Do you think No News is good news?

[blackceasar]

Quote: Originally Posted by nflnutt

Fellas there wont be a game Nba2k6 is take two's focus right now. its over maybe theyll try one for the next gen, as for the current sytems its a done deal.

I do recall a couple months ago I was on there trying to tell all the faithful and wishful thinkers that no matter what they sit up at night and hope and dream for it comes down to business and dollars to ALL of these companies. EA AND TAKE TWO. It is not financially lucrative for Take Two to pursue a football game this year and maybe not even next year or even the year after that. I have tried and tried and tried to give people the reality check they didnt want to hear and all I got is flamed because I was being negative towards some peoples dreams of a football game this year from TT. Im not being negative, Im being REAL. I said it many months ago and I will say it now, there will be no football game from Take Two this year, College, Semi Pro, Pro, Generic, Arena, or whatever. They are being quiet because its a PR move on thier part. Saying they wont have a game out this year now with all the madden hype going on will just be bad PR for t hem. They KNOW they arent putting a football game out this year, they dont have to tell you that right away. Wether they tell you today or in July, the fact remains there aint gonna be no football game from Take Two this year. The casual gamer which is about 80% of the consumers buy the football games BECAUSE of the NFL and the NFL teams and Players. You take that away and Take Two has about 20% left of a consumer base. Thats not enough to warrant them sinking money into development.

Its kinda like if 80% of all car shoppers wanted a car that would do more than 30 miles per hour and all of a sudden Ford signs some exclusive deal to where they are the only ones who can build cars that go over 30mph and I build cars as well.... well.... its no longer in my financial best interest to keep building cars that only have a 20% chance of selling everytime someone is car shopping. I dont care if I have a small group (which is what we here on the board is) of die hard people who like BlackCeaser automobiles Im not gonna keep making them just cuz a handfull of you want them. There has to be enough demand for my product (and enough is a number WAAAAAAAY bigger than the number of people on this board) to warrant me to keep producing cars. Guess what, I wont be, just like Take Two isnt going to be answering the wishes of a handfull of people and putting a football game out this year.

[spankdatazz22]

Quote: Originally Posted by blackceasar

It is not financially lucrative for Take Two to pursue a football game this year and maybe not even next year or even the year after that. The casual gamer which is about 80% of the consumers buy the football games BECAUSE of the NFL and the NFL teams and Players. You take that away and Take Two has about 20% left of a consumer base. Thats not enough to warrant them sinking money into development.

While I agree w/some of your points, I'd have to disagree with the two above. To the first point, there's a reason Midway and 989 are pursuing football titles this year. My guess is that it's not cost-prohibitive for them to adapt their current football engine with a few modifications and release it, hoping to garner sales in the niche market. Not every videogame needs to move a million+ units to be successful.

I agree somewhat w/your second point, that casual gamers buy football games primarily because of the NFL license. But the key is that the games have to be FUN. Midway was super-hot back in the 90s when it introduced NFL Blitz - it's not like any team was any more discernible from the other (other than the uniforms), it's just that the gameplay was really fun for it's time. It offered something that no other game was offering at the time.

NFL2K didn't sell immediately simply because it had the NFL shield plastered on it. It got pounded in sales in years previous in comparison to Madden. It wasn't until the gameplay/fun factor ramped up that it threatened Madden's stranglehold on videogame football. There was a STRONG possibility Madden would've been b!tch slapped silly this year, all things being equal. And THAT'S what people bank on IMO; the fact that there's so much more that 2K football is offering to gamers that Madden won't see likely until next-gen, if then. Losing the NFL and Players Assoc. licenses are huge, no doubt. But there are some glaring differences between the Madden & 2K football engines that most of us can see that would warrant VC releasing a generic game, if only to test the water. As with anything else, the hardcore will adopt it if it's worthy - the casual gamers will follow.

[wwharton]

that's not true either. people love the 2k series and people love madden. most of the people that played the 2k series as far back as 2k1 would say they didn't bump up anything. the game has been good and taken the same steps forward every year. many madden fans were unaware of the game. now we can discuss the many different things that brought more attention to the game from these unaware and otherwise uninterested consumers but it had nothing to do with 2k making it's gameplay better or more "fun". the casual gamers that did buy it tried it b/c of the $20 price tag. after trying it they may have grown to appreciate it but it wasn't from the game being bad before or reading features added on the box all of a sudden.

[Dark_Lord_Vader]

Quote: Originally Posted by taylor34

Personally, I think the Madden series is going to really suffer now that they no longer have anybody to steal ideas from anymore.

The Madden series will suffer, only in the aspect that it will not have a reason to vastly improve from year to year since there is no direct competition any more with the presence of another NFL title. I believe that the ideas from the likes of VC/Sega/Take Two will STILL be pilfered by EA. Even if it means taking them from the new NAFL2k7 next year and slapping the NFL identity on it. Trust me, the stealing from Sega/VC did not end when the ink touched the paper on the exclusivity deal. EA game developers are very much aware of the innovative developers over at Sega/VC/Take Two.

[coogrfan]

Quote: Originally Posted by spankdatazz22

NFL2K didn't sell immediately simply because it had the NFL shield plastered on it. It got pounded in sales in years previous in comparison to Madden. It wasn't until the gameplay/fun factor ramped up that it threatened Madden's stranglehold on videogame football. There was a STRONG possibility Madden would've been b!tch slapped silly this year, all things being equal. And THAT'S what people bank on IMO; the fact that there's so much more that 2K football is offering to gamers that Madden won't see likely until next-gen, if then. Losing the NFL and Players Assoc. licenses are huge, no doubt. But there are some glaring differences between the Madden & 2K football engines that most of us can see that would warrant VC releasing a generic game, if only to test the water. As with anything else, the hardcore will adopt it if it's worthy - the casual gamers will follow.

Do you really believe that? You honestly think that if both games were released this year, both at the same $50.00 price, that 2k's sales would "b!tch slap" Madden's?

Tell me, what color is the sky on your world?

[VCdolphin]

Other than the fact that REALITY flies in the face of your argument Blackceasar, you have a good point.

You should call 989 Sports and Midway, to help them understand they are wasting money and resources on football games. Tell them that Madden will rule all, that only million+ selling games make money, etc.

Or is it possible they have studied the market? That they can adapt their game engines and profit on sales of 100,000 to 200,000 copies?

Are they counting on gamers, mad at EA, buying ANY alternative football game? Curious gamers who want to see features not offered in an NFL licensed game?

As for your Ford buying exclusive rights illistration? I'd make a line of compact cars for use in downtown big cities (Manhattan for example) where speed is not much of a factor as you go light to light, and build a line of motorcycles. Sure I only get a fraction of the car market, but done right I can prosper with that. Thinking outside the box and all that.

Now, does this mean there WILL be a VC football game? No, of course not. It just means I don't buy your reasoning on why such an alternative game would be impossible from a financial/sales standpoint.

[spankdatazz22]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

most of the people that played the 2k series as far back as 2k1 would say they didn't bump up anything. the game has been good and taken the same steps forward every year.

Gotta disagree with that, although I'm sure you're much more knowledgeable about the series than I am. I think the game made significant improvements from 2004 to 2005, if only because developing the game w/the XBox in mind allowed them more freedom to do many more things. I think the game took a big jump from NFL2k to 2K1, then stagnated. If VC had been able to get around it's biggest issue early on (directional control) they would've had many more fans early on. Hell, people still can complain legitimately that the control isn't what it should be. The funny looking running style also kept many people away early on.

While I agree that there are gonna be people that prefer one game or the other simply because of preference, I think a big reason 2k5 was successful was because of it's gameplay. The price tag/curiosity/perhaps dissatisfaction with Madden brought them in, word of mouth and the gameplay kept people coming.

[spankdatazz22]

Quote: Originally Posted by coogrfan

Do you really believe that? You honestly think that if both games were released this year, both at the same $50.00 price, that 2k's sales would "b!tch slap" Madden's? Tell me, what color is the sky on your world?

It's blue. I knew saying that was going to offend SOMEONE lol.

I have no doubt that had both games released this year on equal terms, this would've been the year that the games were either considered "true" equals, or that 2K would've surpassed Madden. I say that simply because (IMO) there's far more upside to the current 2K football engine than there is to the current Madden engine. While most Madden fans are looking forward to what can be done next gen, most 2K fans were looking forward to what can be done NOW. There are things both series need to borrow or steal from the other - but if you look at the wishlists, you'll find far more people wishing for Madden to be more like 2K than vice versa.