Predicting New Madden 17 Features

[X_isBringingSexyBack]

Quote: Originally Posted by roadman

I know your last sentence is based on past history, but Rex stated in late August that the two areas that needed the most improvement for Madden 17 was CFM and commentary.

Don't know how they can think this when the offensive line AI--you know, the very core of football--remains a disaster, and there are mountains of visual problems that ruin immersion and authenticity. What's interesting and anger-inducing is that CFM and Commentary were the two main issues the MEDIA brought up, so they're now more concerned with what the media thinks than the fans that pay their bills, which we know to be fact since they've had a number of videos and twitter messages detailing how much importance they put into metacritic.

But that's misguided thinking if you're building a simulation football game, because the overwhelming majority of the media that reviews Madden knows nothing about how football works, and all one has to do is read/listen to the reviews to know that; there have been some doozies over the years. I mean, there are a few reviewers who know but none of them work for the major gaming sites, unfortunately.

Quote: Originally Posted by roadman

MUT wasn't touched last year.

Draft Champions was an extension connected to MUT, and Madden Moments was moved over to MUT which is literally the dumbest idea they've had in a long time since moving it to MUT negates the very purpose of Madden Moments which is to relive an exact moment of a game that happened in the past... can't do that when MUT dictates the teams and players to all be different, smh. MUT always gets touched even though that mountain of problems we all know about never does.

[roadman]

Quote: Originally Posted by X_isBringingSexyBack

Don't know how they can think this when the offensive line AI--you know, the very core of football--remains a disaster, and there are mountains of visual problems that ruin immersion and authenticity. What's interesting and anger-inducing is that CFM and Commentary were the two main issues the MEDIA brought up, so they're now more concerned with what the media thinks than the fans that pay their bills, which we know to be fact since they've had a number of videos and twitter messages detailing how much importance they put into metacritic. But that's misguided thinking if you're building a simulation football game, because the overwhelming majority of the media that reviews Madden knows nothing about how football works, and all one has to do is read/listen to the reviews to know that; there have been some doozies over the years. I mean, there are a few reviewers who know but none of them work for the major gaming sites, unfortunately. Draft Champions was an extension connected to MUT, and Madden Moments was moved over to MUT which is literally the dumbest idea they've had in a long time since moving it to MUT negates the very purpose of Madden Moments which is to relive an exact moment of a game that happened in the past... can't do that when MUT dictates the teams and players to all be different, smh. MUT always gets touched even though that mountain of problems we all know about never does.

Eh, come on X, you know darn well the lack of CFM has been a source of MAJOR concern not just from media, but all the various websites like OS over the past several years. A person's priorities don't always align with the other 5 million customers priorities.

[CM Hooe]

Quote: Originally Posted by X_isBringingSexyBack

the overwhelming majority of the media that reviews Madden knows nothing about how football works

I'd argue the vast majority of people who play Madden and watch football in the general case have no idea how the sport works. Nevertheless, those people are a very large chunk of the audience for Madden, so Tiburon must make a game featuring mechanics which are accessible to those people.

We'll get all of our authenticity eventually, but Tiburon has to actually teach its player base how to play real football first. They are doing that, slowly.

Quote:

Draft Champions was an extension connected to MUT

Draft Champions issued performance-based rewards useable in MUT and re-used MUT player cards to populate its player pool, but the user experience of the mode is fundamentally not Ultimate Team. There is no revenue-generating / micro-transactions based component of Draft Champions, and there is no pack-opening component of Draft Champions. In fact, one can play Draft Champions without ever touching Ultimate Team; heck, if Tiburon ripped Ultimate Team out of the game, Draft Champions still works and is still a compelling experience.

It's more akin to the restricted team-building mechanic of All Pro Football 2K8, confined to one game mode, the twist being that the pool of available players rotates each time one builds a team and also with each selection made. Dismissing Draft Champions as merely an extension of MUT is fundamentally dishonest to what Draft Champions actually is.

[redsox4evur]

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

I'd argue the vast majority of people who play Madden and watch football in the general case have no idea how the sport works. Nevertheless, those people are a very large chunk of the audience for Madden, so Tiburon must make a game featuring mechanics which are accessible to those people. We'll get all of our authenticity eventually, but Tiburon has to actually teach its player base how to play real football first. They are doing that, slowly. Draft Champions issued performance-based rewards useable in MUT and re-used MUT player cards to populate its player pool, but the user experience of the mode is fundamentally not Ultimate Team. There is no revenue-generating / micro-transactions based component of Draft Champions, and there is no pack-opening component of Draft Champions. In fact, one can play Draft Champions without ever touching Ultimate Team; heck, if Tiburon ripped Ultimate Team out of the game, Draft Champions still works and is still a compelling experience. It's more akin to the restricted team-building mechanic of All Pro Football 2K8, confined to one game mode, the twist being that the pool of available players rotates each time one builds a team and also with each selection made. Dismissing Draft Champions as merely an extension of MUT is fundamentally dishonest to what Draft Champions actually is.

I am definitely one of those guys. I have no idea what the differences between a cover 2 y banana and a cover 4 are but I still love playing Madden and football video games in general. And I also fit into the love playing Draft Champions and have never touched MUT, except for maybe playing a game. Before I used to play a lot of CFM but this year I put most of my time into DC because I don't have a lot of time to play (school, work, other games) so playing Draft Champions was a nice change of pace.

[X_isBringingSexyBack]

Quote: Originally Posted by roadman

Eh, come on X, you know darn well the lack of CFM has been a source of MAJOR concern not just from media, but all the various websites like OS over the past several years.

Maybe it has, I don't know for sure, but some of the reviews I've read/watched over the years centered on lots of things the "sim" crowd doesn't care about or find to enhance the game along with lots of undue praise that ignores piles of glaring football issues that we talk about at places like these a lot. It's gotten to the point that I pretty much only look for a review from 2 reviewers to know exactly what wasn't fixed again so I know what I'm getting, instead of listening to one of the reviewers from the major sites that's going to tell me it's the greatest thing since sliced bread, and is the most realistic sports game ever all while they're showing background video where I can literally see tons of issues in those clips that they apparently missed because they have no understanding of how football works.

Quote: Originally Posted by roadman

A person's priorities don't always align with the other 5 million customers priorities.

And I expect that, but there has to come a point where you do things because you know they should be done, not just because the media complains about it or because it shows up as a Metacritic trend. That's developing without a soul.

I'm not even saying CFM and Commentary don't need help, but how many times have we heard over the past 11-12 years that they were focusing on franchise? I remember a number of times myself now, and yet here we are again. Why can't the focus ever be on the sea of small details we have threads about every year that wind up being many pages long?

Now, with commentary, we didn't get as much focus on it from them, and I say sure it needs work and has needed it for a long time, but with all of the bigger football issues taking place in the game it would seem a better use of time to go after that first before worrying about commentary.

My question is, what is the point of doing anything if your offensive line continues to make terrible AI choices, and the game doesn't look authentic because there are hundreds of visual mistakes, half-efforts, and missing items from uniforms to equipment, to lack of weather variations and field conditions? If it's a simulation as they say, wouldn't the very things that communicate simulation be a top priority at some point? I mean, in fairness, they did show a focus on offensive line blocking and defensive line play in Madden 25, but as we all know, it didn't turn out to work as well as they'd advertised. So are they admitting defeat by ignoring these issues? Is that what it is? Because I can't fathom how with all of the major on-field problems that those two things would be the main focus; I mean I couldn't fathom how pass catching became the focus over those things either in 16, so it's really the same thing in my view.

[X_isBringingSexyBack]

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

I'd argue the vast majority of people who play Madden and watch football in the general case have no idea how the sport works.

I agree.

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

Nevertheless, those people are a very large chunk of the audience for Madden, so Tiburon must make a game featuring mechanics which are accessible to those people.

And I don't fault them for that, however...

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

We'll get all of our authenticity eventually, but Tiburon has to actually teach its player base how to play real football first. They are doing that, slowly.

... the fact that the game does so many unauthentic things with such frequency, directly contradicts that mission. It's hard to teach someone how something works when the teaching tool itself doesn't work properly to the level that it can be an effective teacher. I couldn't imagine being a football educator using Madden's offensive line AI as an example of how to perform the job of blocking. Using that tool, there'd be a lot of kids getting a first-person look at the fine craftsmanship of the bench, and a lot of parents looking to knock me out over it.

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

Draft Champions issued performance-based rewards useable in MUT and re-used MUT player cards to populate its player pool, but the user experience of the mode is fundamentally not Ultimate Team. There is no revenue-generating / micro-transactions based component of Draft Champions, and there is no pack-opening component of Draft Champions. In fact, one can play Draft Champions without ever touching Ultimate Team; heck, if Tiburon ripped Ultimate Team out of the game, Draft Champions still works and is still a compelling experience. It's more akin to the restricted team-building mechanic of All Pro Football 2K8, confined to one game mode, the twist being that the pool of available players rotates each time one builds a team and also with each selection made. Dismissing Draft Champions as merely an extension of MUT is fundamentally dishonest to what Draft Champions actually is.

Don't get me wrong, I like Draft Champions. But the level of effort going into things like that but not the things we complain about so often and have been for years is frustrating. We know we've been asking for those other things, but who was asking for Draft Champions? Where is the need for things like that vs. the obvious need for line play to be much better than it is or something else authentic to football? How many more things like this will be added before they tackle the very things that speak to the namesake of their mission? That's the question that keeps getting asked as year after year passes.

[roadman]

All I know is that whenever Andrew Wilson came over in 2013 as the CEO he is all about the player first. Since Rex came on board, they have had their 3 to 5 year plans.

Consumers have a right to be a influence in those plans and so do the people making the product. It's not always going to align in a perfect storm.

You asked how many times they said they were focusing on franchise in the last 10-11 yrs. Out of those years, I'd say Madden 10, 12 and 13 off the top of my head. Other than that, I feel it's been pretty dry for franchise mode players. And the backlash of CFM has been stinging since 13. I think you know there are a lot of unhappy CFM folks that post a lot of threads on OS on a yearly basis.

So, are you ok with the direction Rex is going forward with or were you happier prior to Rex?(except for 05) I know you mentioned you enjoyed Madden 16's gameplay.

I understand your frustration, I was harping for working penalties and Def PI for the last several years. There is a lot of areas that need to be enhanced from the last 10-11 years.

Rex said it on Twitter, it's all about time, resources and priorities.

[Toupal]

Quote: Originally Posted by roadman

Rex said it on Twitter, it's all about time, resources and priorities.

I totally agree that it does take those things. However, according to therichest.com
( http://www.therichest.com/business/t...nies/?view=all )
EA is the 5th most valuable gaming company with $4.14 billion.

If you'll notice ubisoft is is 6th with $1.61 billion. Ubisoft takes roughly two years to make Assassins Creed. In two years, they literally make an enitre world, story line, characters, and all the other crazy things that go into their Assassins Creed franchise.

In 2 years, since Madden 25, you have to question if their additions measure up to their worth. Granted I don't know how many people work on Madden, I read that 900ish work on Assassins Creed. However, Madden gets to recycle A LOT of their features such as stadiums, players, and gameplay. We aren't asking them to really do all that much with some of these additions.

I have a lot more faith in Rex than I did the other guys before him. However, I think the company of EA can offer its fans a little more than what we've received year to year.