Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

[Playmakers]

So as most of you know pass blocking for year in madden has been over powered and even when you lower the slider it still doesn't fix the problem entirely.

Well a few years ago i discovered that there were some ratings that allowed a great deal of seperation between run blockers and pass blockers in both madden and ncaa football.

Pass block strength
Pass block footwork

Ea stated that these ratings have been removed from madden no longer have an effect on gameplay.

Well these ratings actually do still exist and i believe they are the biggest culprit when it comes to pass blocking in madden.

You see a few years ago i posted videos of gameplay for madden and ncaa show casing the effects of these ratings when they are edited properly

Reduced these ratings down and you start to see a more organic pass rush on the field. You will see less patty cake blocking and more movement up front where a stronger DL can drive a blocker backwards....a finesse DL with high agility and spin move ratings could beat a OL from time with pure quickness

I showed videos of pockets collapsing based on ratings with default slider setting at 50 didn't have to be changed at all.

Well under player skills which is seperate from ratings EA has those ratings for OL locked so even if you edit their pass block rating and strength it doesn't change a thing regarding their footwork and actual pass block strength

What this means is that you can give a OL 50 strength and he'll still hold up vs a 99 strength DL

Now if we were able to lower that same OL pass block strength rating which is seperate from his actual game strength rating you'd see him get knocked on his *** or driven backwards a few times

For those who have followed me over the years in regards to my classic rosters they probably have witnessed this from time to time doing gameplay.

I'm going to be up front with you guys i think EA has a ratings system in place that they focus too much on organizing players based on their overall rating. I don't think they actually study how these ratings play out on the field if someone like you or myself want to play vs the CPU only offline in CFM

I don't think they know to what extent the Ratings and Sliders work as a whole when you start changing sliders. There are a few guys here at OS that have tested ratings extensively over the years and provided detailed feedback as to how these ratings would alter gameplay if edited.

Obviously EA can't release a game where your OL is repeatedly getting beat or bull rushed right into your QB.......i don't think that would sit well with their main money makers the casual gammers.

But if they are going to restrict us from changing some ratings they should start to add more sliders into the game that actually allows us alter gameplay more in depth.

[mpd3892]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

This explains a lot. I've tried changing every game slider possible and every player slider that might have an effect on OL/DL interaction, all without success.

I believe that the key to getting this game to play great and lifelike is to get the war in the trenches to work right.

Even changing player sizes (very small OL & very large DL had no effect).

Until, as you propose, these hidden attributes are unlocked, Madden will never reach its full potential. Until then we must accept its limitations and worry less about reality and focus on finding a way to get the most out of what it is.

I had forgotten about this part and remember those attributes. Now it all makes sense. Thanks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[fsu32]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

So as most of you know pass blocking for year in madden has been over powered and even when you lower the slider it still doesn't fix the problem entirely.

Well a few years ago i discovered that there were some ratings that allowed a great deal of seperation between run blockers and pass blockers in both madden and ncaa football.

Pass block strength
Pass block footwork

Ea stated that these ratings have been removed from madden no longer have an effect on gameplay.

Well these ratings actually do still exist and i believe they are the biggest culprit when it comes to pass blocking in madden.

You see a few years ago i posted videos of gameplay for madden and ncaa show casing the effects of these ratings when they are edited properly

Reduced these ratings down and you start to see a more organic pass rush on the field. You will see less patty cake blocking and more movement up front where a stronger DL can drive a blocker backwards....a finesse DL with high agility and spin move ratings could beat a OL from time with pure quickness

I showed videos of pockets collapsing based on ratings with default slider setting at 50 didn't have to be changed at all.

Well under player skills which is seperate from ratings EA has those ratings for OL locked so even if you edit their pass block rating and strength it doesn't change a thing regarding their footwork and actual pass block strength

What this means is that you can give a OL 50 strength and he'll still hold up vs a 99 strength DL

Now if we were able to lower that same OL pass block strength rating which is seperate from his actual game strength rating you'd see him get knocked on his *** or driven backwards a few times

For those who have followed me over the years in regards to my classic rosters they probably have witnessed this from time to time doing gameplay.

I'm going to be up front with you guys i think EA has a ratings system in place that they focus too much on organizing players based on their overall rating. I don't think they actually study how these ratings play out on the field if someone like you or myself want to play vs the CPU only offline in CFM

I don't think they know to what extent the Ratings and Sliders work as a whole when you start changing sliders. There are a few guys here at OS that have tested ratings extensively over the years and provided detailed feedback as to how these ratings would alter gameplay if edited.

Obviously EA can't release a game where your OL is repeatedly getting beat or bull rushed right into your QB.......i don't think that would sit well with their main money makers the casual gammers.

But if they are going to restrict us from changing some ratings they should start to add more sliders into the game that actually allows us alter gameplay more in depth.

so, you are saying that we cannot do any thing about this ?

why did they lock those ratings ?

[Playmakers]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

Yep even if you edit the offensive lineman to be 5'9 170 and lower his strength rating to 0 it won't make him less of a blocker because of the actual skill ratings kicking in while playing the game.

I'm not sure why EA would do this especially since we can't change those skill ratings.

[Tomba]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

Madden 12 had the most sliders.

I wish easports did a global edit.

this year nba 2k17 has "somewhat" of a global edit. meaning you can reach every player more easily instead of having to go INTO their profile. scroll a player pick a attribute and change it. much simpler and gives lie to nba 2k17 for sure now

for years ive wanted global editing like you and one game that needs it is fifa since fifa ratings are doen by a handfull of ppl that do not talk to each other.

madden would benefit from a global edit function

[michapop9]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

They don't understand how their own game settings work. They don't even know about every setting that effects their gameplay. Every time a patch or tuner comes out it majorly screws up any other setting but default. There's been so much turnover and new code on top of old code that I don't think it's possible for them give us multiple sliders that would be useful. One setting affects multiple other facets and they can't account for that because they don't understand it. So every cycle for the foreseeable future is going to go like this:

Game comes out, have to figure out a new slider set from previous year because sliders effect game differently this year.

Because there's fundamental flaws in the game you don't get the sliders perfect but are much closer. Bam! Patch comes out, effects more than it says it does and again changes the way the sliders effect gameplay.

Keep messing with them until about 2 or 3 months before next release and resign yourself to the fact that the games not perfect and lacks accessibility. You say maybe next year they'll get it.

Game comes out the following year, the new features are nice until you realize the sliders don't effect gameplay the way they did the previous year. The game also has some new issues......

Repeat the process.

[fsu32]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

Yep even if you edit the offensive lineman to be 5'9 170 and lower his strength rating to 0 it won't make him less of a blocker because of the actual skill ratings kicking in while playing the game.

I'm not sure why EA would do this especially since we can't change those skill ratings.

what about editing the Type of OL they are in CFM when you click to "edit player" ? Does this make a positive impact on the OL vs DL ?

[Devildog Frank]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

They don't understand how their own game settings work. They don't even know about every setting that effects their gameplay. Every time a patch or tuner comes out it majorly screws up any other setting but default. There's been so much turnover and new code on top of old code that I don't think it's possible for them give us multiple sliders that would be useful. One setting affects multiple other facets and they can't account for that because they don't understand it. So every cycle for the foreseeable future is going to go like this:

Game comes out, have to figure out a new slider set from previous year because sliders effect game differently this year.

Because there's fundamental flaws in the game you don't get the sliders perfect but are much closer. Bam! Patch comes out, effects more than it says it does and again changes the way the sliders effect gameplay.

Keep messing with them until about 2 or 3 months before next release and resign yourself to the fact that the games not perfect and lacks accessibility. You say maybe next year they'll get it.

Game comes out the following year, the new features are nice until you realize the sliders don't effect gameplay the way they did the previous year. The game also has some new issues......

Repeat the process.

I like this game, but EA's short comings on understanding their own settings is evident by one simple thing imo, which is, slider guru's will still be tweaking sliders and settings 6 to 8 months from now. I see it every year, and to the extreme that sliders are still being tweaked on the previous Madden even when the next Madden is coming out. I just don't get it.

[Playmakers]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

They don't understand how their own game settings work. They don't even know about every setting that effects their gameplay. Every time a patch or tuner comes out it majorly screws up any other setting but default. There's been so much turnover and new code on top of old code that I don't think it's possible for them give us multiple sliders that would be useful. One setting affects multiple other facets and they can't account for that because they don't understand it. So every cycle for the foreseeable future is going to go like this:

Game comes out, have to figure out a new slider set from previous year because sliders effect game differently this year.

Because there's fundamental flaws in the game you don't get the sliders perfect but are much closer. Bam! Patch comes out, effects more than it says it does and again changes the way the sliders effect gameplay.

Keep messing with them until about 2 or 3 months before next release and resign yourself to the fact that the games not perfect and lacks accessibility. You say maybe next year they'll get it.

Game comes out the following year, the new features are nice until you realize the sliders don't effect gameplay the way they did the previous year. The game also has some new issues......

Repeat the process.

[Playmakers]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

what about editing the Type of OL they are in CFM when you click to "edit player" ? Does this make a positive impact on the OL vs DL ?

Nope because it still comes down to their Pass Block Strength and Pass Block Footwork

You can change the player to zone blocker or mauler but at the end of the day your still not effecting their actual pass block strength or footwork

Ideally you'd like to get as many players reduced down in strength so that you can see more interactions out of the defenders when they are engaged with a blocker.

As it stands now it's almost impossible to see a DL blow up a blocker or just over power him because of those ratings being locked

To put things into perspective Reggie White in his prime couldn't over power a backup Tackle in Madden because EA has the pass block strength ratings too high....

They don't use a 0-99 scale for OL they seem to use a 60-99 scale and that's why player seperation is almost non existent between the OL players.

Just about every team has the same OL style of play do to these skill ratings being locked....

If we could manually go in like TOMBA mentioned and globally edit these players you would then clearly see seperation on the field from team to team even with the default slider being left at 50.

[michapop9]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

I like this game, but EA's short comings on understanding their own settings is evident by one simple thing imo, which is, slider guru's will still be tweaking sliders and settings 6 to 8 months from now. I see it every year, and to the extreme that sliders are still being tweaked on the previous Madden even when the next Madden is coming out. I just don't get it.

Believe me bud, neither do they

[fsu32]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

Nope because it still comes down to their Pass Block Strength and Pass Block Footwork

You can change the player to zone blocker or mauler but at the end of the day your still not effecting their actual pass block strength or footwork

Ideally you'd like to get as many players reduced down in strength so that you can see more interactions out of the defenders when they are engaged with a blocker.

As it stands now it's almost impossible to see a DL blow up a blocker or just over power him because of those ratings being locked

To put things into perspective Reggie White in his prime couldn't over power a backup Tackle in Madden because EA has the pass block strength ratings too high....

They don't use a 0-99 scale for OL they seem to use a 60-99 scale and that's why player seperation is almost non existent between the OL players.

Just about every team has the same OL style of play do to these skill ratings being locked....

If we could manually go in like TOMBA mentioned and globally edit these players you would then clearly see seperation on the field from team to team even with the default slider being left at 50.

when did they lock those ratings ?

what about creating offensive lineup via create a player and redoing the entire league - is that possible ? Heck, I am glad to try it out if it would help.

[StefJoeHalt]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

Being that I've actually been in studio and have done these 'hours of testing' myself with dev-kit tools, I'd really like to see the results of the greater OS community's testing because my observations back up Ian's explanation.

I have seen no "hours of testing" that OS members have done for ratings... sliders, yes. Ratings, no. Please, show me this testing.

As for why some of the overlap ratings still exist; they're all still used in the sim engine, while the newer ratings have not been incorporated. I.E. while you'll use RBS, RBF, PBF, and PBS in game, when you simulate a game, it'll use RBK and PBK in all instances.

So I pulled out an old quote above...based on this and "adembroski" had hands on knowledge from old team..it appears they started the change to pass strength/footwork.***n block strength footwork. And the Simple ratings "RUN Block and Pass BLOCK" were for SIM games.. Now, I cant seem to find recent quote, but I do recall something along the lines of those ratings were flipped...it would appear that yes those rating are still in use in game..especially if code is written on top of each other. Which is a complete shame to the game and us as the players.

[StefJoeHalt]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

when did they lock those ratings ?

what about creating offensive lineup via create a player and redoing the entire league - is that possible ? Heck, I am glad to try it out if it would help.

Funny didnt think of that..cant remember if in "create a player" if those ratings are "open"

[fsu32]

Re: Pass Block Slider and Hidden Ratings

Funny didnt think of that..cant remember if in "create a player" if those ratings are "open"

time to investigate. how many players can we create ?
maybe just create the average to bad guys and leave the dominant guys as they are.