JoshC1977's M17 Sliders

[Sgexpat]

I wanted to take a minute to share some impressions regarding the last 15 games I have played. Each one has been played using the settings exactly as per OP at the time of playing, so I feel my impressions broadly reflect where the slider set is at and what remains opportunities to improve IMHO.

Impressions as follows

Great variability

I've put up 500 yards total offense in a game and then struggled to put up a measly 200 in the following game several times. I've been run all over (330 or so rushing yards by the Bills against me in a big loss) and I've stuffed the run too (had one game where I held CPU to a measly 45 rushing yards). I've run all over the CPU (one game with 215 rushing yards, and I've been totally stonewalled too with a couple of 50 yard rushing games). I've passed all over the CPU (one with 415 yards!) and also been stonewalled in the passing game (lost the Divisional round to the Bengals and had only 125 passing yards for the entire game...). The variability has not been as strong, though, for the CPU passing game, which I will come on to below.

Statistical outcomes

-Run game YPC for user is v realistic over the course of multiple game sample
-Run game for CPU close to realistic over the course of multiple games but may be falling about 0.5 ypc short on average.
-Pass game overall has been fairly realistic in many individual games, but for the season it is overpowered for user (YPA 9.1, likely skewed by some games where I abused the heck out of sub-par DB's) and extremely underpowered for CPU (YPA <5 many games, maybe if I add in the games the CPU does well 6-6.5 ypa. This is against not a great secondary on my team).

Game play

-I still feel like the pass rush gets completely stonewalled too often and not enough push from DL on longer developing pass plays. However, I don't think much more can be done slider wise here.
-Run game feels pretty good and challenging to execute (tip: if you are getting stuffed too often use gun-spread or other classic gun or pistol spread offense looks and run out of those)
-Pass game is really challenging some games, but its too easy to abuse horrible cornerbacks. This may have to do with the fact that the high safety/safeties does not seem to decide quickly enough to follow a go route to double team WR1 or WR2 down the sidelines. This offers too many 1:1 match ups against crappy DB's even where in theory the CPU safety could have elected to double team your go route. Often the play balance is fine really and I don't think I connect more than 1/4 or 1/5 deep bombs against decent secondaries which is ok, but I feel like some games I'm nailing 50-75% of these as long as I read 1:1 coverage against a poor DB.
-When the CPU pass rush is working, I have a real hard time moving the ball at all, which is how it should be
-CPU QB checks out of plays WAY too fast by checking down or throwing the ball away
-CPU QB does not throw to his downfield options nearly often enough except in the 2 minute drill
-CPU QB is just too risk averse in general, leading to relatively low INT rates for user, too few CPU TD's vs FG's, and too few YPA by CPU QB's

Misc. peeves - probably unrelated to sliders entirely

-It seems in certain formations that pressing does not press CB1 (!)
-Draw plays seem to be broken this year, or work too infrequently to make sense calling
-QB's , while more mobile than before, still don't take off enough
-I feel like its way too hard in general to throw against CB1 resulting in an imbalance where my slot WR often gets more targets than WR2 because of the way they all line up.

Opportunities to improve

-Upping the pass rush against the user may limit the number of huge games the user is able to get, as well as reduce opportunity to abuse poor DB's 1:1 as you won't get enough time to launch more than a few deep balls a game
-Can we make CPU QB's more aggressive down-field through sliders? Not sure. Testing on editing CPU QB traits was inconclusive / did not convince me this fixes the problem. I also tried generic playbooks, which did improve variability of play calls but the AI still had the CPU give up on plays too fast by checking down or throwing out of bounds.

[JoshC1977]

I'm still busy at work so I can't respond now. But, THIS is the way to provide feedback!! Thank you very much.

[Tweeg]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoshC1977

Yeah, would love to know how these work on all madden

First, I want to say that I've come to your sliders because I like the idea of not straying too far from the default settings. I feel like we've reached a point in gaming where EA is doing very little testing against the AI. In cases that they do, I'm sure they aren't adjusting sliders to the extremes we see in the forums. So, I like where your head is on these, and I appreciate everything that you're trying to achieve with the gameplay.


I haven't touched any Madden in almost a full 2 years, but still know that All Pro always feels too easy for me. All Pro has a nice feeling to it, but it's like the CPU isn't TRYING to beat me. I feel like I am just accumulating the stats that I want. Inside the redzone, it's more of a "Who do I want to give this td to?" instead of, "Man, I just gotta get one over the goal line here." Usually wanting to play a franchise as the Browns, my brain can't handle this. I just can't play anymore when I am finishing as 12-4 season, and the real Browns are 2-6.

Anyway..I put these into a test All Madden CFM last night to play a few warm up games. I chose the Rams, and played the week one matchup against San Francisco. I really liked the way they played except for the CPU run game was out of control. Every time they ran the ball with Hyde, my defenders were instantly just locked on blocks, and he was running free. He started with 2 carries for 110 yards . It seemed to calm down a bit, and he finished 19 carries for 255. Still a little wild, but definitely needs more testing.

The only other thing that stood out was 0 sacks, and not much pressure on either side. Again, just one game, and these things happen, but it's something to keep an eye on.

Not slider related - but I still can't stand the way players move and fall into each other. It feels like they're just weightless Gumby people with no momentum, force, or impact.

[JoshC1977]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tweeg

First, I want to say that I've come to your sliders because I like the idea of not straying too far from the default settings. I feel like we've reached a point in gaming where EA is doing very little testing against the AI. In cases that they do, I'm sure they aren't adjusting sliders to the extremes we see in the forums. So, I like where your head is on these, and I appreciate everything that you're trying to achieve with the gameplay. I haven't touched any Madden in almost a full 2 years, but still know that All Pro always feels too easy for me. All Pro has a nice feeling to it, but it's like the CPU isn't TRYING to beat me. I feel like I am just accumulating the stats that I want. Inside the redzone, it's more of a "Who do I want to give this td to?" instead of, "Man, I just gotta get one over the goal line here." Usually wanting to play a franchise as the Browns, my brain can't handle this. I just can't play anymore when I am finishing as 12-4 season, and the real Browns are 2-6. Anyway..I put these into a test All Madden CFM last night to play a few warm up games. I chose the Rams, and played the week one matchup against San Francisco. I really liked the way they played except for the CPU run game was out of control. Every time they ran the ball with Hyde, my defenders were instantly just locked on blocks, and he was running free. He started with 2 carries for 110 yards . It seemed to calm down a bit, and he finished 19 carries for 255. Still a little wild, but definitely needs more testing. The only other thing that stood out was 0 sacks, and not much pressure on either side. Again, just one game, and these things happen, but it's something to keep an eye on. Not slider related - but I still can't stand the way players move and fall into each other. It feels like they're just weightless Gumby people with no momentum, force, or impact.

Ok...so the standard complaints with default all madden.

Just curious...when getting gashed by Hyde, was it that he was breaking tackles like crazy or were there just massive run lanes for him to run through?

[Tweeg]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoshC1977

Ok...so the standard complaints with default all madden. Just curious...when getting gashed by Hyde, was it that he was breaking tackles like crazy or were there just massive run lanes for him to run through?

Yeah..pretty standard All Madden complaints. Other than Hyde, it felt extremely fair though. He had a handful of broken tackles, but nothing outrageous. He just had holes that anyone on these forums could have ran through. I wasn't even user controlling a defender, because I didn't want to impact the test.

I'm hoping to play another tonight though.

[Woad23]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tweeg

Yeah..pretty standard All Madden complaints. Other than Hyde, it felt extremely fair though. He had a handful of broken tackles, but nothing outrageous. He just had holes that anyone on these forums could have ran through. I wasn't even user controlling a defender, because I didn't want to impact the test. I'm hoping to play another tonight though.

Heya, felt exactly the same way about slider set and all pro difficulty!! Took my team of rookies to Cleveland to (slightly, sorry cle fans) drop their team ovr to 53..bumped cfm to all madden but left mm at all pro, otherwise used OP everything, hoping for some awesome mix of cfm all madden and mm all pro..game one did not disappoint!

Lost to bal 37-19

Pros: my Oline got beat repeatedly, blitzing lbs were often not picked up, bal ended with 6 sacks. I was forced to keep a back in if I wanted to try a shot long, and if they blitzed, one look and throw it away...felt awesome

My running game was slowed: 10/35 for Jordan Howard, a lot of that had to do win me being down and with bal controlling the clock...21:26 to 14:34 really had to focus on where lbs were flowing and very few 5 yards before I was touched runs...dline was shedding quickly and lbs filling appropriately

Their rbs were actually using moves successfully!! Forsett got hurt at half but their rbs were 26/118, 13/84, 7/29 which makes for around a 5 yd average. Really had to focus on user filling holes and making controlled tackles..loved the way this felt especially when I would go for knockout 3 yds away and get easily sidestepped.

CONS: my coverage still felt too tight. Flacco ended 64% for 269 but that is greatly inflated because of my stupidity..bit hard from safety twice on play action for big gains =(. In man to man especially cbs were sticking tight to their wr which resulted in 3 sacks

Their coverage wasn't tight enough. Once again if I make the proper read doesn't seem to matter who is running the route..resulted in Cody Kessler going 70% for 352...it was better than all pro for sure but that was mostly due to the pressure, not the coverage.

Overall thought the game played out beautifully, hopefully I can get in a couple more this weekend...if you find yourselves holding back a bit because you don't want to put up ridiculous numbers in all pro, I highly suggest trying out these sliders in all madden

Also for the injury test with OP settings had 4 injuries between the two teams all for 4-5 weeks so looks like all madden doesn't fix that =(

[JoshC1977]

OK...so big work project is done (for most part) and I am under orders to relax this weekend after putting in a nearly 65 hour work week.

So...Madden Time!!

I do agree that coverage (even on AP) may be too tight...I think it is leading to a lot of the CPU QB hesitancy people have commented on. I do think that DB reactions are dead-on though...it's a matter of loosening that coverage to encourage the CPU to use their primary receivers more.

I realize it is a fine line...we don't want to make user passing too easy either. But, the ease in most user passing is because lots of people do the very thing they don't want the CPU to do to them....check down, run short passes all the time, and just genuinely "cheese" the game. I think that even at default, if you focus on throwing to your primary receiver on a route and mix up play calling, it will be a solid challenge.

I will be focusing on the DPI slider first to see what we can get there.

Good feedback on the possibility of using these on All Madden. Goal 1 for me is to get these to play well on AP. We get that, we should simply be able to plug into AM for a better challenge.

[JoshC1977]

Quote: Originally Posted by Woad23

Their coverage wasn't tight enough. Once again if I make the proper read doesn't seem to matter who is running the route..resulted in Cody Kessler going 70% for 352...it was better than all pro for sure but that was mostly due to the pressure, not the coverage.

What kinds of routes are you running primarily?