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CaptainZombie · 09-29-2003, 01:29 PM

I have both ESPN and Madden this year, and ESPN is getting a lot of playing time in my XBOX. Both games have their flaws, but I think that ESPN is a game that I have a lot more fun with over Madden.

Positives/Negatives:
-Dan Stevens & Peter O'Keefe provide the best commentary in a football game to date.
-Madden may have create a play, but ESPN allows you to mix and match the playbooks from other teams into your own.
-Running game is much smoother than Madden. Ex. in Madden, when you hold down the speed burst it is very hard to change directions without getting hammered by a DB. 1/2 tackles are recorded in ESPN, as not in Madden.
-No Playmaker, which is really fun in Madden. If you were used to this in Madden, there are times when I try to change the routes of receivers after the snap but I forget that it's only in Madden.
-First Person Football is a fun experience which is great to screw around with once in awhile.
-The Crib is better than the useless Madden cards.
-In game animations, such as: Lambeau leap, 3-4 different crowd animations, cheerleader look like cheerleaders, players actually have fingers, stadium atmosphere is down to the tee.
-Owner mode is fun in Madden, maybe ESPN may incorporate something similar.
-NFL Primetime show by Chris Berman rules as he gives a rundown of the games for the week, top players of the game, hands out 4 game balls a week, and the top 3-4 plays of the week receive a replay clip.
-1/2 time NFL Primetime by Berman is great and it shows clips of the top plays of the game.
-Even though the running game has gotten better, there is a problem with way too many broken tackles. This can be fixed with sliders or changing the BTK on each RB in the game.
-ESPN has a little bit of a problem with Stats like it has since the inception of the 2K games. I've read on this board that people have had top players of theirs not appear on the stats till Week 9. I went and checked and noticed the same thing. I think that this is something that VC needs to fix for ESPN 2K5.

-The gameplay on ESPN just feels much smoother than Madden. Many people complain that the D rushes in on you way too fast, but watch a football game and tell me how quick the D of a good team tries to blitz and sack the QB. In Madden I find myself hanging in the pocket for much longer than I should be.
-Players and Stadiums are larger than Madden, and this makes the game feel real as oppossed to the smaller stadiums and players from Madden.
-I would like to add one more thing, the computer in ESPN never appears to miss a field goal which I'm not too thrilled about. This can be fixed if you change the accuracy on each kicker throughout your NFL roster.
-My biggest beef with Madden is that you can win games with the scores of anywhere from 60-80 points. How is this realistic? I didn't even have the game on easy or pro. ESPN's scores are close, but you will get some games where teams win by 20-30 points on occasion.
-Offseason on Madden is a bit better when you add the aspect of the NCAA 2004 rosters that can keep your Madden franchise up to date for at least a few seasons. VC only allows you to edit up to 30 rookies after the NFL draft which sux imo. I haven't been able to find the screen to edit the rookies and maybe someone can enlighten me here?

These are some of the things that makes me feel like ESPN is the better game this year over Madden. But, I still think that Madden has taken steps this year to offer a good game from previous years. Owner Mode, Playmaker, and Training Camp (Franchise) are great additions, but only help mask the same game that I've been playing since Madden 2001. This year I was looking for something that was different and more realistic to the game of football. I will go on record and say that ESPN has the cross of SIM and Arcade elements mixed in to make the game fun. Rent both first to see which one you like better.

CLASSIFIED · 09-29-2003, 01:41 PM

Hot routes and max passing are basically playmaker. Also if you didn't know you can flip running plays the other way at the line by pressing audible button(b for xbox) then clicking R3.

Fetter21 · 09-29-2003, 01:46 PM

I don't think that Max Passing is anything similar to Playmaker mode. I don't mind not having that since I don't really use it in Madden, but they're not the same.

Brassman · 09-29-2003, 02:55 PM

Lately, I've been playing one or two games of ESPN on my xbox every day. Call it an addiction but I just keep playing. Last year I passed on buying NFL2k3 for Madden 2003 and ended up playing Madden more than any game I've ever owned. This year I pre-ordered Madden 2004 but as coach only mode player I just can't get past the "sack bug" issue in this years Madden. EA's inability to quickly patch this problem has just given me more time to appreciate all the little things that this years ESPN Football does well. (like screen passes & trap plays that work, qb rollouts & gadget plays, half sacks & assists) Gameplay as well as quality comentary and presentation makes this game feel fresh compared to Madden. I still go back to Madden 2004 everyday, hoping that the problems will go away because I'm still a PC gamer at heart, but unless the long awaited patch fixes the major issues with gameplay I'll be playing ESPN more and more each day.

ftball11 · 09-29-2003, 03:22 PM

ESPN is by far the better game. Better presentation, graphics, gameplay. It (ESPN) falls short in some areas, but it is the most complete package on the shelf this year. Madden became too redundant for me, EA doesn't change much from year to year and you end up with the same game you played last year - with a few tweaks here and there. All the same problems from the last two title are still in this years game, which shows EA doesn't do much updating - they just rework and repackage the same game. Basically, I got tired of playing the same game year in and year out, so I tried ESPN this year and have not regretted it. ESPN does need some polishing, but overall, the problems are real minor and I can live with that.

Graphik · 09-29-2003, 03:35 PM

Quote:

ftball11 said:
ESPN is by far the better game. Better presentation, graphics, gameplay. It (ESPN) falls short in some areas, but it is the most complete package on the shelf this year. Madden became too redundant for me, EA doesn't change much from year to year and you end up with the same game you played last year - with a few tweaks here and there. All the same problems from the last two title are still in this years game, which shows EA doesn't do much updating - they just rework and repackage the same game. Basically, I got tired of playing the same game year in and year out, so I tried ESPN this year and have not regretted it. ESPN does need some polishing, but overall, the problems are real minor and I can live with that.

Some of those are my thoughts also. After playing ESPN, I really felt EA had stole my money because what Sega has done presentation and commentary wise is light years ahead of EA. Madden just felt so stale. Same sh*t, diffrent toilet feeling, ya know. If EA beefed up thier presentation, commentary and animations, that game would have been a keeper. But listening to the ever so dry John Madden made me wanna throw the toaster in the tub with me. And the stale and uninnovative presentation feels like you're watching a 70s football game. well, not that far, but you get what I'm sying. After all these years, they could at least use some good stat overlays. Show what a player is adveraging for a season. But nooo, still the same ole, same ole. Year after year. Like I said, where the hell 2+ million worth of sales going? Not in the game, I'll tell you that much.

wco81 · 09-29-2003, 03:39 PM

ESPN has a lot of good things going for it. I especially like it's effort with online leagues, even though there are some problems with their servers.

But I will be playing both Madden and ESPN for awhile. If it was didn't have some issues, it might be easier to switch exclusively (EDIT) from Madden but alas, that isn't the case.

Some things they need to address for next year:

1) Better online performance on the PS2. Needs to be more reliable and smoother. NCAA and Madden are just better in this area by a long shot.

2) Using updated rosters online. Also ability to reorder depth chart and use that online.

3) Ability to use saved audibles online. Whether this is done as a part of custom playbooks or separately from them, this is a must.

4) Independent cameras online.

These 4 things are really basic, necessary things. The competition has set the bar and VC needs to at least meet it.

The game is rightly praised for presentation but I hope next year, they concentrate more on basic online functionality instead of the flash. The replays and half time shows, most people skip them when playing online because they add to the length of the game and people have plenty of chances to watch them offline anyways.

jake44np · 09-29-2003, 03:41 PM

Quote:

ftball11 said:
ESPN is by far the better game. Better presentation, graphics, gameplay. It (ESPN) falls short in some areas, but it is the most complete package on the shelf this year. Madden became too redundant for me, EA doesn't change much from year to year and you end up with the same game you played last year - with a few tweaks here and there. All the same problems from the last two title are still in this years game, which shows EA doesn't do much updating - they just rework and repackage the same game. Basically, I got tired of playing the same game year in and year out, so I tried ESPN this year and have not regretted it. ESPN does need some polishing, but overall, the problems are real minor and I can live with that.

You need to state espn is the better game in your opinion, you cant just say espn is the better game!

09-29-2003, 01:29 PM	#1
CaptainZombie RIP Brodie!!! OVR: 49 Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 37,859 Blog Entries: 4	My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004. I have both ESPN and Madden this year, and ESPN is getting a lot of playing time in my XBOX. Both games have their flaws, but I think that ESPN is a game that I have a lot more fun with over Madden. Positives/Negatives: -Dan Stevens & Peter O'Keefe provide the best commentary in a football game to date. -Madden may have create a play, but ESPN allows you to mix and match the playbooks from other teams into your own. -Running game is much smoother than Madden. Ex. in Madden, when you hold down the speed burst it is very hard to change directions without getting hammered by a DB. 1/2 tackles are recorded in ESPN, as not in Madden. -No Playmaker, which is really fun in Madden. If you were used to this in Madden, there are times when I try to change the routes of receivers after the snap but I forget that it's only in Madden. -First Person Football is a fun experience which is great to screw around with once in awhile. -The Crib is better than the useless Madden cards. -In game animations, such as: Lambeau leap, 3-4 different crowd animations, cheerleader look like cheerleaders, players actually have fingers, stadium atmosphere is down to the tee. -Owner mode is fun in Madden, maybe ESPN may incorporate something similar. -NFL Primetime show by Chris Berman rules as he gives a rundown of the games for the week, top players of the game, hands out 4 game balls a week, and the top 3-4 plays of the week receive a replay clip. -1/2 time NFL Primetime by Berman is great and it shows clips of the top plays of the game. -Even though the running game has gotten better, there is a problem with way too many broken tackles. This can be fixed with sliders or changing the BTK on each RB in the game. -ESPN has a little bit of a problem with Stats like it has since the inception of the 2K games. I've read on this board that people have had top players of theirs not appear on the stats till Week 9. I went and checked and noticed the same thing. I think that this is something that VC needs to fix for ESPN 2K5. -The gameplay on ESPN just feels much smoother than Madden. Many people complain that the D rushes in on you way too fast, but watch a football game and tell me how quick the D of a good team tries to blitz and sack the QB. In Madden I find myself hanging in the pocket for much longer than I should be. -Players and Stadiums are larger than Madden, and this makes the game feel real as oppossed to the smaller stadiums and players from Madden. -I would like to add one more thing, the computer in ESPN never appears to miss a field goal which I'm not too thrilled about. This can be fixed if you change the accuracy on each kicker throughout your NFL roster. -My biggest beef with Madden is that you can win games with the scores of anywhere from 60-80 points. How is this realistic? I didn't even have the game on easy or pro. ESPN's scores are close, but you will get some games where teams win by 20-30 points on occasion. -Offseason on Madden is a bit better when you add the aspect of the NCAA 2004 rosters that can keep your Madden franchise up to date for at least a few seasons. VC only allows you to edit up to 30 rookies after the NFL draft which sux imo. I haven't been able to find the screen to edit the rookies and maybe someone can enlighten me here? These are some of the things that makes me feel like ESPN is the better game this year over Madden. But, I still think that Madden has taken steps this year to offer a good game from previous years. Owner Mode, Playmaker, and Training Camp (Franchise) are great additions, but only help mask the same game that I've been playing since Madden 2001. This year I was looking for something that was different and more realistic to the game of football. I will go on record and say that ESPN has the cross of SIM and Arcade elements mixed in to make the game fun. Rent both first to see which one you like better.

09-29-2003, 01:41 PM	#2
CLASSIFIED Rookie OVR: 4 Join Date: Jul 2003	Re: My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004. Hot routes and max passing are basically playmaker. Also if you didn't know you can flip running plays the other way at the line by pressing audible button(b for xbox) then clicking R3.

09-29-2003, 01:46 PM	#3
Fetter21 F*tbll Fntc OVR: 30* Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 3,404 Blog Entries: 10	Re: My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004. I don't think that Max Passing is anything similar to Playmaker mode. I don't mind not having that since I don't really use it in Madden, but they're not the same.

09-29-2003, 02:55 PM	#4
Brassman Rookie OVR: 4 Join Date: Jan 2003	Re: My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004. Lately, I've been playing one or two games of ESPN on my xbox every day. Call it an addiction but I just keep playing. Last year I passed on buying NFL2k3 for Madden 2003 and ended up playing Madden more than any game I've ever owned. This year I pre-ordered Madden 2004 but as coach only mode player I just can't get past the "sack bug" issue in this years Madden. EA's inability to quickly patch this problem has just given me more time to appreciate all the little things that this years ESPN Football does well. (like screen passes & trap plays that work, qb rollouts & gadget plays, half sacks & assists) Gameplay as well as quality comentary and presentation makes this game feel fresh compared to Madden. I still go back to Madden 2004 everyday, hoping that the problems will go away because I'm still a PC gamer at heart, but unless the long awaited patch fixes the major issues with gameplay I'll be playing ESPN more and more each day.

09-29-2003, 03:22 PM	#5
ftball11 Pro OVR: 5 Join Date: Sep 2003	Re: My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004. ESPN is by far the better game. Better presentation, graphics, gameplay. It (ESPN) falls short in some areas, but it is the most complete package on the shelf this year. Madden became too redundant for me, EA doesn't change much from year to year and you end up with the same game you played last year - with a few tweaks here and there. All the same problems from the last two title are still in this years game, which shows EA doesn't do much updating - they just rework and repackage the same game. Basically, I got tired of playing the same game year in and year out, so I tried ESPN this year and have not regretted it. ESPN does need some polishing, but overall, the problems are real minor and I can live with that.

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09-29-2003, 03:35 PM	#6
Graphik Prsnr#70460649 OVR: 22* Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Chi-Town, Ill-State Posts: 10,580	Re: My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004. Quote: *ftball11 said:* ESPN is by far the better game. Better presentation, graphics, gameplay. It (ESPN) falls short in some areas, but it is the most complete package on the shelf this year. Madden became too redundant for me, EA doesn't change much from year to year and you end up with the same game you played last year - with a few tweaks here and there. All the same problems from the last two title are still in this years game, which shows EA doesn't do much updating - they just rework and repackage the same game. Basically, I got tired of playing the same game year in and year out, so I tried ESPN this year and have not regretted it. ESPN does need some polishing, but overall, the problems are real minor and I can live with that. Some of those are my thoughts also. After playing ESPN, I really felt EA had stole my money because what Sega has done presentation and commentary wise is light years ahead of EA. Madden just felt so stale. Same sh*t, diffrent toilet feeling, ya know. If EA beefed up thier presentation, commentary and animations, that game would have been a keeper. But listening to the ever so dry John Madden made me wanna throw the toaster in the tub with me. And the stale and uninnovative presentation feels like you're watching a 70s football game. well, not that far, but you get what I'm sying. After all these years, they could at least use some good stat overlays. Show what a player is adveraging for a season. But nooo, still the same ole, same ole. Year after year. Like I said, where the hell 2+ million worth of sales going? Not in the game, I'll tell you that much.

09-29-2003, 03:39 PM	#7
wco81 Banned OVR: 12 Join Date: Jul 2002	Re: My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004. ESPN has a lot of good things going for it. I especially like it's effort with online leagues, even though there are some problems with their servers. But I will be playing both Madden and ESPN for awhile. If it was didn't have some issues, it might be easier to switch exclusively (EDIT) from Madden but alas, that isn't the case. Some things they need to address for next year: 1) Better online performance on the PS2. Needs to be more reliable and smoother. NCAA and Madden are just better in this area by a long shot. 2) Using updated rosters online. Also ability to reorder depth chart and use that online. 3) Ability to use saved audibles online. Whether this is done as a part of custom playbooks or separately from them, this is a must. 4) Independent cameras online. These 4 things are really basic, necessary things. The competition has set the bar and VC needs to at least meet it. The game is rightly praised for presentation but I hope next year, they concentrate more on basic online functionality instead of the flash. The replays and half time shows, most people skip them when playing online because they add to the length of the game and people have plenty of chances to watch them offline anyways.

09-29-2003, 03:41 PM	#8
jake44np Post Like a Champion! OVR: 22 Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: The Burg, Indiana Posts: 9,543	Re: My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004. Quote: *ftball11 said:* ESPN is by far the better game. Better presentation, graphics, gameplay. It (ESPN) falls short in some areas, but it is the most complete package on the shelf this year. Madden became too redundant for me, EA doesn't change much from year to year and you end up with the same game you played last year - with a few tweaks here and there. All the same problems from the last two title are still in this years game, which shows EA doesn't do much updating - they just rework and repackage the same game. Basically, I got tired of playing the same game year in and year out, so I tried ESPN this year and have not regretted it. ESPN does need some polishing, but overall, the problems are real minor and I can live with that. You need to state espn is the better game in your opinion, you cant just say espn is the better game!

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My thoughts on the ESPN - Madden debate of 2004.