The CPU decides the game....

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  • bronko3
    Rookie
    • Nov 2008
    • 86

    #91
    Re: The CPU decides the game....

    Originally posted by BigTone1970
    Although we all want a certain level of realism, we also want to be able to have some of our stick skills affect the game. I am glad you are having success, but playing with the Angels my team batting average is .241 and no one is batting .300. I don't want to participate in a pre-determined statistical simulation with beautiful graphics after all this is a video game and user input should have some type of affect on the outcome. There needs to be an incentive for the user to put the time into the game, get better, and then see results. As I have said, sometimes it feels that you can do everything right and still get your you know what handed to you. The thing that everyone continues to disregard is that I am often not perfect with hitting the ball and so when that happens I get what I deserve. But on the few times when I am perfect I expect hard contact even if it results in an out.
    Man I'm telling you just tweak the hitting difficulty level and sliders until you find what works. I've been in your shoes. The game can be incredibly frustrating at times. But don't be afraid to tweak the sliders & stuff. I started to hate this game until I finally tweaked the sliders & difficulty to my skill level. Mainly I just lowered pitch speed and increased the human timing and human contact sliders (zone hitting). Nothing that complex. Just find your sweet spot and roll with it.

    Comment

    • spit_bubble
      MVP
      • Nov 2004
      • 3292

      #92
      Re: The CPU decides the game....

      Originally posted by moemoe24
      ...Im looking at my league leaders right now in the AL and here is the top 10
      1. Ortiz .344
      2. Yunel Escobar .339
      3. Brett Gardner .335
      4. Julio Borbon .335
      5. Chone Figgins. 331
      6. Matt Wieters .329
      7. Matsui .329
      8. Adrian Gonzalez .328
      9. Ichiro .325
      10. Ryan Raburn .324

      There's five guys in that top 10 thats ratings in the game, if predetermined, would not be there.
      Man, if only Figgins were doing that well...

      Another point to add here, BigTone1970, maybe it'll help...

      I think you're approaching the game wrong. You say you want it to respond to what you do, but I think a better way to approach it is to imagine you are stepping into the shoes of the player you are controlling...

      So for your better hitters, zone up and use the power swing... And if it's yer #8 hitter and you fall behind in the count, use contact swing and battle...

      In other words, don't think about your stick skills, think about your strategy skills... When should I send the runner to avoid the double play? When should I give a guy a day off? Etc.

      If you work with the game it will reward you. If you sit there wishing it were something it's not, you're not going to get a lot out of it.

      And yeah, for the umpteenth time... Sliders!
      All ties severed...

      Comment

      • Pared
        Legen - WAIT FOR IT
        • Feb 2003
        • 39337

        #93
        Re: The CPU decides the game....

        Tone - have you tried changing the difficulty? Lots of good discussion here but at the same time you have to show you're willing to use the suggestions put forth. Who knows, it may help.
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        Comment

        • jcern23
          Banned
          • Apr 2007
          • 636

          #94
          Re: The CPU decides the game....

          Originally posted by BigTone1970
          Wow, I am glad to see that this post has inspired a lot of thought provoking responses. I don't want arcade, but I don't want to be a spectator also. That is all that I am saying. Read my posts. It justs seems that some games I am crushing the ball and other games I am limited to a few hits doing the same exact thing. I just want to exert a little bit of user input and sometimes it doesn't feel as if what I am doing matters at all. Please don't take my statements out of context. This is the best baseball game ever, but it is conversations like these that leads to improvements for us all. Everyone have a good 4th of July weekend.
          This is that fine line I'm talking about. Think about it like this if you always had games where you were pounding the ball your avgs would be way too high. Scea put the ups and downs of a baseball season into every player. This is why I agree with you that the CPU determines alot of the outcome although you can play a factor as well especially if your settings are below or above your skill level. If you have the settings right this game will play similar to a stratamatic simulation. I felt my settings were right in my last season and won 94 games. I completely agree that it is extremely frustrating when your timing is money and you know the CPU is cooling your bats. But if they didn't I would have won 120 games with a Tampa bay team that probably won't even win the 94 that I did. So it's like I said it's so tough to create realistic results while using user skills but they are close. To me the hitting is not even the most frustrating part when it comes to this topic it's the pitching. I use classic to find that fine mix of ratings and user skill and when a pitcher just doesn't have it you feel absolutely helpless.
          Last edited by jcern23; 07-02-2011, 08:16 AM.

          Comment

          • Knight165
            *ll St*r
            • Feb 2003
            • 24964

            #95
            Re: The CPU decides the game....

            Originally posted by jcern23
            This is that fine line I'm talking about. Think about it like this if you always had games where you were pounding the ball your avgs would be way too high. Scea put the ups and downs of a baseball season into every player. This is why I agree with you that the CPU determines alot of the outcome although you can play a factor as well especially if your settings are below or above your skill level. If you have the settings right this game will play similar to a stratamatic simulation. I felt my settings were right in my last season and won 94 games. I completely agree that it is extremely frustrating when your timing is money and you know the CPU is cooling your bats. But if they didn't I would have won 120 games with a Tampa bay team that probably won't even win the 94 that I did. So it's like I said it's so tough to create realistic results while using user skills but they are close. To me the hitting is not even the most frustrating part when it comes to this topic it's the pitching. I use classic to find that fine mix of ratings and user skill and when a pitcher just doesn't have it you feel absolutely helpless.
            The CPU does NOT "cool" your at bats.
            Guys....each PITCH is put through the paces each time it's thrown. Same for fielding plays.
            I don't know how many times it needs to be said...but at NO time does the AI look at the score/inning/team/whatever to figure out an at bat or play in the field.
            What it comes down to is perception and I'm sorry to inform you fellas that think anything is pre-determined, that it's your perception that is pre-determined and skewed rather than the results you are seeing.

            M.K.
            Knight165
            All gave some. Some gave all. 343

            Comment

            • moemoe24
              Rookie
              • Oct 2007
              • 1996

              #96
              Re: The CPU decides the game....

              I can vouch for the people that were frustrated with hitting. I've played this game since 2008 and never had the problems hitting like I did in 2011. The hitting got harder in 2011, no doubt. I struggled the first two months of my season, not understanding what I was doing wrong. I had all my settings and sliders set the way I had always set them but was having an awful time hitting the ball with authority.

              I got so frustrated, I kept tweaking sliders, moving from all star to veteran several times but could never find that perfect balance. Finally, about 2 weeks ago I moved the pitch speed slider all the way to 0. The differece it made was unbelievable. Now I'm drawing 2-3 walks a game, getting in good hitter counts, driving in more runs cause I have more men on base.

              So my point is, you can make the game fun by finding what works for you.

              Comment

              • BigTone1970
                Rookie
                • Mar 2011
                • 48

                #97
                Re: The CPU decides the game....

                People keep telling me to move the sliders, etc., etc... Read my posts. Sometimes I have success, sometimes I don't, and I am doing the same exact thing. What works one game, doesn't work the next. This is the frustrating part because then it seems that you are playing a game with a pre-determined outcome. Hitting the ball is supposed to be difficult. I get that. What I don't get and what everyone fails to explain is why my actions/inputs works one game, but has no effect the next. This is where my frustration sets in because then I am not learning from my mistakes and or success. Am I playing or watching?

                Comment

                • capa
                  Banned
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 5321

                  #98
                  Re: The CPU decides the game....

                  What specifically do you mean by your actions/inputs don't yield the same results every game?

                  C

                  Comment

                  • nomo17k
                    Permanently Banned
                    • Feb 2011
                    • 5735

                    #99
                    Re: The CPU decides the game....

                    Originally posted by BigTone1970
                    What I don't get and what everyone fails to explain is why my actions/inputs works one game, but has no effect the next. This is where my frustration sets in because then I am not learning from my mistakes and or success. Am I playing or watching?

                    You know, that sort of subtleties make baseball what it is... so you have to accept the feeling "unmastery" to enjoy the sport, whether it's a video game or real baseball.

                    Think about teams like the Yanks. The perennial winner. They have been dominating the sport over the past decade or so. When you look at their record, however, their winning percentage is still barely 60% overall. Four out of ten games they lose. But they still instill that fear in the sport...

                    Even the best among the best lose 40% of the game and that's how baseball is.
                    The Show CPU vs. CPU game stats: 2018,17,16,15,14,13,12,11

                    Comment

                    • capa
                      Banned
                      • Jul 2002
                      • 5321

                      #100
                      Re: The CPU decides the game....

                      Even the best hitters that ever lived never got the same result at bat to at bat and game to game even though their swing, etc was technically the same. It is impossible. If it was possible, there would be an awful lot of .400 and .500 hitters!

                      Same with pitching. Same release point...same grip...but ball does not always go to same location. That's the beauty of the game.

                      It would be quite boring if once we figured out the exact time to press the controller button we wound up wit the exact outcome every time. Baseball, and sports in general, are not like that.

                      C

                      Comment

                      • Knight165
                        *ll St*r
                        • Feb 2003
                        • 24964

                        #101
                        Re: The CPU decides the game....

                        Yep...
                        ...and how many times have you heard a pitcher...after giving up a HR......"I made my pitch...exactly where I wanted it, but he just got a hold of it".....
                        OR...
                        a batter say...."I thought I got a hold of that one"....only for it to be a routine fly ball.

                        Results are not guaranteed.


                        ...and I'd really LOVE to do an experiment...where guys say they know what's going to happen...to save the game....send the file to someone else...have them finish the game and see if their Kreskin like premonitions are indeed true. Of course it would have to be something out of the ordinary that they are "predicting". My guess....their success rate is going to be much less prominent than they believe it to be(or that they are trying to lead others to believe).

                        Now...we all have that "feeling" and it's usually remembered when it's right...but it happens in real games too. It's just something that happens.

                        M.K.
                        Knight165
                        All gave some. Some gave all. 343

                        Comment

                        • capa
                          Banned
                          • Jul 2002
                          • 5321

                          #102
                          Re: The CPU decides the game....

                          Agreed Knight...on all counts.

                          What also amazes me are the folks who equate how good a game is with how often they "win" or beat all levels. People love to win and if it is too hard or takes too long, they will find a million things they think is wrong with the game. Not just for this game, but vid games in general. Not saying the original poster is of this thinking...just a general observation.

                          Let's see...how many years has it been since the Cubs won a World Series???

                          : )

                          C

                          Comment

                          • moemoe24
                            Rookie
                            • Oct 2007
                            • 1996

                            #103
                            Re: The CPU decides the game....

                            Originally posted by Knight165
                            Yep...
                            ...and how many times have you heard a pitcher...after giving up a HR......"I made my pitch...exactly where I wanted it, but he just got a hold of it".....
                            OR...
                            a batter say...."I thought I got a hold of that one"....only for it to be a routine fly ball.

                            Results are not guaranteed.


                            ...and I'd really LOVE to do an experiment...where guys say they know what's going to happen...to save the game....send the file to someone else...have them finish the game and see if their Kreskin like premonitions are indeed true. Of course it would have to be something out of the ordinary that they are "predicting". My guess....their success rate is going to be much less prominent than they believe it to be(or that they are trying to lead others to believe).

                            Now...we all have that "feeling" and it's usually remembered when it's right...but it happens in real games too. It's just something that happens.

                            M.K.
                            Knight165
                            I agree. The predetermined stuff Tone keeps talking about is completely a joke. Every year I play the game i see guys with good ratings hit poor and guys with bad ratings hit well. Like I said before, if the user's input didn't matter that would not be possible. I play with Texas every year...last year I had Hamilton finish the season at .295 36 homers and 110 RBI....this year throu the 1st half of the season hes hitting .251 with 13 homers and 50 RBI. If things were predetermined I wouldn't have these kinds of descrepincies.

                            Also, I've saved games in the middle of a game several times and been winning or losing and then go back and start the game over and have completey different results.

                            So Tone's argument just doesn't hold up, not from my experience with the game. I think either you understand baseball or you don't. If you understand it you understand that perfect timing doesn't mean you are going to get a hit or even hit the ball hard, it just means you timed your stride, swing, hips etc. perfect....nothing more nothing less.
                            Last edited by moemoe24; 07-02-2011, 01:22 PM.

                            Comment

                            • Heroesandvillains
                              MVP
                              • May 2009
                              • 5974

                              #104
                              Re: The CPU decides the game....

                              Originally posted by BigTone1970
                              People keep telling me to move the sliders, etc., etc... Read my posts. Sometimes I have success, sometimes I don't, and I am doing the same exact thing. What works one game, doesn't work the next. This is the frustrating part because then it seems that you are playing a game with a pre-determined outcome. Hitting the ball is supposed to be difficult. I get that. What I don't get and what everyone fails to explain is why my actions/inputs works one game, but has no effect the next. This is where my frustration sets in because then I am not learning from my mistakes and or success. Am I playing or watching?
                              Pitcher confidence.

                              Pitch confidence.

                              Batter/Pitcher hot and cold streaks.

                              Hypothetical: 8 "perfect swings" one game, and only 6 the next...or a 15% swing and miss ratio one game, and a 20% the next...though similar in numbers, can have a drastic impact on a game's outcome..which directly relates to the confidence aspect.

                              Player stamina. Which, I assume if low, moderately impacts player ratings.

                              CPU pitcher ratings, and THEIR perfect/normal/early/late release ratio.

                              Wind.

                              CPU outfielder speed and fielding ability, which directly impacts outs versus hits, and singles versus extra bases.

                              CPU infielder reaction time and fielding ability, which directly impacts outs versus hits.

                              All of these things change on a game-to-game or series-to-series basis, causing game variability.
                              Last edited by Heroesandvillains; 07-02-2011, 02:30 PM.

                              Comment

                              • jcern23
                                Banned
                                • Apr 2007
                                • 636

                                #105
                                Re: The CPU decides the game....

                                Originally posted by Knight165
                                The CPU does NOT "cool" your at bats.
                                Guys....each PITCH is put through the paces each time it's thrown. Same for fielding plays.
                                I don't know how many times it needs to be said...but at NO time does the AI look at the score/inning/team/whatever to figure out an at bat or play in the field.
                                What it comes down to is perception and I'm sorry to inform you fellas that think anything is pre-determined, that it's your perception that is pre-determined and skewed rather than the results you are seeing.

                                M.K.
                                Knight165
                                When I say cool your bats I'm saying that at some point no matter how well a certain player is hitting the ball regardless of game situation, inning, at some point a player will have to cool off. If this wasn't how the game was made it would stink. Scea has said that they have put hot and cold streaks in the game and you see the diff in the pci when your hot or cold right. So at certain points in a season or game regardless of how well you are hitting you are
                                going to cool off. It has to be that way so I will agree with you that there are no definitive predetermined outcomes but the CPU coding that makes the game realistic has to weigh in on each and every game simply with player streaks.

                                Comment

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