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wwharton · 06-23-2004, 03:13 PM

Quote:

feeq14 said:
I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad

i posted this about a week ago. i believe the running animation can bother one person and not bother another b/c of this. i use the speed burst like you should, when in the open field. when i'm pounding i don't notice bc i'm, well, pounding. otherwise it's just not there to be noticed. i think people use the speed burst too much but also think it'll be hard for it to change much. won't go into the specifics again.

coogrfan, i think you're wrong. i think the combination of personal skill (whether that be moving the stick, pushing the buttons or timing) AND player ratings should combine to create how the player performs. i will say i don't think this is completely true in all situations for either madden or espn but it's more true for espn. i do respect anyone that just doesn't like tapping... if you don't you don't, ya know? but i don't like having no control... not really about the top speed but the in between speeds as well.

hotadef · 06-23-2004, 06:11 PM

only thing madden has that i want in espn is mini games. They can add those mini games to the new practice part of espn and that would be all i need. train the rb i use the running back in mini drills. maybe d line will have some drill pushing the sleed then tackle the dummy. qb shoots the ball to hit the fake reciever or shoot the ball through swinging tire etc. That is the only thing left to add to the franchise maybe next year. I will put that in 2k6 wish list

HotrodderZ · 06-23-2004, 06:53 PM

Quote:

wwharton said:

Quote:

feeq14 said:
I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad

i posted this about a week ago. i believe the running animation can bother one person and not bother another b/c of this. i use the speed burst like you should, when in the open field. when i'm pounding i don't notice bc i'm, well, pounding. otherwise it's just not there to be noticed. i think people use the speed burst too much but also think it'll be hard for it to change much. won't go into the specifics again.

coogrfan, i think you're wrong. i think the combination of personal skill (whether that be moving the stick, pushing the buttons or timing) AND player ratings should combine to create how the player performs. i will say i don't think this is completely true in all situations for either madden or espn but it's more true for espn. i do respect anyone that just doesn't like tapping... if you don't you don't, ya know? but i don't like having no control... not really about the top speed but the in between speeds as well.

Tapping for speed burst prevents a natural feel of acceleration. If you tap the button at a certain speed, you are immediately at top speed. If you stop, you are imediately at default speed. In Madden, there is a certain amount of time that passes before top speed is reached. You have to account for a players acceleration when running. I think this creates a smoother and more realistic feel to the game.

TecmoBowl · 06-23-2004, 07:04 PM

Quote:

feeq14 said:
I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad

Thou speaks of the Holy Grail of Video Game Football!

I would like to respectfully disagree. If you remove a gamer's ability to alter the performance of players on the field, you make it more like "watching" as opposed to "playing".

I guess that is why I never got heavily into Madden. I always wanted more control than they gave. I was always looking for the next generation Tecmo Bowl. So I don't want this game to be "little more like [M]adden".

Goffs · 06-23-2004, 09:59 PM

Quote:

TecmoBowl said:

Quote:

feeq14 said:
I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad

Thou speaks of the Holy Grail of Video Game Football!

I would like to respectfully disagree. If you remove a gamer's ability to alter the performance of players on the field, you make it more like "watching" as opposed to "playing".

I guess that is why I never got heavily into Madden. I always wanted more control than they gave. I was always looking for the next generation Tecmo Bowl. So I don't want this game to be "little more like [M]adden".

Slickman · 06-23-2004, 10:11 PM

So you want them to make A(X) turbo on offense and B(O) turbo on defense.

Seriously, what were they thinking when they did that?

coogrfan · 06-24-2004, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Slickman said:
So you want them to make A(X) turbo on offense and B(O) turbo on defense. Seriously, what were they thinking when they did that?

As I posted earlier in this thread:

The reason the speed burst buttons are different on off. and def. is because most longtime Madden players are used to it being that way. However, EA did include alternate button configs that allow you to have them both on the same button if you want, so this isn't a legitimate gripe.

coogrfan · 06-24-2004, 10:48 AM

Quote:

wwharton said:

Quote:

feeq14 said:
I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad

i posted this about a week ago. i believe the running animation can bother one person and not bother another b/c of this. i use the speed burst like you should, when in the open field. when i'm pounding i don't notice bc i'm, well, pounding. otherwise it's just not there to be noticed. i think people use the speed burst too much but also think it'll be hard for it to change much. won't go into the specifics again.

coogrfan, i think you're wrong. i think the combination of personal skill (whether that be moving the stick, pushing the buttons or timing) AND player ratings should combine to create how the player performs. i will say i don't think this is completely true in all situations for either madden or espn but it's more true for espn. i do respect anyone that just doesn't like tapping... if you don't you don't, ya know? but i don't like having no control... not really about the top speed but the in between speeds as well.

wwharton, I understand that most 2k fans prefer the increased level of control you describe. But I'm not clear on one thing:are you saying that my contention that making a players (let's say Mike Vick) absolute top speed dependent on how fast a given gamer can tap buttons is not unrealistic? Or are you saying that it's a case of accepting something that's clearly unrealistic in order to gain an added degree of control?

06-23-2004, 03:13 PM	#33
wwharton ll Str OVR: 28 Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 26,978	Re: Make it a little more like madden Quote: *feeq14 said:* I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad i posted this about a week ago. i believe the running animation can bother one person and not bother another b/c of this. i use the speed burst like you should, when in the open field. when i'm pounding i don't notice bc i'm, well, pounding. otherwise it's just not there to be noticed. i think people use the speed burst too much but also think it'll be hard for it to change much. won't go into the specifics again. coogrfan, i think you're wrong. i think the combination of personal skill (whether that be moving the stick, pushing the buttons or timing) AND player ratings should combine to create how the player performs. i will say i don't think this is completely true in all situations for either madden or espn but it's more true for espn. i do respect anyone that just doesn't like tapping... if you don't you don't, ya know? but i don't like having no control... not really about the top speed but the in between speeds as well.

06-23-2004, 06:11 PM	#34
hotadef Rookie OVR: 3 Join Date: May 2004	Re: Make it a little more like madden only thing madden has that i want in espn is mini games. They can add those mini games to the new practice part of espn and that would be all i need. train the rb i use the running back in mini drills. maybe d line will have some drill pushing the sleed then tackle the dummy. qb shoots the ball to hit the fake reciever or shoot the ball through swinging tire etc. That is the only thing left to add to the franchise maybe next year. I will put that in 2k6 wish list

06-23-2004, 06:53 PM	#35
HotrodderZ Rookie OVR: 4 Join Date: May 2003	Re: Make it a little more like madden Quote: *wwharton said:* Quote: *feeq14 said:* I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad i posted this about a week ago. i believe the running animation can bother one person and not bother another b/c of this. i use the speed burst like you should, when in the open field. when i'm pounding i don't notice bc i'm, well, pounding. otherwise it's just not there to be noticed. i think people use the speed burst too much but also think it'll be hard for it to change much. won't go into the specifics again. coogrfan, i think you're wrong. i think the combination of personal skill (whether that be moving the stick, pushing the buttons or timing) AND player ratings should combine to create how the player performs. i will say i don't think this is completely true in all situations for either madden or espn but it's more true for espn. i do respect anyone that just doesn't like tapping... if you don't you don't, ya know? but i don't like having no control... not really about the top speed but the in between speeds as well. Tapping for speed burst prevents a natural feel of acceleration. If you tap the button at a certain speed, you are immediately at top speed. If you stop, you are imediately at default speed. In Madden, there is a certain amount of time that passes before top speed is reached. You have to account for a players acceleration when running. I think this creates a smoother and more realistic feel to the game.

06-23-2004, 07:04 PM	#36
TecmoBowl Thread Killa OVR: 13 Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Alexandria, VA Posts: 1,874	Re: Make it a little more like madden Quote: *feeq14 said:* I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad Thou speaks of the Holy Grail of Video Game Football! I would like to respectfully disagree. If you remove a gamer's ability to alter the performance of players on the field, you make it more like "watching" as opposed to "playing". I guess that is why I never got heavily into Madden. I always wanted more control than they gave. I was always looking for the next generation Tecmo Bowl. So I don't want this game to be "little more like [M]adden".

06-23-2004, 09:59 PM	#37
Goffs New Ork Giants OVR: 30 Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,250	Re: Make it a little more like madden Quote: *TecmoBowl said:* Quote: *feeq14 said:* I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad Thou speaks of the Holy Grail of Video Game Football! I would like to respectfully disagree. If you remove a gamer's ability to alter the performance of players on the field, you make it more like "watching" as opposed to "playing". I guess that is why I never got heavily into Madden. I always wanted more control than they gave. I was always looking for the next generation Tecmo Bowl. So I don't want this game to be "little more like [M]adden".

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06-23-2004, 10:11 PM	#38
Slickman Rookie OVR: 3 Join Date: Jul 2003	Re: Make it a little more like madden So you want them to make A(X) turbo on offense and B(O) turbo on defense. Seriously, what were they thinking when they did that?

06-24-2004, 10:36 AM	#39
coogrfan #HTownTakeover #YWCF OVR: 27 Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 15,576	Re: Make it a little more like madden Quote: *Slickman said:* So you want them to make A(X) turbo on offense and B(O) turbo on defense. Seriously, what were they thinking when they did that? As I posted earlier in this thread: The reason the speed burst buttons are different on off. and def. is because most longtime Madden players are used to it being that way. However, EA did include alternate button configs that allow you to have them both on the same button if you want, so this isn't a legitimate gripe.

06-24-2004, 10:48 AM	#40
coogrfan #HTownTakeover #YWCF OVR: 27 Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 15,576	Re: Make it a little more like madden Quote: *wwharton said:* Quote: *feeq14 said:* I think to base any aspect of skill in the game on a players ability to mash buttons is rather absurd. i mean that was going on waaaaay back with Tecmo Bowl.............TECMO BOWL!!!!! in 1986. hopefully there are people posting who remember that game. Either way it was like the First Ever NFL football game. it doesnt make any sense that we are going to be using skills from tecmo bowl to play a football game almost 20 years down the line that has all these other advancements but still cant figure out a way to go faster and break tackles. I really think that madden has this right i mean if you whatch ESPN and watch as you speed burst and your player makes little jerky quick movements as he slides acroos the field due to the eratic tapping of the speed burts whereas in madden it really looks like a player is sprinting on the actual ground his feet are supposed to be touching. The Speed tapping is one of the reasons why the running in ESPN looks so bad i posted this about a week ago. i believe the running animation can bother one person and not bother another b/c of this. i use the speed burst like you should, when in the open field. when i'm pounding i don't notice bc i'm, well, pounding. otherwise it's just not there to be noticed. i think people use the speed burst too much but also think it'll be hard for it to change much. won't go into the specifics again. coogrfan, i think you're wrong. i think the combination of personal skill (whether that be moving the stick, pushing the buttons or timing) AND player ratings should combine to create how the player performs. i will say i don't think this is completely true in all situations for either madden or espn but it's more true for espn. i do respect anyone that just doesn't like tapping... if you don't you don't, ya know? but i don't like having no control... not really about the top speed but the in between speeds as well. wwharton, I understand that most 2k fans prefer the increased level of control you describe. But I'm not clear on one thing:are you saying that my contention that making a players (let's say Mike Vick) absolute top speed dependent on how fast a given gamer can tap buttons is not unrealistic? Or are you saying that it's a case of accepting something that's clearly unrealistic in order to gain an added degree of control?

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Make it a little more like madden