For the record people.

[Rekkapryde]

Quote: Originally Posted by LIGHTNING

EA had begged the NFL for YEARS to get an exclusive license for video football games. The loss in market share for Madden 2005 so shocked the EA big wigs that they paniced and offered a HUGE amount of money for the NFL license for the purpose of eliminating competition and the NFL finally accepted it due to greed.

EXACTLY, even though no one here can "prove it", it makes total sense. That's what happened. Point Blank. EA execs felt they had to do whatever they could to save their football game and their breadwinner.

[coogrfan]

Quote: Originally Posted by Rekkapryde

EXACTLY, even though no one here can "prove it", it makes total sense. That's what happened. Point Blank. EA execs felt they had to do whatever they could to save their football game and their breadwinner.

Save it from what? For crying out loud, guys, Madden 2005 outsold 2k5 despite a later release date and a higher initial price tag. Does that sound like a franchise that needs "saving"?

You admit you have no proof to back up your interpretation of the EA-NFL deal, and then in the next breath you state that nonetheless it is a fact. That sounds an awful lot like some of the Southern Baptists I grew up with. I am therefore withdrawing from this discussion, because it's as pointless to continue to debate with the true believers as it would be with a fundamentalist.

[Rekkapryde]

Quote: Originally Posted by coogrfan

Save it from what? For crying out loud, guys, Madden 2005 outsold 2k5 despite a later release date and a higher initial price tag. Does that sound like a franchise that needs "saving"? You admit you have no proof to back up your interpretation of the EA-NFL deal, and then in the next breath you state that nonetheless it is a fact. That sounds an awful lot like some of the Southern Baptists I grew up with. I am therefore withdrawing from this discussion, because it's as pointless to continue to debate with the true believers as it would be with a fundamentalist.

Maybe "save" isn't the right word, but you can't deny that EA execs were definitely "concerned". To go from a 90% marketshare to 60% in one year is definitely huge. Gag me with the philosophical debates because if Madden outsold its competition and had over 80 % of the market, the deal doesn't happen IMO.

[spankdatazz22]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

Being upset doesn't mean always finding someone specific to point blame at. It often means you just have to deal with it.

It doesn't always, but usually it does. What's wrong w/people voicing their displeasure with the deal? No, Superman isn't going to reverse the Earth's rotation and we go back in time. We're doing nothing but discussing differing points of view. Some of us choose to look at this as it affects us, not the "great business move EA!" view that others are using. As someone else alluded to in another post, gaming is escapism. Yes, it's big business - for the people making money off it. Not the case with me, and I assume most people on these boards. Why wouldn't we feel the need to discuss an issue we're not happy about? If EA had lost the exclusive license, I'd damn sure expect a lot worse from Madden fans. But fans in general should just "deal with it"? C'mon.

I agree w/your Yankees/EA analogy; most would make the same connection. And why do many people hate the Yankees? Because they have more money than anyone else, and essentially try to buy a championship every year. That's why people have taken so much pleasure to them losing in the World Series to teams that have outworked them. As for rules... in the videogame world, the rules are there ain't no rules. So don't think it could be said EA's simply working within the rules, because there really aren't any. I also think people feel a general sadness that we're heading into an era where game development should be limitless, yet we're probably going to be more limited than ever in terms of choice. I just don't see why people should be expected to sit back, bend over and enjoy it.

[Rocky]

Quote: Originally Posted by spankdatazz22

It doesn't always, but usually it does. What's wrong w/people voicing their displeasure with the deal? No, Superman isn't going to reverse the Earth's rotation and we go back in time. We're doing nothing but discussing differing points of view. Some of us choose to look at this as it affects us, not the "great business move EA!" view that others are using. As someone else alluded to in another post, gaming is escapism. Yes, it's big business - for the people making money off it. Not the case with me, and I assume most people on these boards. Why wouldn't we feel the need to discuss an issue we're not happy about? If EA had lost the exclusive license, I'd damn sure expect a lot worse from Madden fans. But fans in general should just "deal with it"? C'mon. I agree w/your Yankees/EA analogy; most would make the same connection. And why do many people hate the Yankees? Because they have more money than anyone else, and essentially try to buy a championship every year. That's why people have taken so much pleasure to them losing in the World Series to teams that have outworked them. As for rules... in the videogame world, the rules are there ain't no rules. So don't think it could be said EA's simply working within the rules, because there really aren't any. I also think people feel a general sadness that we're heading into an era where game development should be limitless, yet we're probably going to be more limited than ever in terms of choice. I just don't see why people should be expected to sit back, bend over and enjoy it.

Excellent post. What people fail to realize is that this industry and specifically this genre breeds creativity and innovation. When that is taken away then you better believe people are going to be pissed. When a large part of there favorite game is taken away by not being beaten in the department of innovation or quality but by (shady IMO) business pratices, then they have a perfectically good reason to be mad at EA, the company who couldn't beat them in terms of quality but wants to hinder the genre by a business deal. This is old news tho and I will continue to play 2K5 until Madden catches up in the departments they are so behind in.

[BBMo]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

Wow I feel sorry for some of you and your train of thought. I've had many disagreements with coogrfan but all of his arguments are always logical and a 5 year old could see that some of you attacking him are far from it. Point number one, serious gamers realize madden sucks? Are we still on this. I know plenty of people that prefer madden that are as serious as anyone. I also know many others that don't have the time to try to learn something new even if it may be better. I also know some that prefer the feeling of smooth play even if it means ignoring the shortcomings that come with it. The bottom line is there are a HUGE number of reasons why someone may prefer madden to 2k5 or even think they are about equal. To think that the number of units sold is closer for people that just bought one game is crazy. I'd say it's much farther apart. Some still don't know much of anything about the ESPN series. Some just buy Madden to play with their boys like they've done for 10+ years. Madden is to football games what Xerox is to copies. Point 2, it's all EA's fault. Who cares? Are you just looking for someone to be mad at? Gonna blow up their houses or something? No one is saying it's all the NFL's fault or that EA is completely innocent but it doesn't matter. The point is EA made a good business move, the NFL probably made a stupid one (time will tell) and we are hurt by it. Being upset doesn't mean always finding someone specific to point blame at. It often means you just have to deal with it. Point 3, EA would release a generic game. You're right they wouldn't leave their fans hanging b/c they've got tons of money so they don't have to. That's all that's to it. You can say they did it b/c they were scared of VC, b/c they're greedy, whatever. Even if they had the best game on the market by far, it was a smart business move. Point 4, mentioning NCAA at all. They just got NCAA exclusive rights so I don't follow this argument at all. They are claiming their territory. I guess since the NFL deal came first that meant they saw a decline and even worry about NCAA's success? Wow that's a stretch. Monopolies are illegal for a reason. Just like in baseball, the yankees do what they can to eliminate all competition within the rules... the problem isn't the yankees it's the rules. EA was able to make a move to destroy competition within the rules. That's all that's to it.

Let me remind you where you are...the NFL2K5 boards! So you probably won't see much SYMPATHY for EA here...and what I said was...(People who ONLY bought Madden as compared to people who bought 2k5 regardless if they bought Madden also. The reason I say this is because even if a person bought Madden and then bought ESPN, I STILL consider it a plus for VC because they were gaining ground in an uphill battle so I see it as a small victory for them...by the way. let me ask you something.

Why the hell are you so upset that my opinion differs from C-Fan...is he your SPECIAL friend or something???
We are all here trying to have a civil discussion...I was not ATTACKING him because I don't agree with him...just getting my views off my chest...

DUDE CHILL!!!!

[sportsgeist]

Quote: Originally Posted by coogrfan

The NFL made the decision that it was going to go with one video game company. EA had two choices, either be the high bidder or allow 15 years of building the Madden franchise to go up in smoke. How any rational person can say that what EA did was somehow wrong just boggles my mind. Apparently, neither you or DreBly have the slightest idea of what life is like in the real world.

Actually EA was going to buy it first until they seen how much people hated the idea. Then they come back and said the NFL was letting companies bid on the license knowing companies couldn't out bid EA. EA has the biggest pockets and for them to say the NFL let other companies bid on the license is a joke. $60,000,000 a year is a lot of money to spend on a license for a game. I just hope Take2/VC made them go up that high since they knew they couldn't or wouldn't out bid EA. I also feel they will put out another football game. Whether its pro or a college game only Take2 and VC knows for sure.

[1fortheroad]

Quote: Originally Posted by Rocky

Excellent post. What people fail to realize is that this industry and specifically this genre breeds creativity and innovation. When that is taken away then you better believe people are going to be pissed. When a large part of there favorite game is taken away by not being beaten in the department of innovation or quality but by (shady IMO) business pratices, then they have a perfectically good reason to be mad at EA, the company who couldn't beat them in terms of quality but wants to hinder the genre by a business deal. This is old news tho and I will continue to play 2K5 until Madden catches up in the departments they are so behind in.

What people fail to understand, is that the only limits are in your own mind. There are plenty of tools that allow people to develop their own game. Instead of whinning and being pissed make your own game.