Home
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-13-2014, 10:22 PM   #9
Rookie
 
NicVirtue's Arena
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Oct 2011
Re: Jump Balls in M15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big FN Deal
It wasn't just the tourney guys complaining, RC was an issue across the board for H2H play. To your point though, instead of fundamentally addressing it they took it out. In hindsight, it probably would have been better to just allow an option to disable WR straffing in H2H play, until the core problem could be fixed.

I think a main issue with jump balls, like with RC, is the lack of animations to represent a process for securing/gaining possession of the football for a catch. There's very few players in the real NFL out there snatching balls out the air, like seemingly just about any player can do in Madden. If they would represent that process of securing those type catches and differentiate player's capability of that skill, along with them being able to successfully come down with the ball, this aspect of the game would be much better, imo.
I think it's the lack of effort to TRY and go up and attack the ball. I'm really tired of seeing WR's wait for the ball to come to them, CLEARLY seeing that DB behind/in front of them waiting to snatch the ball. Also with the lack of interaction, jump balls aren't even a position/size/ability game, as it usually is in the NFL, it's more of a coin toss in Madden.
NicVirtue is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2014, 05:16 AM   #10
Just started!
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Jul 2014
Re: Jump Balls in M15

The ball seemed a little under thrown too.
turnagewe is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2014, 08:58 PM   #11
Rookie
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Apr 2011
Re: Jump Balls in M15

Its been said a lot already, but if you do not have independent outcomes based on SITUATIONS and PHYSICS, then you have Madden - all abased on ANIMATIONS and only very loosely associated with RATINGS to trigger those animations.

To be honest, I'd be OK with Madden staying with their tired old animations approach if they just spent more time implementing a more robust outcome analysis calculation into the process. Right now, there is not enough weight given to the outcomes on the disparity of the key players - like a CB vs. a superior WR (or taller, better jumping, faster, etc...). If the outcomes had more to do with things like physical attributes, physical abilities etc., then the glaring omission of a real physics engine could be more easily overlooked...as it is now though, there is no realism in the outcomes and it makes the lacking aspects of the game stand out all the more...

The other problem with this in H2H games is that as soon as something "works" in Madden, it "works" all the time - without regard to ANY other factors at all. As soon as you bring back strafe catching, you bring back the asshat who feels perfectly justified in running it 22 times in a row as a base offense. There will always be the other people shrieking that its up to the defender to stop it...blah, blah, blah....but it ruins the gameplay experience in about 2-3 plays.

I experienced the same thing in other online games though - its NOT just Madden online, its ALL games online...hell, even a game like NBA 2K14, which is widely praised for its gameplay and realism (at times) has the same kind of asshat players. You recognize them instantly - the guy who uses KD to dunk from a specific spot on the court, or a similar tactic with 3-pt shoots from a specific spot EVERY TIME...or the guys who use specific ways to manipulate goalies in NHL or FIFA games...

My solution is the same one I have been on about for years - MAKE DIFFERENT GAME SETTINGS MATTER and INTRODUCE "SIM" Servers and "Freestyle" Servers. If the game fundamentally PLAYS differently by turning on or off simulation settings, let the users decide which way they want to play and get out of the way. Trying to please everyone in a one-size fits all manner is what EA has been most guilty of for the last decade and its impossible!
TTD71 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Advertisements - Register to remove
Old 07-15-2014, 05:39 AM   #12
MVP
 
strawberryshortcake's Arena
 
OVR: 3
Join Date: Sep 2009
Re: Jump Balls in M15

Quote:
Originally Posted by SageInfinite
I just need better catch animations and receiver awareness. It just sad sometimes how DB's and safety's undercut balls and receivers just keep running and go into catch animations like robots.

I guess it really just breaks down still to the arcade movements and interactions. This focus on user control without enough penalty will never result in a realistic game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wordtobigbird
For real jump balls Madden would need a real physics engine. Where the players and ball operate independently. Like on FIFA when players bump into each other they interact based on physics not animations. Madden is based off animations so we won't have true jump balls. Just players both doing catch animations near each other unless they combine into one animation of a swat/tackle.
Ball and player operating independently....

Has anyone ever played NFL Fever 2004? From the looks of it, the ball and player operates independently in the sense that the gamer literally controls where s/he wants to throw the ball. And both the receiver and defensive back needs to react to the ball, organically, and doesn't looked scripted at all. If you want to throw the ball 10 plus feet in front of the receiver, you can.

With the feature, if you wanted to, you can pretty go 0/25 in pass plays if you wanted to, throw as many interceptions as you 'wanted' to, etc. The gamer is in control here.

Maybe jpdavis can send this video to the developers.


@3:15 mark (organic incomplete pass),

@3:27 mark (pass over the top),

@3:44 mark (complete overthrow),

@4:01 mark (completely under throw your receiver),

@4:10 mark (under thrown, diving catch),

@4:37/@4:52 marks (under throw receiver, receiver needs to adjust and completely plant his foot, or stumble in place plant his foot before going upfield),

@5:10 mark (reason why this is a very good feature),

@6:03 mark (defender pretty much out of position, and had to adjust and swat the ball, looks really organic).

NFL Fever 2004

__________________
Fixes
NBA2k Defense AI,Footplant, Gameplay
MLB Show Pitching/throwing
Madden/Live Animations Walking, Throwing

Last edited by strawberryshortcake; 07-15-2014 at 05:48 AM.
strawberryshortcake is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2014, 07:13 AM   #13
MVP
 
OhMrHanky's Arena
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Aug 2012
Re: Jump Balls in M15

Quote:
Originally Posted by NicVirtue
Being that there are no WR/DB interactions, I will assume that WR's will still not attack the ball at it's highest point, and DB's will still have more right to the ball in the air than WR's, no matter the size difference.

WR catch. 64, you'll see it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
OhMrHanky is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2014, 07:15 AM   #14
MVP
 
OhMrHanky's Arena
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Aug 2012
Re: Jump Balls in M15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cre8
I miss being able to turn around and square up with WRs to go after the ball with strafing. Then again... I miss a lot of the things Madden used to do well.

WR catch 64, and press and hold Y button (ball hawk) at appropriate time and you'll see it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
OhMrHanky is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2014, 09:06 AM   #15
MVP
 
4thQtrStre5S's Arena
 
OVR: 0
Join Date: Nov 2013
Re: Jump Balls in M15

Raising WR catching seems to cause WR's to get fasterr separation and get more aggressive on all catching situations; not that they catch more, but they are not blocked out by the DB;s as much, seems WR fight more for position... any increases in basic curl and slant catches can be countered by lowering Pass Blocking. Also On defense, the lower the reaction time, the faster they react to the ball, so:

Reaction of 0: ~ 0.0 sec reaction time to ball; may even effect reaction time once ball is handed off too...essentially reaction time goes into effect when the ball leaves the QB's hands.

Reaction time of 99: ~ 0.4 sec delay to react to pass and potentially a handoff..

Pass defense merely determines how often a defender looks for the ball: the higher the rating the more often they look for the ball.


So u can raise WR catching to get separation faster, most notable on in and out routes...Lower Pass Blocking so the QB obviously has less time in pocket without pressure....Then for jump balls just raise reaction time, this also seems to help the run game if you are not getting a solid average of about 3.2 yards a pop....

Then of course, QB Accuracy - jump that up and you see balls fall more into the WR area than aoutside of around the invisible WR circle....

(these are all just me own observations....I took a test team, the raiders, and placed all their ratings to 99 and just test sliders based on absolute equal ratings.)

Last edited by 4thQtrStre5S; 07-15-2014 at 09:08 AM.
4thQtrStre5S is offline  
Reply With Quote
Advertisements - Register to remove
Old 07-15-2014, 11:27 AM   #16
Pro
 
Haze88's Arena
 
OVR: 5
Join Date: Oct 2010
Re: Jump Balls in M15

Quote:
Originally Posted by NicVirtue
Being that there are no WR/DB interactions, I will assume that WR's will still not attack the ball at it's highest point, and DB's will still have more right to the ball in the air than WR's, no matter the size difference.
This might be the biggest issue. All the DB catch animations attack the ball while receivers passively wait for it. These animations should be flipped or at least shared by both WRs and DBs so the offense has a chance
__________________
NFL:New England Patriots, New Orleans Saints
NBA:Boston Celtics
NCAA:Boston College Eagles, Florida International Golden Panthers
Haze88 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Reply


« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

« Operation Sports Forums > Football > Madden NFL Football »


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:03 AM.

Top -