Penalties need to be set before gameplay sliders

[MarketingWiz]

Quote: Originally Posted by darkknightrises

While so I just finished the game. I had both IG and RTP both at 100 and I only had 1 RTP call in the game and it was agest the CPU not me. I had 5 sacks I normal get 8-9 sacks on all pro so having 5 dose that mean that having IG and RTP at 100 makes things better? I don't know 5 is better then 8-9 but need to play more has 1 game is not enough to really say. Also it was a game where the CPU had a lot of success on the ground and where I was behind quikley so if not for that and had the CPU passed the ball more that 5 sacks may have been 7 or so will play more with this and see if I go back to the normal 8-9 sacks a game or if I see games like this with 5 sacks.

This is credible, however, it is not a long term solution for the sack glitch. RTP at 100 and IG at 1, would certainly NOT give you the same result, lending support to why the PEN SLIDERS DO MATTER and why anyone that wants to get a solid playing experience consider creating their slider brew starting with penalties tuned first, and then work on the running game and then the passing game.

[MarketingWiz]

Quote: Originally Posted by Last Gunfighter

Well, I can only comment on what I have seen and at 85 it was called so much it ruined the game, much like RTP above 53 just gets called excessively.

This is absolutely supported in the Wiz's lab data as well, HOWEVER, the frequency of the RTP penalty being called is also related to the PBLK, and IG and CPU QB ACC to a much lesser degree, slider settings. SO it is possible to have a high RTP and not necessarily a high degree of RTP penalties.


To achieve consistently good games, finding the "mix for the fix" is paramount and involves testing dozens of theories and slider mixes playing complete CFM games. This is why the Wiz did not "rush to market" with a slider mix. Wiz's personal tastes for Madden typically demand that the game results be believable from a stat and metric standpoint, and that for the Wiz's skill level, the wins feel like they had to be earned and were due to smart defensive strategy and taking what the CPU defense gives when scoring. Arcade style of scores, or having to play with to many "house" rules, or being able to score at will on the CPU, does not float the Wiz's boat.

[Last Gunfighter]

Quote: Originally Posted by MarketingWiz

This is credible, however, it is not a long term solution for the sack glitch. RTP at 100 and IG at 1, would certainly NOT give you the same result, lending support to why the PEN SLIDERS DO MATTER and why anyone that wants to get a solid playing experience consider creating their slider brew starting with penalties tuned first, and then work on the running game and then the passing game.

My sentiments exactly, hence the title of the thread...

[MarketingWiz]

Quote: Originally Posted by darkknightrises

Oh ok yeah I have tried the IG slider at 0-50-100 and I noticed no difference but I have yet to try to RTP slider at a higher number and I don't want to have to mess with all madden but I just don't think any thing really fixes the sack issues. While hear it goes I am going to try a game with the RTP slider at 100 on all pro and see what happends. I know in the past having that slider at 100 you would see a lot of calls but I heard some one say that in sever games with it at 100 that it helped the sack issue and that the most calls they saw in a game was just 2.

Technically correct. However, IF you are willing to make certain concessions, possess an above-average knowledge of how to call a defensive scheme and are comfortable going "button ninja" on your controller to modify pass coverage's to cover the flats (eliminating the CPU QB's de-facto go to pass), YOU CAN achieve significantly reduced sacks, NFL style completion %'s for the CPU QB (no more robo QB) and a very good mix of down the field throws from the CPU QB...






Look at it this way... Do you have the "Chicago Way" in you?





As Jimmy Malone told Elliott Ness in the classic, the Untouchables:


"... You see what I am saying is, what are you prepared to do?"






In other words, how much of the real NFL game are you willing to suspend/sacrifice to achieve solid gameplay that is competitive? Therein lies the solution to our mutual quandary.

[4thQtrStre5S]

My focus has been on dialing in the pass and run block sliders; and then adjusting the penalty sliders known, or theorized to affect blocking; IE "Offsides," "False Start," "Clipping," and "holding."

Then I work on those penalty sliders that are theorized to have effects on pursuit, "RTK," and "KR/PR Interference."

IMO, the base of football, at any level starts in the trenches, the offensive and defensive lines; thus I start there..

In adjusting offensive and defensive line play, I am just trying to get to a point where the players do the least amount of goofy, illogical moves or miss blocks...You do not have to hold a block, but at least understand who is most important to try and block first....This was an issue that was supposed to highlight the M15 game, adaptive/smarter AI that would go for the biggest threat - still haven't seen it.

[darkknightrises]

Quote: Originally Posted by MarketingWiz

This is credible, however, it is not a long term solution for the sack glitch. RTP at 100 and IG at 1, would certainly NOT give you the same result, lending support to why the PEN SLIDERS DO MATTER and why anyone that wants to get a solid playing experience consider creating their slider brew starting with penalties tuned first, and then work on the running game and then the passing game.

While even though I had 5 sacks in that game I normal average 8-6 sacks I fell like 2 of the 5 sacks I had where still sacks where the CPU held on to the ball way to long.

[MarketingWiz]

Quote: Originally Posted by 4thQtrStre5S

My focus has been on dialing in the pass and run block sliders; and then adjusting the penalty sliders known, or theorized to affect blocking; IE "Offsides," "False Start," "Clipping," and "holding." Then I work on those penalty sliders that are theorized to have effects on pursuit, "RTK," and "KR/PR Interference." IMO, the base of football, at any level starts in the trenches, the offensive and defensive lines; thus I start there.. In adjusting offensive and defensive line play, I am just trying to get to a point where the players do the least amount of goofy, illogical moves or miss blocks...You do not have to hold a block, but at least understand who is most important to try and block first....This was an issue that was supposed to highlight the M15 game, adaptive/smarter AI that would go for the biggest threat - still haven't seen it.

In my gameplay experiences, the sliders I am working with do provide plays where you do see kick out blocks on runs to the outside and the occasional RB picking up a blitzer in a blitz package.


But in general, your observation is accurate, M15 HAS NOT delivered the level of adaptive AI that certainly the OS community was anticipating.


You may want to reconsider your approach to setting up your sliders though, since I believe that the proverbial "Band-Aid" that is being sought to address the sack glitch and robo-QB certainly can be addressed by taming the "arcade/cartoonish tendencies" of the underlying AI and watering down the "over-hyped" attributes that Donny's ratings deliver, through the penalty sliders


The Wiz has a working slider brew and is presently playing dozens of games with it. Typically have a couple of bud's come over to my man cave during the evenings and play Madden (have two PS4's to work with) against the CPU until our significant others threaten "dire consequences" if they don't come home.... To date, the stats and metrics are not bad. Good mix of low scoring contests, a few blowouts, the turnovers seem about right based on our skill level and poor decisions throwing the rock, and the sacks and robo-QB glitches are not a "front and center" when playing against the CPU.


Plan to continue testing several more theories that the Wiz has to explore for at least a complete season, or so. One theory that the Wiz did explore and did not work out well, was initially working on getting the OL/DL interaction right. Since a lot of Madden is an animation sequence, I would get the a decent OL/DL interaction but the common identified glitches would still happen, so I did not pursue that line of thought very long. It wasn't until I decided to build the entire brew from the penalties on up, that I started to have breakthroughs on taming the beast.


Just my .02 ....

[D Rey]

I've noticed that when I purposely get a penalty called on me in the beginning of the game that it triggers more penalties being called through the game