Why is the clinch a death sentence?

[DrawkD2]

One missed transition or strike is devastating. I've played too many matches utterly dominating someone standing and take 1 single clinch elbow and get rocked. One transition block and your stamina is shot. Am I missing something here?

[johnmangala]

I don't know if the devs will ever address it. But yeah, this is a issue to most.

Knees or elbows in Muay Thai Clinch cause clinch breaks from 1 hit, but punches don't do anything after several.

It should be around ~2-3 for knees & elbows and ~3-4 punches in MT. ~3-4 for elbows & knees and ~4-5 punches in single collar, imo.

[TheGentlemanGhost]

The clinch striking is not balanced at all or close to realistic at all. The striking shouldn't be any less balanced than basic stand up. There should not be this incentive or even thought that spamming clinch can give you an edge if you are losing the stand up game unless you're Killa Bee Saunders or Overeem maybe. People spam it just because it's such a great equalizer if they can't do enough damage in stand up. It's so lopsided and makes no sense to me, it's sooo irritating to see people use it just to try and get that one elbow or knee that can kill you.

[ZHunter1990]

The knee's and elbows cause a rock but they aren't really fight ending. If the knee's and elbows didnt rock you and break you out of the clinch, they'd be even more powerful because more elbows and knee's would land to cause a critical KD or KO.

[Freshly Baked Gregg]

Quote: Originally Posted by ZHunter1990

The knee's and elbows cause a rock but they aren't really fight ending. If the knee's and elbows didnt rock you and break you out of the clinch, they'd be even more powerful because more elbows and knee's would land to cause a critical KD or KO.

Enough of them will end a fight. It’s a very cheap way of getting an easy rock. VERY CHEAP.


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[johnmangala]

Quote: Originally Posted by ZHunter1990

The knee's and elbows cause a rock but they aren't really fight ending. If the knee's and elbows didnt rock you and break you out of the clinch, they'd be even more powerful because more elbows and knee's would land to cause a critical KD or KO.

They definitely can end a fight. That isn't really the issue, the issue is how how low-risk high-reward it is. Just one clean hit for a knee or elbow causes a health event/clinch break. You get caught by that 3-4x and the fight is finished.

Knees and elbows should 'rock/stun/wobble' you, most here will agreee. What most are asking for is having it take more shots to stun you from MT knees or elbows instead of just 1 hit.

Should be imo ~2-3 clean knees or elbows and ~3-4 punches in MT to break the clinch. ~4-5 knees or elbows and ~5-6 punches in single collar.
That is a reasonable and realistic request.

Clinch punches should be even harder to cause clinch breaks/stuns but they should be possible as they are irl. It has important functions that's missing from the game like punching out of the clinch:

[ZHunter1990]

Just checked, the elbow does around 15% short term damage and the knee does around 20% short term damage and both give light rocks.

Lets say the first elbow or knee didnt break the clinch with a rock. You'd have to eat 3 to get rocked. Youre in a much worse position with either really low head health while rocked, or you get critically KD'd.

The light rock and clinch break after one strike actually saves you.

I have not had a single match where I have lost due to clinch rocks or even had the tides turn due to clinch rocks besides the body knee, which generally takes more than one to rock you.

[johnmangala]

Quote: Originally Posted by ZHunter1990

Just checked, the elbow does around 15% short term damage and the knee does around 20% short term damage and both give light rocks. Lets say the first elbow or knee didnt break the clinch with a rock. You'd have to eat 3 to get rocked. Youre in a much worse position with either really low head health while rocked, or you get critically KD'd. The light rock and clinch break after one strike actually saves you. I have not had a single match where I have lost due to clinch rocks or even had the tides turn due to clinch rocks besides the body knee, which generally takes more than one to rock you.

You could balance it by having the strikes in the clinch do less damage overall. So the damage threshold for a rock could be the same- just the number of hits it takes to reach that point would differ.

Since it seems you are arguing for the one hit clinch breaks for knees and elbows, what is the issue in having punches break the clinch? The arguments you are giving now sound similar to the arguments that were presented against head movement stamina tax.