Last try. Recommend me a slider that you are not top 3 in sacks.

[KingV2k3]

Quote: Originally Posted by StefJoeHalt

King I'm confused..if Hum overplays pass wouldn't that cause CPU to take more coverage sacks? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Exactly...what it's looking like to me is that the lower you go on the HUM PCV slider, the more they CPU will take coverage sacks because there's nobody open enough to even try to throw to...

It's like the percentages are reversed so that:

HUM PCV: 40 means you're playing the pass closer to 60 percent and the run 40 percent as opposed to the former value of 35, which would make the AI lean closer to 65 / 35...

Unfortunately, ALL these sliders are tied to more things than they should be, so it's just a weird balancing thing...

Did open up the passing game for the CPU, so that's a plus...without raising compeltion percentage...

When I moved it up to 40 / 50 and played WSH i got ZERO sacks and his pocket presence / success when he bailed out was much better...

Might be too small a sample, but I liked the way it played so far...

[JoshC1977]

This is a quote from my thread as to what PCV does:

Lower values means that DBs stick to their routes more, high values mean they bat down more passes. However, if you bump it up too much, CBs will actually stop in the middle of the route. If you lower it too much, you will get mirroring where the DBs will actually be out in front of the WR running the same pattern (which also takes them out of run plays more often).

So you're right that the players will overplay the pass when it is below 50. However, watch route running on man-to-man; the higher you go, the less that CBs will actually follow the receivers they were assigned. You actually get to the point where man coverage almost looks like a zone.

I have noticed the same effects that you have (go too low on PCV and you get more coverage sacks and the run game gets too easy).

This is a roundabout way of saying that I agree with your observations....and you have actually given me a couple of ideas....

[KingV2k3]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoshC1977

This is a quote from my thread as to what PCV does: Lower values means that DBs stick to their routes more, high values mean they bat down more passes. However, if you bump it up too much, CBs will actually stop in the middle of the route. If you lower it too much, you will get mirroring where the DBs will actually be out in front of the WR running the same pattern (which also takes them out of run plays more often).

Yeah, describing this stuff is really the difficult part...



I agree with your take, but I'm starting to think it may be a "consequence" of what I'm now claiming:

The PCV slider in part, functions not unlike a Coach Philosophy / Pass versus Run Defense Slider in NCAA or older iterations of Madden...

If that's the overriding function, then what you're describing is a result of exactly that:

At higher values the DB is less concerned with his assigned receiver because he's "playing more run defense than pass defense" and is more concerned with tracking the ball / carrier than his pass defense assignment, as a result...

It's a "six of one, half dozen of another"...but this "simplification" of the concept behind the slider FINALLY drew me to the conclusion that to "open up the passing game" going with values closer to 50 than those closer to 0 was the key...

Lastly:

This might explain why people have thought the PCV slider to be "reversed" for years now...

It IS reversed in that lower values equal higher percentages of playing the pass versus playing the run, so that would APPEAR to be the case and in part...is?

Anyway:

Fun to bat this stuff around...glad you're finding it thought provoking...I got a few things from your thread, too...so all good in the slider 'hood...

[JoshC1977]

Well, your thoughts have given me an idea. The one thing that has really bothered me with the AM level is crappy coverage (especially for the user). However, when I tried to go low (in the low-20s to high 10s), the run game opened up way too much. If you're right and going lower on the PCV would give them a pass-oriented tendency, then lowering the pass reaction slider (where settings below 50 orient them towards the run) should balance things out while keeping the man coverage intact.

It starts to pull things together for me as I tried to mimic the NCAA 14 slider set to M15. On that set, we use the run defense slider (essentially equivalent to the pass reaction slider) at 5 with PCV at 30. As a result, we get some great coverage that is reflective of player abilities. I never tried those exact values on M15 because I was concerned the run game would become impossible.

Now, PCV at 30 for M15 is still too high (still too much free-lancing by CBs assigned man coverage). But, if you're right (and preliminary experiments look promising), then I can now drop PCV even lower and balance it with a low Pass Reaction slider.

This is some awesome stuff....if I can get the coverage I want, I might actually start to enjoy this game.

[KingV2k3]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoshC1977

This is some awesome stuff....if I can get the coverage I want, I might actually start to enjoy this game.

I'm also seeing MUCH better defensive playcalling with CPU PCV "balanced" at 50...

It's interesting how much those two moves of +5 did overall...

But since there's so many things tied to too few sliders, I guess I shouldn't be surprised...

[JoshC1977]

Quote: Originally Posted by KingV2k3

I'm also seeing MUCH better defensive playcalling with CPU PCV "balanced" at 50... It's interesting how much those two moves of +5 did overall... But since there's so many things tied to too few sliders, I guess I shouldn't be surprised...

You're totally intriguing me with this arrangement....

(sidebar: are you using AM in the main menu or AP?)

[KingV2k3]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoshC1977

You're totally intriguing me with this arrangement.... (sidebar: are you using AM in the main menu or AP?)

I'm using AP in the main menu and AM in CCM...

Yeah, one of the problems with straying too far from factory default is the domino effect of playcall logic...

Because I've been playing a somewhat "static" set for so long, one change is really making what's "different" apparent...

With CPU PCV at 45, I saw a lot more two deep safeties and at 50, there's more Cover One and a safety down in the box...also more "run" blitzing...which makes shifting protection more important...you just have to play and playcall better...

And oddly, with HUM at 40 (as opposed to 35), the CPU offence calls a much more varied and balanced attack...and the screen game is VERY succesful, for a change...

Interesting...

[JoshC1977]

Quote: Originally Posted by KingV2k3

I'm using AP in the main menu and AM in CCM... Yeah, one of the problems with straying too far from factory default is the domino effect of playcall logic... Because I've been playing a somewhat "static" set for so long, one change is really making what's "different" apparent... With CPU PCV at 45, I saw a lot more two deep safeties and at 50, there's more Cover One and a safety down in the box...also more "run" blitzing...which makes shifting protection more important...you just have to play and playcall better... And oddly, with HUM at 40 (as opposed to 35), the CPU offence calls a much more varied and balanced attack...and the screen game is VERY succesful, for a change... Interesting...

Well I'm trying both sides with PReaction and PCV at 50/50....and you're right about the playcalling....it is much more varied and 'smarter'.