Press Row Podcast NHL 16 Thoughts & M16 Interview with CFM Creative Director Kolbe L.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by SageInfinite

The difference for me is that NBA 2k also looks the part. It resembles NBA basketball to me visually in motion. Madden has yet to even come close to making me do a double take during a play or even a replay. Post play they do some nice things, pre play still has some work to do. That's the difference I think some people see when they call out NBA 2k as a "sim" game. Along with the customization that you mentioned, NBA 2K also provides the base for a sim game with mannerisms, nuances, and interaction of the real thing, so when you add in your own "sim" tailoring, it completes the vision. Even if Madden were to add all the options in the world, it would still be an "ugly" game in motion. If Tiburon can finally fix that, they will be well on their way to ending alot of the 2k talk that goes on here. For me it's not just nostalgia.

I respect your opinion but I just dont think its shared by the masses. Ive seen ugly football games in motion and I dont think Madden even comes close to being considered ugly. Is it as polished as other games...no. Are there older games that look better in motion?...sure but its really only one (APF 2k8). But would I call it ugly in motion?....nah?

I just dont think you guys are ever going to get the game you want. Your expectations would require an entire engine overhaul, animations overhaul and AI overhaul.

Why would EA be inclined to do that? Millions of people play and enjoy the game as is. EA tried something like this with Live in 07 and with Elite and it was a disaster.

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

The problem is the numbers dont back that up. There was no immediate effect on EA's dominance of NBA basketball video games connected to that price drop. It was 6 years later when they overtook them and it took EA releasing 3 years of unplayable games. Your sim = success theory has been stated over and over again. The problem is that its hit or miss. There are several games (PES, Links, NHL 2k10) that failed to overtake their more arcade competitors for many different reasons. I dont want to derail the thread any further so I'll leave this here.

I'm honestly confused as to how this became about anything other than the part of the statement you originally bolded, which is what I have been referring to. It has never been my intent to get into another round about off topic back and forth, what I'm referring to seems fairly straightforward to me. The more sim game not overtaking Madden over a decade ago, seems moot to the notion that;

"...I wonder how many digs they would spew if they had 2k or someone else in the NFL marketplace with them. It's easy to be cocky when no one can make a game to challenge you >see NBA2kvsNBAlive. Then you have to put up or shut up."

Since Madden has become the only available NFL game, they have been falling short of sim claims year over year and it makes sense that doing so would be more adverse if there was a direct competitor delivering on those claims. I really don't see what's controversial or beyond the pale about that but I too will leave it there.

[GiantBlue76]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

I respect your opinion but I just dont think its shared by the masses. Ive seen ugly football games in motion and I dont think Madden even comes close to being considered ugly. Is it as polished as other games...no. Are there older games that look better in motion?...sure but its really only one (APF 2k8). But would I call it ugly in motion?....nah? I just dont think you guys are ever going to get the game you want. Your expectations would require an entire engine overhaul, animations overhaul and AI overhaul. Why would EA be inclined to do that? Millions of people play and enjoy the game as is. EA tried something like this with Live in 07 and with Elite and it was a disaster.

None of us believe that they will do that either. It's simply discussion and conversation to pass the time until another option comes along. I guess it comes down to how a company/studio views their game. Do they simply view it as a means to an end to make money? Or do they view their game as art? There are ways to accomplish both, and creating a work of art will usually lead to the cash. However, you'll never convince me that Tiburon and EA view Madden as anything other than a means to an end. It is what it is.

[MissionMaximus]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

The problem is the numbers dont back that up. There was no immediate effect on EA's dominance of NBA basketball video games connected to that price drop. It was 6 years later when they overtook them and it took EA releasing 3 years of unplayable games. Your sim = success theory has been stated over and over again. The problem is that its hit or miss. There are several games (PES, Links, NHL 2k10) that failed to overtake their more arcade competitors for many different reasons. I dont want to derail the thread any further so I'll leave this here.

aholbert32> Do you think Madden is were it should be in the year 2015?
I hear the Madden 16 talk about WR/DB interactions heck, that was done in 2004 by their competitor. Not to mention the great Halftime show in 2004 that someone with unprecendented access to the NFL still can't achieve. A game in 2004 actually had working penalties in-game and not only that you could actually do a replay to see the actual penalty on the field. It just seems to me that we should be alot further along 10+ years later.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by GiantBlue76

None of us believe that they will do that either. It's simply discussion and conversation to pass the time until another option comes along. I guess it comes down to how a company/studio views their game. Do they simply view it as a means to an end to make money? Or do they view their game as art? There are ways to accomplish both, and creating a work of art will usually lead to the cash. However, you'll never convince me that Tiburon and EA view Madden as anything other than a means to an end. It is what it is.

I have a problem with that. Most of this "conversation" interferes with actual conversation about the game. Take this thread for example. Its about a podcast discussing CFM. But it got derailed (partially my fault) because someone felt the need to bring up other games and competition.

Most of the people who come to the Madden forum want to discuss the current game or the upcoming game. They dont want a thread about screenshots turn into a discussion about how certain people hate Tiburon's animation or how the exclusive deal made EA lazy when it comes to animations etc.

FYI, as we get closer to release we are going to start to crack down on this sort of thing. If you want to discuss the state of NFL football games, the exclusive deal, older games vs. Madden....go to the Other Football games Forum. If you want to discuss features you would like to see in Madden, go to the Wishlist thread.

Consistently posting off topic (positive or negative) comments in threads will be considered agenda posting/trolling and will lead to a ban.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by MissionMaximus

aholbert32> Do you think Madden is were it should be in the year 2015? I hear the Madden 16 talk about WR/DB interactions heck, that was done in 2004 by their competitor. Not to mention the great Halftime show in 2004 that someone with unprecendented access to the NFL still can't achieve. A game in 2004 actually had working penalties in-game and not only that you could actually do a replay to see the actual penalty on the field. It just seems to me that we should be alot further along 10+ years later.

No but I dont really think about that much. It is what it is. I know EA's main goal is to generate revenue. I also know that they believe the best way to do that is to cater to the widest audience possible. I also know that they dont consider a sim (at least as "sim" as people here want it) as the best approach to generate revenue.

Knowing all those things I have a choice: Buy the game or not? I didnt buy 13 because it didnt have a feature I deemed necessary (30 team franchise control). When I didnt buy the game that year, I let my feelings known about the missing feature and moved on. Spent my money and posted about games that suited my needs.

I bought it last year because it had the majority of features I needed. Was I pissed about the penalty issue? Sure but I got over it and had fun with the game.

I dont take time to vent about what should be in the game or shouldnt. I take a look at the game and see what they added. If that doesnt meet my needs, I dont buy it. I dont see the need to dwell on whether the game is where I beleive it should be.

[PatsSB2015]

Quote: Originally Posted by jpdavis82

Yes, Josh is still there but Kolbe is in charge now. Kolbe comes from MLB the show and I'll just throw this out there, he said he wants to bring the story mode element like road to the show to Madden, now we don't know when but that would be huge for CFM! The main point he stresses in the interview is how broken a lot of CFM is currently and they want to get it right and he also talked about how stuff has been untouched and was developed by people who aren't even at ea or even in the industry anymore. Basically guys CFM is getting a much needed overhaul.

I hope this means we will get CPU vs. CPU back in CFM. If I understand correctly, MLB The Show has CPU vs. CPU in its season career.

I'm glad Josh isn't in charge of CFM anymore. I hope positive changes are coming due to this change in position.

[bucky60]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

Knowing all those things I have a choice: Buy the game or not? I didnt buy 13 because it didnt have a feature I deemed necessary. When I didnt buy the game that year, I let my feelings known about the missing feature and moved on. I dont take time to vent about what should be in the game or shouldnt. I take a look at the game and see what they added. If that doesnt meet my needs, I dont buy it. I dont see the need to dwell on whether the game is where I beleive it should be.

aholbert, I discuss what I believe should and should not be in the game, not just to waste time, but because, so far, we have no other option. So far Madden is my only option. And I'm getting too old to wait. I'm upset at both the NFL and EA/Tib because it feels like a wasted NFL Video game decade and I don't have the time to wait. Until there are other options, my only recourse is to discuss why I don't like madden and what would make me like Madden.

An agenda or trolling isn't intended. It's more frustration form someone that doesn't have the time left to be patient. Mid 50's and my best gaming days are well behind me.