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Madden's future of CFM is alarming

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Old 09-20-2017, 09:35 AM   #233
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Re: Madden's future of CFM is alarming

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Originally Posted by roll2tide
Not on you or your post. On the reasons EA gives for this game.
That is understandable. There comes a time where both the reasons can be true, but still wrong. I have been screaming for a while now that the development model is broken. You can't release a game of this size on a yearly schedule and be able to keep it at a level that is demanded. There are things that need fixed however the resource allocation won't be given to it when you have to deliver a "new" game every 9-10 months.

The issue is the NFL will never go for anything less than a yearly release cycle, so EA works within that confine which then means their development team does as well. I 100% believe if it was a bi-annual release you'd see a lot more done as well as a lot less issues. I have been throwing out the idea of a structure similar to GTA where the game gets released every three years with regular DLC (some free) and patches.

This model allows the "tech" to evolve over time and you can knock out issues as they come instead of trying to fix everything after a new release at once. Then when you have tangible new large scale advancements you roll out a new game and rinse and repeat. In between those you do yearly large scale roster DLC that would supplement whole new games along with feature DLC. In the end the financial aspect is similar to the customer over a rolling 12 month period but things come more spread out and allows for better control of the product.

Until something drastic is changed in the development cycle frankly there is little EA can do as a company that has a fiduciary responsibility to it's share holders to make money. They aren't going to take a year off to rebuild major systems and there is only so much that can be fixed in this yearly release model.
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Old 09-20-2017, 09:42 AM   #234
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Re: Madden's future of CFM is alarming

The hard truth that i grapple with is that madden is never going to be what i'd like it to be. As a franchise only player the writing has been on the wall since the change to CFM.

I'm like the alcoholic who wakes up every morning and says 'Today is the day! I'm never gonna drink again,' only to find themselves in a bar that evening.

This year i actually walked out of gamestop on launch day in a fit of rational thinking, only to download a digital copy two nights later when i was jonesin for football.

I just have to find a way to let it go because i've wasted money on this game 3 out of the last 4 years. Every iteration collects dust as soon as i purchase NBA2k. That will probably be this weekend this time around. I always intend to continue playing madden but after a few days playing My League i have nothing but disgust and disdain for EA and Madden.
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Old 09-20-2017, 09:44 AM   #235
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Re: Madden's future of CFM is alarming

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Originally Posted by T4VERTS
Understand that when Rex says that in the interview the context of the situation is important. It's not that he can't fix those issue, or that the "suits" don't want him to, but the problem is that any large scale rebuild or reworking of systems requires a large allocation of development resources. When he says marketing and sales tells him they can't sell that, they are basically demanding a back of the box feature they can really push. These features tend to also be resource heavy so in a either or situation the back of the box feature will win out of a rework of a behind the scenes system that may need redone.

With all that said Rex and the team have still been able to do these things but they tend to have to do them in round about ways over time. When Rex realized they had some extra time this year he started going down the list of legacy issues and trying to knock out as many as possible. When they have "back of the box" features closely related to other issues they will use that as an excuse to get inside of a related system and try fixing other problems.
The problem is they have said in the past few years that Franchise has been updated and upgraded and improved better then its ever been.

But nothing the "Franchise" guys want are really in there.

He did say they fixed a bunch of legacy issues, but none of the top 10 that people really wanted.

To ME, and this may just be me. QB AI, Playcalling and Gameplanning by the AI are ALL legacy issues. They have been trash for year, after year, after year.

The commentary, a huge legacy issue when you get to year 4 and they call your 4 year QB a rookie.

And the biggest kicker to me is that these issues all bleed into there money maker MUT. But those guys dont care because there to busy running the same 2-3 offensive and defensive plays against each other all day.

I can see why some of those MUT objectives are so high. 45 sacks with 75 overall Ware in your lineup, but you only have a week to do it?

Thats easy, I can get 10 sacks a game.

I guess the bottom line for me is they have double talked us with the "Oh improvements are IN the game" or "We are working on it" or "We see the issue and are looking into it" or on and on and on it goes. To only come out with a product like M18.

The QB AI issues are...I cant even find a good word for them. There HAD to be NO testing. Its not glaring, its the sun in your eyes.

The playcalling, an issue for so long but WE the people have a fix for it. But they wont use it? They are THAT proud of there created playbooks calling 4 verts 30 times a game? Yeah good job.

The commentary. "He spikes the ball, why did he spike the ball the clock wasnt even moving". Yeah it was you moron. its 4th qtr, 1 minute left in game...oh forget it. Go buy a coke and STFU.

The zones and man coverage are STILL broken. One play Marshon Lattimore is hip to hip with a guy on a deep pass. Makes a BEAUTIFUL play to knock the ball away. The next play Jalen Ramsey (10 points better overall) falls 5 yards behind a WR with 9 less points in speed, 5 less points in agility, and a Route Running of 68. What?

10 to 20 times a game Ill call zone plays only to realize when the QB throws to a wide open guy, running right past my zones, that they are STILL broken.

All of these things are glaring issues that WE ALL saw day 1, game 1.

Yet they made it into the production release.

Ill call bull that they even care about the biggest issues in the game. They only care about there money, and money maker MUT. Bottom line.
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Old 09-20-2017, 09:52 AM   #236
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Re: Madden's future of CFM is alarming

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Originally Posted by SteelD34KC
The problem is they have said in the past few years that Franchise has been updated and upgraded and improved better then its ever been.

But nothing the "Franchise" guys want are really in there.

He did say they fixed a bunch of legacy issues, but none of the top 10 that people really wanted.

To ME, and this may just be me. QB AI, Playcalling and Gameplanning by the AI are ALL legacy issues. They have been trash for year, after year, after year.

The commentary, a huge legacy issue when you get to year 4 and they call your 4 year QB a rookie.

And the biggest kicker to me is that these issues all bleed into there money maker MUT. But those guys dont care because there to busy running the same 2-3 offensive and defensive plays against each other all day.

I can see why some of those MUT objectives are so high. 45 sacks with 75 overall Ware in your lineup, but you only have a week to do it?

Thats easy, I can get 10 sacks a game.

I guess the bottom line for me is they have double talked us with the "Oh improvements are IN the game" or "We are working on it" or "We see the issue and are looking into it" or on and on and on it goes. To only come out with a product like M18.

The QB AI issues are...I cant even find a good word for them. There HAD to be NO testing. Its not glaring, its the sun in your eyes.

The playcalling, an issue for so long but WE the people have a fix for it. But they wont use it? They are THAT proud of there created playbooks calling 4 verts 30 times a game? Yeah good job.

The commentary. "He spikes the ball, why did he spike the ball the clock wasnt even moving". Yeah it was you moron. its 4th qtr, 1 minute left in game...oh forget it. Go buy a coke and STFU.

The zones and man coverage are STILL broken. One play Marshon Lattimore is hip to hip with a guy on a deep pass. Makes a BEAUTIFUL play to knock the ball away. The next play Jalen Ramsey (10 points better overall) falls 5 yards behind a WR with 9 less points in speed, 5 less points in agility, and a Route Running of 68. What?

10 to 20 times a game Ill call zone plays only to realize when the QB throws to a wide open guy, running right past my zones, that they are STILL broken.

All of these things are glaring issues that WE ALL saw day 1, game 1.

Yet they made it into the production release.

Ill call bull that they even care about the biggest issues in the game. They only care about there money, and money maker MUT. Bottom line.
Lot's of things here that's your opinion which and thats a good thing, but there are a lot of those to work through on a game of this size. Now understand what I mean here. These are your gripes, but to someone else there are different gripes and a different set of priorities. Now expand that over 8 million users and you can see that dividing up development time to fix ALL issues while still delivering new marketable features is a daunting task. Every new feature will have bugs, that is how development works. The problem is it is a compounding effect when you don't have time to fix the past ones, they just keep stacking.

The foundation of the game needs some serious work, but right now they have to continue to plug holes in the dam year to year. I think they (dev team) are doing an admirable job plugging the holes based on the conditions they are provided with. I am not sure you'll see any major jump in any one area until they take another look at how the game is released.

I will say that in doing some work lately with John on gathering feedback, there are a lot of different views on what is a priority to different people. I think we did find some pretty universal demands across CFM and how people play it that can hopefully make it in for 19.
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Last edited by T4VERTS; 09-20-2017 at 09:54 AM.
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Old 09-20-2017, 09:54 AM   #237
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Re: Madden's future of CFM is alarming

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Originally Posted by T4VERTS
Lot's of things here that's your opinion which and thats a good thing, but there are a lot of those to work through on a game of this size. Now understand what I mean here. These are your gripes, but to someone else there are different gripes and a different set of priorities. Now expand that over 8 million users and you can see that dividing up development time to fix ALL issues while still delivering new marketable features is a daunting task. Every new feature will have bugs, that is how development works. The problem is it is a compounding effect when you don't have time to fix the past ones, they just keep stacking.

The foundation of the game needs some serious work, but right now they have to continue to plug holes in the damn year to year. I think they (dev team) are doing an admirable job plugging the holes based on the conditions they are provided with. I am not sure you'll see any singular jump in any one area until they take another look at how the game is released.

I will say that in doing some work lately with John on gathering feedback, there are a lot of different views on what is a priority to different people. I think we did find some pretty universal demands across CFM and how people play it that can hopefully make it in for 19.
No argument from me. Everyone has opinions.

Mind you some of the glaring issues I stated are no opinion, but fact. They ARE in the game.

Though, in my opinion (Haha), no idea why the majority dont see them as glaring and needing to be addressed.
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Old 09-20-2017, 09:56 AM   #238
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Re: Madden's future of CFM is alarming

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Originally Posted by SteelD34KC
No argument from me. Everyone has opinions.

Mind you some of the glaring issues I stated are no opinion, but fact. They ARE in the game.

Though, in my opinion (Haha), no idea why the majority dont see them as glaring and needing to be addressed.
I made some changes to my statement to try and phrase it better.

As for the issues, with 1k issues ranging from major to minor people prioritize what fits how they play. A year off would benefit Madden in the long run, but wouldn't benefit EA or the NFL in the short run bank accounts.

With that in mind you either accept, or you don't, that change will come incrementally.
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Old 09-20-2017, 10:36 AM   #239
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Re: Madden's future of CFM is alarming

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Originally Posted by T4VERTS
I made some changes to my statement to try and phrase it better.

As for the issues, with 1k issues ranging from major to minor people prioritize what fits how they play. A year off would benefit Madden in the long run, but wouldn't benefit EA or the NFL in the short run bank accounts.

With that in mind you either accept, or you don't, that change will come incrementally.
At the end of the day, this is the reality of what Madden football is. Regardless of how far behind some people think they are, there aren't going to be any quantum leaps on any front. So as you've said, every person has to decide for themselves if that is good enough for them to continue getting enjoyment out of the series. It is for me, I understand that it may not be for many others.
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Old 09-20-2017, 10:40 AM   #240
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Re: Madden's future of CFM is alarming

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Originally Posted by Armor and Sword
Road,



Does it even matter? Sale and Marketing, executives.....whatever.



All that matters is the state of the game (AI) and CFM (I like it but it can be so much more compared to other successful sports games I play and enjoy a lot more).



Bottom line is.....Madden for at least me personally, has now hit a wall on this console gen. The crazy thing is the past 2 versions (17, and 18) are the best Maddens I have played on the field but they still lack strong fundamental on the field AI that other games capture far better.



And it is a shame. Because to me it obvious the power of the PS4/XB1 is not being stretched for AI and franchise on Madden.



But it is on other sports games.



Bottom line.
Armor

That's why I put in my last sentence, "Point being."

Just wondered if there is a difference in sales and marketing vs execs. In the gaming world, maybe there isn't a difference.
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