02-20-2004, 11:48 PM
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#17
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H*F Cl*ss *f '09
OVR: 14
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 5,979
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Re: NFL2k5 Title Poll
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: WTF? "just watch"? You made it seem like the old konami games already had an affect in your previous posts. Now we have to WATCH and see if the amount of gamer who even remember the old konami espn games made or will make a remote difference in ESPN's sales? You've got to be kiddin me, Darth.
Nope. I am not kidding. There are gamers out there that remember.
I wasn't asking if you were kidding about gamers who remember...I was asking if you're kidding about saying to "just watch" and see how the namechange will adversely affect the game. Thats B.S, man. Especially since there'd be now way for you to prove if ESPNFL's sales would be worse next year vs if the game was still named nfl2k.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: OMFG! Man why do you thiNk they Changed The Name in the first place!!?? Because Nfl2k wasn't as recognized by the "mainstream of making great nfl games" as you think! If that wasn't the case they wouldn't have changed the name of their ENTIRE line of sports games from 2K to ESPN!
Frankly I am not sure why Sega changed the name.
Stop lying to yourself, Darth.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: WHAT!!? You're telling me people will recognize 2k before they recognize ESPN?? B.S. I'm not Not "flat-out, 100% wrong". "ESPN" stacks up better against "Madden" and "Fever" than "Nfl2k" did...both in name AND in quality. Now Sega/VC just has to support the game better through Marketing.
Yes you are 100% wrong. Walk up to people you don't know that play video games and ask them to name three NFL titles. I bet you anything that Madden gets the most response, followed by NFL2k and then NFL Fever
How about You walk to up ANYBODY (gamers AND none-gamers) and ask them which names they recoginze first Madden, ESPN, and NFL2k...I guarantee NFl2k will come in dead last. That was my point...ESPN gives the game alot more brand recognition.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said:…you'd at aleast agree that better advertising should be done to help them…
I did agree with this. You are not paying attention. You keep repeating yourself with statements that are not on subject.
And You keep quoting me out of context to suit your arguement. My full statement...
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Kanobi said:
Thats what i'm saying to you, man. Its not about the namechange. Its about the lackluster advertising. If you're so stuck on the fact that so many gamers were truamatized by the old Konami espn games then'd you'd at aleast agree that better advertising should be done to help them realize this is an enitrely different game and much better than both the old konami games AND previous editions of nfl2k. Besides, I think most of that has been done already via word of mouth anyway.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: So you agree...its more to do with advertising than the namechange.
For the last time, YES! Advertising is important. Still has nothing to do with whether or not other gamers believe that the name NFL2k should come back. Don't make this into your own argument that has nothing to do with my original poll and post.
Again, don't quote me out of context...
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Kanobi said:So you agree...its more to do with advertising than the namechange. But the Namechange of their entire line helped give the games alot more visibility, recognition based on the ESPN brand having already been well established. Like I said man it was necessary....Hell its fact!!! How can you argue they didn't need to do it when its been done already and you have nothing to back your statements that the namechange has hurt or WILL hurt sales??? This is ridiculous, man!
stop twisting my words, Darth.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: Like I said man it (the name change from 'NFL2k4' to ESPN NFL Football') was necessary....Hell its fact!!!
Nope. Not a fact. There is no way to prove that the game would not have sold even more with the lone brand 'NFL2k4'. So your 'fact' is pretty much out the #@#$%#$ window.
Of course there isn't. Its a fact that the Name was changed from NFL2k to ESPN NFL Football and will be called that next year so why you're even creating polls about what people think the game should be called next year is pretty foolish.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said:…you have nothing to back your statements that the namechange has hurt or WILL hurt sales??? This is ridiculous, man!
I'll say it's ridiculous. You have nothing either to PROVE that ESPN NFL Football sold more than a title of NFL24 would have.
I didn't mean that you didn't have proof that an nfl2k4-titled game would sell better. I meant you don't have proof that the Namechange is what Hurt sales vs last year's nfl2k3 title or that it would hurt sales next Year vs this years game.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: I wasn't stating how it'd appear on the box. I'm saying the simple title of ESPN NFL Football is alot more straight foward than NFL2k4 - Presented by Espn ...no matter how its designed.
You are fabricating now. Your challenge to me was that 'ESPN NFL Football' (The title now.) was just as easy to say as 'NFL2k4'. (The title it should have been.) I proved otherwise with plain English. Admit you were wrong here and move on to your next fabrication.
What? That was not my "challenge" to you. Heres what i orginally wrote...
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Kanobi said:
Are you serious? "'NFL2k4–Presented by ESPN'"? WTF??? You think people will remember that more than "ESPN Football".
This says nothing about which one is easier to say. You're the one who is fabricating things.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: You're about a year late with this namechange [censored] anyway?
Why on Earth am I a year late? Games evolve and change every month. My hope is that there are other NFL2kers out there just like me that want to see the name 'NFL2k5' instead of ESPN NFL Football 2005. I ran this poll to get their opinion. It obviously struck a nerve with you. This is turning into the 'Kanobi vs Vader' thread!
Yeahs that is pretty funny  But the topic itself isn't what has struck a nerve with me. Its the fact that you keep qouting me out of context and twisting my words to suit your arguement...an arguement which is actually base-less and has no grounds in fact whatsoever. And as for people that share opinion according to this poll...as of right now there are 2 others out of 17 that share your opinion. There...are you happy now?
And by saying you're a year late I meant that this Topic would have been more relevant last year before the namechange was officially announced and there was much specualtion on the boards on what it would be or what it SHOULD be.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said:…especially since your stance is based on absolutely NOTHING.
I have previous ESPN Sunday Night Football video game history to back me up. That's definitely something and not NOTHING as you say.
Oh...I see but that still didn't keep you from buying Sega's ESPN Football. Might there be others out there like you?....Gamers who played the old konami series but still bought ESPN NFL football. I think so. BTW, what made you buy the original ESPN Sunday Night Football in the First place? There wasn't a previous edition of the game for you to base any pre-conceptions on. What made you try the original? Word of Mouth? Nah...couldn't have been...especially since the game was such a crapfest as you say. Hmmm....was it the ESPN Name perhaps? I think so.
Anyway, By "Nothing" I mean you have absolutely no facts to support your stance that the game would be better off if it was named nfl2k still. You don't even have any facts that say ESPN sales have been hurt vs last years NFL2k sales. The fact YOU played the Old Konami ESPN games means NOTHING unless we're looking for some personal reasons why you're on this Anti-ESPN NFL Football namechange campaign. Just because YOU remember doesn't mean that a significant amount of others who remember the old game and thus avoided ESPN NFL football enough to hurt its sales. Hell, you can't even prove all those who played the old game passed on the sega version this year. So , in essence, that aspect of your arguement is based on NOTHING as well.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: Wrong. I said they're aren't enough (gamers who remember ESPN and their crappy games in the 90's) to make a remote difference.
Define a 'remote difference'. If you define it accurately, you will find that a remote difference is STILL a difference at it's core. My arguement says this name change has made a difference for the worst.
I know your arguemnt is that the namechange has made "a difference for the worst" but you have posted no facts whatsoever to support your arguement which is mainly that ESPN has sold worse than nfl2k3 or that sales will be worse next year than this year.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: Well do the research then because until you do...you really have no basis in saying whether the name change has adversely affected or WILL adversely affect the sales and profitability of the game which is what all this boils down to ANYway.
Sorry, my day is too busy. My basis is on ESPN's video game history. It is a poor one which has now carried over to my NFL2k. Just to clarify, so there is no confusion or twisting of my words later on. ESPN's integration into NFL2k4 is great. I really enjoy how it looks and plays. I am worried that their NAME on the outside of the box has hurt sells. Just their name alone.
Okay, show how the namechange has adversely affected sales vs last year when the game was called nfl2k3.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: How is my point mute?? If you don't have any numbers or facts to support your arguement that the namechange has adversely affected or WILL adversely affect sales and profit then you don't have an argeument at all man....period.
No time for numbers. Refer to ESPN Sunday Night Football's record of sales. People remember the ESPN brand and how crappy it was in a video game. I have a great arguement. Period.
No time for the numbers but you have time keep posting all this B.S. about how the namechange has hurt the game and how people who were traumatized by the old Konami ESPN games have passed on on the new Sega ESPN series. No time for numbers?...yeah right. Your arguement is quite weak.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: ESPN NFL Football is to much to say? you've got to be kidding, right?
Count the words. Shouldn't be too hard. I want you to say 'NFL2k5'. Ready? Go…
Now, say 'ESPN NFL Football'. Ready? Go…
Which one took longer to say? If you are honest, you will say 'ESPN NFL Football'. That was my point here.
That point was foolish in the first place! Who really gives a [censored] if it takes longer to say or not.
Pay attention here posters. Do you see how Kanobi has the inability to say 'I was wrong.' Instead, he brushes off his obvious error by just saying 'That point was foolish in the first place…' This is the one true sign of an egomaniac.
Yes posters...please take note....on how Darth continues to quote me out of context and runs arounds my full statements....
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Kanobi said: That point was foolish in the first place! Who really gives a [censored] if it takes longer to say or not. I thought you were joking at first but apparently you were actually serious which is quite sad to say the least. As I said before most people don't say the full names of the game anyway...most just say ESPN...same as most simply say "Madden" or "Madden 2000x" and not "Madden NFL Footbal 2000x".
Also take note that I originally asked if he was kidding about the name ESPN NFL Football taking long too long to say and actually using that as a point in is already base-less arguement because I didn't think he'd actually be that stupid as to think a Title taking long to say would actually be a reason people would avoid buying the game. Thank you.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said: Tell ya what, get a paintshop or photoshop program and design your own cover art for the game then you can replace the actual cover so you'll feel better.
Cute.
Thanks.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said:…you have nothing show the namechange hurt sales of espn vs nfl2k3.
Big ____in' deal. You don't have jack ____ either!
lol! Darth, be real,man....Do you actually believe ESPN has sold worse than Nfl2k3?
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
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Kanobi said:…you know the title will be ESPN football again next year and this poll is pretty pointless
I have told you the point of this poll over and over again. Go to my initial post and poll. Read it. You will find my point in the introduction. Your responses are officially becoming pointless.
Are you sure my responses "officially becoming pointless"?...
Your orginal post...
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
All right NFL2kers, I want to hear your opinions about this whole 'branding change' thing. I believe that part of the reason ESPN NFL Football did not sell very well, is because a lot of casual gamers out there avoided it. Mainly due to ESPN's poor, poor NFL games in the past. I thought that people would see 'ESPN NFL Football' on the cover and immediately reach for their copy of Madden 2004, linking the name to the horrors of the past.
So far my responses have mainly been asking you to provide some facts...mainly numbers that would support your original stance that the namechange has hurt sales. So far you haven't done that and are apparently reluctant to do so.
Furthermore, I have stated that your stance in this discussion is quite pointless since the game is already named ESPN NFL Football and will be named that again next year...regardless of what you (and 2 other voter out of 17) think. I have also stated that the namechange to ESPN IMO was made so that the entire segasports lineup (not just nfl2k) would have alot more visibility and recognition based on the ESPN brand having already been well established. Therefore my responses have been quite relevant.
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Dark_Lord_Vader said:
Have a nice weekend Kanobi. I'm going home to play my AFC Championship game! Woo! Woo! Wish me luck! 
Same to you and Good Luck, Darth!
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Kanobi said:…Oh well. I'm done here now.
lets see if I can keep this promise this time.
Okay I'm officially done. Peace  |
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