes your opponent weary about striking mindlessly. Things like this are why Undisputed was so great. The games were more balanced than people thought.

[Dave_S]

Quote: Originally Posted by fishingtime

The option to do this makes your opponent weary about striking mindlessly. Things like this are why Undisputed was so great. The games were more balanced than people thought.

Than go play undisputed. So people thought they weren't balanced, but they were because fish says so?

To be honest I'm tired of hearing how great the old UFC games were, people have been bringing it up since first ea UFC game.

If the old games were so great then just play those. This is EA UFC.

People just like to eat member berries.

[ZombieRommel]

Sugata,

I really enjoy most of your threads. You are very thoughtful and logical, and you make sure to really test mechanics before you comment on them.

However, I do not believe adding punch catch into clinch would be a good thing. As others have stated, the clinch is already annoying and arguably OP at high levels of play. People don't need MORE ways to enter clinch, especially ways where incurred risk is minimal. You do not want to create a meta that is too rewarding of turtles...look at the current state of For Honor if you want to know how a turtle meta can negatively affect a game.

I like your kick check idea, but the punch catch into clinch would punish offense too hard. I also disagree that the current parries are "ok." In my opinion the current parries are wretched, and the previous rule from UFC1 where getting hit temporarily disabled parries benefited the game and should have made its way to UFC2.

[Kenetic NRG]

If you can parry and go into the clinch I would never throw a single strike again. Just sit there and wait for one parry and then hold people until they break their disc.

[fishingtime]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kenetic NRG

If you can parry and go into the clinch I would never throw a single strike again. Just sit there and wait for one parry and then hold people until they break their disc.

How is it any different than holding someone on the ground? Since it is standing though..........

[SUGATA]

Quote: Originally Posted by ZombieRommel

Sugata, I really enjoy most of your threads. You are very thoughtful and logical, and you make sure to really test mechanics before you comment on them. However, I do not believe adding punch catch into clinch would be a good thing. As others have stated, the clinch is already annoying and arguably OP at high levels of play. People don't need MORE ways to enter clinch, especially ways where incurred risk is minimal. You do not want to create a meta that is too rewarding of turtles...look at the current state of For Honor if you want to know how a turtle meta can negatively affect a game. I like your kick check idea, but the punch catch into clinch would punish offense too hard. I also disagree that the current parries are "ok." In my opinion the current parries are wretched, and the previous rule from UFC1 where getting hit temporarily disabled parries benefited the game and should have made its way to UFC2.

1) Current Clinch has many issues, more details in my thread mentioned above.
I am sure Clinch will be more balanced in UFC 3.

2) Getting into Clinch via Catch punch is a way for short reach fighters to close the distance and take their own game.
Long reach fighters poking is much worse than Clinch and restricts fighters choice and diversity in online.

3) For Honor turtle problem w Parry is because there are no counter for counter (yomi 3rd level).
Possible counter to Catch punch is extra dmg (counter window) for getting hit during Parry attempt. This will bring balance to Parry - high risk/high reward.

4) Kick check details are just a description of already presented mechanics in UFC2. We have it now, and I don't see catching kicks often btw, which means it is balanced.
Catch kicks is a tool to go on Ground for wrestlers and bjj. And no one complain about it, why? B/c ground is balanced.
But we don't have tool to go into Clinch for Judokas now, so Judokas are the most nerfed fighters and this is wrong.
Cure the cause not the results!

5) Countering Punch via deflect into Clinch - is one of the most common way to get into Clinch IRL in boxing and any other fighting or self defense style. We want SIM, not arcade. Catch punch into Clinch is all about SIM.


Dudes, I am always for constructive criticism b/c it helps to evolve the idea.
But please post your arguments.
1. Clinch is OP and unbalanced in UFC2 so no more getting into Clinch moves for UFC3.... I think better to make Clinch more balanced in UFC3.
2. Parry is not ok now after all patches in UFC2. Please tell me why do you think so?
3. I don't know even one who complain about ability to Catch punch into Clinch in UFC UD, no one... and as many said the Stand up Striking is that one thing which is better in UD.



WAYS TO DEAL WITH CATCH PUNCH in UFC 3:
1) Check your stamina all the time - play safer w/o too long combos or with too powerful strikes which leaves you low on stamina so catchable
Or vice versa go to crucial damage but with higher risk to be catched into clinch.

2) Check your hands health - your hands are too damaged from strikes' blocking, dont rush to begin your striking, take a brief to recover.

3) Anticipate opponent's parry level and counter his parry by another level strike to deal increased damage - the same as we have now with countering side steps or sways by incoming strikes and dealing increased dmg b/c of momentum.

4) Check opponent's stamina - he is low on stamina = his parry window is much shorter, so more difficult to perform successful parry for him.

5) Use Feints (check my NEW Feints mechanics thread) with boosted (speed up) followed strike - to bait him to Parry and just he mistimed it counter strike him with increased damage bonus.

6) If devs will implement some Momentum scenarious for the catched opponent just after the catch - this will add a depth to Clinch also (for ex, momentum to Break clinch w increased GA will force the parry man to be ready to deny it, this is opportunity to miss the deny for him and so gives you an undeniable transition for 2 sec).

7) Jumping or full spinning punches are not catchable (will be the same evade as w full stamina).

[fishingtime]

Quote: Originally Posted by SUGATA

1. Clinch is OP and unbalanced in UFC2 so no more getting into Clinch moves for UFC3.... I think better to make Clinch more balanced in UFC3.

This is the right response. Sad to see a GC complain about something like this. I can see taking some things out, but not a whole position. I don't see how the clinch is any different than the ground. If someone is good at denying, that is actually skill.

[SUGATA]

Quote: Originally Posted by fishingtime

This is the right response. Sad to see a GC complain about something like this. I can see taking some things out, but not a whole position. I don't see how the clinch is any different than the ground. If someone is good at denying, that is actually skill.

The most frustrating moment about the Clinch is that it uses THE SAME Dynamic grappling mechanics (DGM) as Ground game, but uses ONLY 50% of DGM elements. I think this is because of the lack of time in developing UFC 2:
http://www.operationsports.com/forum...-fix-them.html

It needs to be fixed in UFC 3.
UFC 2 was an evolution of the Ground game. UFC 3 must to be an evolution of Stand up and Clinch to succeed.