The Draft

[SwayGod53]

Does anyone on here like to do the draft? I was at 2ksports and I posted my draft sliders, and someone said the people on here were really into the research of the game. Now, although I am fairly new to this website, I am probably the saddest person in regards to researching this game. I literally have pages and pages of notes dedicated to breaking down someones rating, how to improve draft potential, how a player progresses throughout his career, and I've even gone as far as to dedicate my franchise to watching 5 players in different positions make it or break it in the NFL. I recorded their individual game stats, which basically meant subtracting their totals from the week prior since I did not play the games. I saw a great WR go from starter to an injury prone career, a HB who was up and down and up and down, and a CB who was ranked #1 in the rookie report, but after 5 years was playing dime and nickel situations. Really good stuff.

But the draft.

I am not saying "Check out my draft sliders they are the best", etc, but I really think I helped keep the game alive with making the draft worthwhile again. I was as tired as the next guy, needing a back going into the draft, knowing the only way I was going to get a decent guy was to trade for a top 5 pick, but with the sliders you can pretty much take any of the top 10 backs and have decent results.

Ex. I did three drafts in three different franchises, recording the draft rating of the players before the sliders and after. Here are the results.

Tops 5 Backs, Draft 1- No sliders Ratings
1.80
2.74
3.73
4.68
5.66

Top 5 Backs, Draft 1- With sliders Ratings
1.87
2.81
3.79
4.75
5.73

You'll notice a 6-7pt increase in rating. So if you draft that second or third round back who is a 62, all of a sudden he is a 68-69, start of season a 72-73, maybe better.

The numbers in the 2nd draft and 3 draft were the same. In draft 2 all 5 backs went up 6pts when the sliders were applied.

You'll notice another big swing is the WR's. For some reason in this game the WR's stats just don't reflect their overall ratings. You'll notice the sliders I added don't touch catch, run route, or speed, the three biggest stats for a WR. The game does fine with this. It is the smaller stuff like jumping and consistency that was a little low, thus giving a worse rating.

Did You know that no matter how much you add or drop composure, aggressiveness, or Pass Blocking, it will not affect a WR's rating. It will for sure impact his performance, but it will not impact his rating.

Other players who got good bumps in rating were QB's, TE's catching, C, G, T's pass block and run block a little bump, because you are not going to have a T with a run block of 85 and a pass block of 50, which the game like to do.

So check it out if you have a chance. Of course it will only work for the XBOX using Finn's editor. If anyone has some draft info they would like to share, please post. We need to keep 2k5 alive.!!!!!!!!!!!!

SwayGod

[slimm44]

Quote: Originally Posted by SwayGod53

Does anyone on here like to do the draft? I was at 2ksports and I posted my draft sliders, and someone said the people on here were really into the research of the game. Now, although I am fairly new to this website, I am probably the saddest person in regards to researching this game. I literally have pages and pages of notes dedicated to breaking down someones rating, how to improve draft potential, how a player progresses throughout his career, and I've even gone as far as to dedicate my franchise to watching 5 players in different positions make it or break it in the NFL. I recorded their individual game stats, which basically meant subtracting their totals from the week prior since I did not play the games. I saw a great WR go from starter to an injury prone career, a HB who was up and down and up and down, and a CB who was ranked #1 in the rookie report, but after 5 years was playing dime and nickel situations. Really good stuff. But the draft. I am not saying "Check out my draft sliders they are the best", etc, but I really think I helped keep the game alive with making the draft worthwhile again. I was as tired as the next guy, needing a back going into the draft, knowing the only way I was going to get a decent guy was to trade for a top 5 pick, but with the sliders you can pretty much take any of the top 10 backs and have decent results. Ex. I did three drafts in three different franchises, recording the draft rating of the players before the sliders and after. Here are the results. Tops 5 Backs, Draft 1- No sliders Ratings 1.80 2.74 3.73 4.68 5.66 Top 5 Backs, Draft 1- With sliders Ratings 1.87 2.81 3.79 4.75 5.73 You'll notice a 6-7pt increase in rating. So if you draft that second or third round back who is a 62, all of a sudden he is a 68-69, start of season a 72-73, maybe better. The numbers in the 2nd draft and 3 draft were the same. In draft 2 all 5 backs went up 6pts when the sliders were applied. You'll notice another big swing is the WR's. For some reason in this game the WR's stats just don't reflect their overall ratings. You'll notice the sliders I added don't touch catch, run route, or speed, the three biggest stats for a WR. The game does fine with this. It is the smaller stuff like jumping and consistency that was a little low, thus giving a worse rating. Did You know that no matter how much you add or drop composure, aggressiveness, or Pass Blocking, it will not affect a WR's rating. It will for sure impact his performance, but it will not impact his rating. Other players who got good bumps in rating were QB's, TE's catching, C, G, T's pass block and run block a little bump, because you are not going to have a T with a run block of 85 and a pass block of 50, which the game like to do. So check it out if you have a chance. Of course it will only work for the XBOX using Finn's editor. If anyone has some draft info they would like to share, please post. We need to keep 2k5 alive.!!!!!!!!!!!! SwayGod

I read this kind of quickly since I'm at work, but I'm not exactly sure what you did. I understand you tweaked some ratings, but can you explain how? If I just missed it, please don't respond to this.

[thejackal25]

Welcome to OS sway. I did see your post on the 2k forums, I check there every couple of days...you should have posted your sliders in this thread so everyone can see exactly what you changed. Keep up the work on the draft, it would be really cool to figure out exactly how player progression works in this game.

[slimm44]

Quote: Originally Posted by thejackal25

Welcome to OS sway. I did see your post on the 2k forums, I check there every couple of days...you should have posted your sliders in this thread so everyone can see exactly what you changed. Keep up the work on the draft, it would be really cool to figure out exactly how player progression works in this game.

This is what I meant to say in my previous post.

[SwayGod53]

I posted my sliders in the sliders thread on this site and am about to post it in the roster edits thread, so check em out and let me know!

[thejackal25]

Quote: Originally Posted by SwayGod53

I posted my sliders in the sliders thread on this site and am about to post it in the roster edits thread, so check em out and let me know!

The sliders do look good, especially ones for WRs...a lot of the rookies I usually see look pretty good, but they can't jump if their life depended on it, so their overall goes down a lot. My only thing is, don't these edits make the draft really stacked year after year? W/o these edits, I've drafted players in rounds 3-5 that end up w/ ratings of above 80 and 1st/2nd rounders who reach 90 (once regular season starts)...largely cuz the draft gets messed up by the 1st round glitch. I've also had QBs drafted in the 7th who end up w/ ratings above 70 once the season starts. I can't imagine making the draft class stronger w/ edits. Imo, this game's draft has always been a little too strong for my liking, w/ the exception of the WR and HB positions. Good job w/ the edits...I'll definitely use the ones you used for WRs and HBs. Keep up the good work and let us know what you find out w/ tests on player progression.

[SwayGod53]

Quote: Originally Posted by thejackal25

The sliders do look good, especially ones for WRs...a lot of the rookies I usually see look pretty good, but they can't jump if their life depended on it, so their overall goes down a lot. My only thing is, don't these edits make the draft really stacked year after year? W/o these edits, I've drafted players in rounds 3-5 that end up w/ ratings of above 80 and 1st/2nd rounders who reach 90 (once regular season starts)...largely cuz the draft gets messed up by the 1st round glitch. I've also had QBs drafted in the 7th who end up w/ ratings above 70 once the season starts. I can't imagine making the draft class stronger w/ edits. Imo, this game's draft has always been a little too strong for my liking, w/ the exception of the WR and HB positions. Good job w/ the edits...I'll definitely use the ones you used for WRs and HBs. Keep up the good work and let us know what you find out w/ tests on player progression.

Thanks for the post. It is definitely good to hear everyone's opinions. I think why I like drafting and everything that goes into the draft is there is prolly enough stuff to figure out in it to keep me busy till 2k10 comes out.

I believed what I aimed to accomplish with the draft is to bring some solidarity to the draft and make the whole experience fun. If you play with the draft edits I put forth, you will notice that a player's rating is only going to go up about 5-7pts max. I totally agree with you that WR's and HB's were underappreciated in overall rating. I tore the WR position apart trying to see how a Terrell Owens was a 100 and Joe Reciever was a 65. What it mainly boils down to is the small stuff. I didn't touch catch, run route, or speed with the WR's, because there was nothing wrong with that. I think one of the problems might be that Pass Blocking doesn't increase overall rating in regards to WR's. Only Run Block will affect a WR's rating. Like I said though, the small stuff like Speed, Run Block, and Consistency were big opportunities for higher overall ratings.

The halfback position wasn't in too bad shape, except for the catch, run route, and some blocking figures that needed a little bump. Again, I think the issue with RB's is the 1st round glitch. I did a draft where 18 RB's were taken in the 1st round. Not this could have just been a strong draft class, but here's the results. The top RB was an 87. That is very realistic to your #1 overall player. Now the next 17 backs were between that and 70. Again I believe this was a strong draft class of RB's, seeing as this draft was done 1 year into a regular franchise with no fantasy draft or roster updates. This is my reasoning behind why I think this case was a strong draft class and why I think you need to try it before you knock it (not saying you are being negative, just a figure of speech)

I did 3 separate drafts, recording the overall ratings of the top 5 RB's before the edits and after the edits, here are the results.

Draft 1 B4 Edit/After Edit
HB 1 80/87
HB 2 74/81
HB 3 73/79
HB 4 68/75
HB 5 66/73

Now that is an alright RB class there. You have one over 85, two over 80, and four over 75. I think that looks about right to me.

Draft 2 B4 Edit/After Edit
HB 1 79/85
HB 2 75/81
HB 3 69/75
HB 4 65/71
HB 5 62/68

A little weaker draft here. See where you need these edits, because if you drafted the 5th best back available he is coming in at a 62 without the edit, 68 with the edit. Still one back over 85, two over 80, but only three over 75 and only four over 70. A weaker year, which means the past two drafts you only have about 4-6 good-great backs entering the league.

Draft 3 B4 Edit/After Edit
HB 1 74/80
HB 2 67/73
HB 3 66/72
HB 4 65/70
HB 5 ??/67
HB 6 61/67

HB #5 doesn't have a before because he actually leapfrogged the 5th back before the edit to get drafted 5th after the edit, and the 5th back before the edit got drafted 6th. I mean this crop is sad. We would starve from this crop. Only one over 80, only four over 70 and it is low 70's.

So in three drafts here, we have about 6-8 backs who are good-great backs for teams. Not super crazy, I don't think.

I did this with WR's and QB's too. I am suprised you didn't mention QB progression. With these edits you will finally have some decent QB contenders. WR's are not crazy with the edits, just a tad better. In the 3 edits, there was only 1 WR over a 75 (a 77), just one in three years. Now that guy is gonna be your Larry Fitz. All the others were 74 or lower. The top WR in each draft went like this 77, 73, and 70, and that is after edits.

Please try out all the edits for a few years and leave me some feedback. Ex. I had too many stud T's. I can then take a look at the tackle position. I did a draft where the top tackle was a 93. I know, that is sick, I was shocked, but then I looked at the next three tackles to be drafted. 83,78,73, that was the pecking order. Why can't there be that occasional can't miss Reggie Bushesque stud? I did a draft where I recorded the rating of the top player in each position. There was only one 90 (literally rated a 90 DT), and one C rated 85. That is pretty good for a draft imo.

But like I said I want people to try these sliders, go through a year or two or five, and let me know what you think. I have only gotten one person to commit to trying these, (thanks Dan77773- I think), so please give them a look.

Now the QB who starts the season 70 after being drafted in the 7th round. The only way I think that would happen pre-edit is if you had a weak QB draft. One draft I did there was only 4 QB's drafted total! The last guy taken went RD 7 PK 17 and was a 70.

But I will make this challenge to keep people busy. If there are more than 6 QB's taken in the draft, you will not draft a RD 7 QB higher than 70, including rating at beginning of regular season. Prove me wrong.

Keep bangin, SwayGOD

[thejackal25]

Quote: Originally Posted by SwayGod53

Thanks for the post. It is definitely good to hear everyone's opinions. I think why I like drafting and everything that goes into the draft is there is prolly enough stuff to figure out in it to keep me busy till 2k10 comes out. I believed what I aimed to accomplish with the draft is to bring some solidarity to the draft and make the whole experience fun. If you play with the draft edits I put forth, you will notice that a player's rating is only going to go up about 5-7pts max. I totally agree with you that WR's and HB's were underappreciated in overall rating. I tore the WR position apart trying to see how a Terrell Owens was a 100 and Joe Reciever was a 65. What it mainly boils down to is the small stuff. I didn't touch catch, run route, or speed with the WR's, because there was nothing wrong with that. I think one of the problems might be that Pass Blocking doesn't increase overall rating in regards to WR's. Only Run Block will affect a WR's rating. Like I said though, the small stuff like Speed, Run Block, and Consistency were big opportunities for higher overall ratings. The halfback position wasn't in too bad shape, except for the catch, run route, and some blocking figures that needed a little bump. Again, I think the issue with RB's is the 1st round glitch. I did a draft where 18 RB's were taken in the 1st round. Not this could have just been a strong draft class, but here's the results. The top RB was an 87. That is very realistic to your #1 overall player. Now the next 17 backs were between that and 70. Again I believe this was a strong draft class of RB's, seeing as this draft was done 1 year into a regular franchise with no fantasy draft or roster updates. This is my reasoning behind why I think this case was a strong draft class and why I think you need to try it before you knock it (not saying you are being negative, just a figure of speech) I did 3 separate drafts, recording the overall ratings of the top 5 RB's before the edits and after the edits, here are the results. Draft 1 B4 Edit/After Edit HB 1 80/87 HB 2 74/81 HB 3 73/79 HB 4 68/75 HB 5 66/73 Now that is an alright RB class there. You have one over 85, two over 80, and four over 75. I think that looks about right to me. Draft 2 B4 Edit/After Edit HB 1 79/85 HB 2 75/81 HB 3 69/75 HB 4 65/71 HB 5 62/68 A little weaker draft here. See where you need these edits, because if you drafted the 5th best back available he is coming in at a 62 without the edit, 68 with the edit. Still one back over 85, two over 80, but only three over 75 and only four over 70. A weaker year, which means the past two drafts you only have about 4-6 good-great backs entering the league. Draft 3 B4 Edit/After Edit HB 1 74/80 HB 2 67/73 HB 3 66/72 HB 4 65/70 HB 5 ??/67 HB 6 61/67 HB #5 doesn't have a before because he actually leapfrogged the 5th back before the edit to get drafted 5th after the edit, and the 5th back before the edit got drafted 6th. I mean this crop is sad. We would starve from this crop. Only one over 80, only four over 70 and it is low 70's. So in three drafts here, we have about 6-8 backs who are good-great backs for teams. Not super crazy, I don't think. I did this with WR's and QB's too. I am suprised you didn't mention QB progression. With these edits you will finally have some decent QB contenders. WR's are not crazy with the edits, just a tad better. In the 3 edits, there was only 1 WR over a 75 (a 77), just one in three years. Now that guy is gonna be your Larry Fitz. All the others were 74 or lower. The top WR in each draft went like this 77, 73, and 70, and that is after edits. Please try out all the edits for a few years and leave me some feedback. Ex. I had too many stud T's. I can then take a look at the tackle position. I did a draft where the top tackle was a 93. I know, that is sick, I was shocked, but then I looked at the next three tackles to be drafted. 83,78,73, that was the pecking order. Why can't there be that occasional can't miss Reggie Bushesque stud? I did a draft where I recorded the rating of the top player in each position. There was only one 90 (literally rated a 90 DT), and one C rated 85. That is pretty good for a draft imo. But like I said I want people to try these sliders, go through a year or two or five, and let me know what you think. I have only gotten one person to commit to trying these, (thanks Dan77773- I think), so please give them a look. Now the QB who starts the season 70 after being drafted in the 7th round. The only way I think that would happen pre-edit is if you had a weak QB draft. One draft I did there was only 4 QB's drafted total! The last guy taken went RD 7 PK 17 and was a 70. But I will make this challenge to keep people busy. If there are more than 6 QB's taken in the draft, you will not draft a RD 7 QB higher than 70, including rating at beginning of regular season. Prove me wrong. Keep bangin, SwayGOD

You make some good points, but I still think that the rookies might be coming out a bit too strong w/ these edits. In the cases you gave, are these the ratings players have when the regular season starts or right after the draft? Cuz if you have a RB that's 87 before the season starts, the kid will likely be above a 90 when it does, and that seems a bit much. And if he's at an 87 when the season starts it still seems a little high, especially when you compare this rookie w/ rookie rbs from years previous. In most roster updates, Reggie Bush, "the once in a lifetime HB," is rated in the mid to high 80s...Carnell Williams and Ronnie Brown, who were stellar prospects were rated in the low 80s...Steven Jackson of the Rams was rated in the 70s on this game when he was selected as well. With these edits, it seems the rooks are coming in w/ more talent and better ratings than a good number of the veterans. I agree that you can have a "once in a lifetime player" in the cpu generated drafts w/ these edits, but you had consecutive years in which HBs were rated above an 85...combine these two with Bush and you have 3 "once in a lifetime HBs."

In my experience playing, I've been able to pick up undrafted FA QBs w/ ratings above 70 once the season starts. From this, I personally think the rooks are already good enough, if not too good. If you look at second day QBs who have been picked and played in recent years (Krenzel, Dorsey, etc.) their ratings don't even reach 70 after progressing...I don't think that a handful of 7th round QBs should now have ratings above guys that they should be on par w/ and under.

I like the work you've done on the edits, especially the WRs cuz I definitely think they needed work, and I think you've done an awesome job of making the WR classes more in line w/ the game's/community's rosters. However, I still feel that the edits to some of the other positions, primarily QBs, create rookies that are not on par w/ roster updates and make rookies far too good early on. If one plays w/ weekly prep on and uses these edits there are probably going to be a handful of rooks w/ ratings over 90 and I think that is just too good for a rook...but that's just my opinion. Again, keep up the great work, as figuring out franchise and player progression will be very helpful.