Could Madden ever have true role players?

[artofperfection]

They do in some cases have this already. For instance in some playbooks the positions for a certain formation are not just based on ovr. I believe it's the Patriots defensive playbook, the 2-4-5 nickel formation uses the backup ROLB as one of the 2 inside linebackers.


3DRB is similar, but could be expanded.


I wish the cup would utilize formation subs more often. It would make for a more authentic feel.

[Haze88]

Quote: Originally Posted by artofperfection

They do in some cases have this already. For instance in some playbooks the positions for a certain formation are not just based on ovr. I believe it's the Patriots defensive playbook, the 2-4-5 nickel formation uses the backup ROLB as one of the 2 inside linebackers. 3DRB is similar, but could be expanded. I wish the cup would utilize formation subs more often. It would make for a more authentic feel.

Madden has some preset packages in team playbooks. I know Atlanta had OLB rush in Nickel by default for Vic Beasley. But there is no formation in the Pats book like that, unless you are referring to the 3-3-5 odd which is 2 MLBs and an OLB shifted down to a DE-like position. Custom packages need to return

[Rebel10]

It's a great idea that is critical to NFL football but we'll likely never see it. Madden has gotten slightly better at positional ratings, over the last 10 years, but we'll never get close to emulating how in actual game plays.

In Madden, for the most part, your team is as good as your starters. In the NFL, for the most part, your team is as good as your bench. It's a sport where bench depth matters more than any other major north American sport (maybe Hockey takes the cake here...).

All teams suffer bad injuries every year, but the teams that usually go onto playoff and Super Bowl success are the teams that still have injuries but have depth to off-set them. If you look at the snap counts of players in the NFL, it's just much more diverse than Madden will ever give you, and it's typically not a stamina issue. Guys coming on and off of the field on every play. On every play there are significant number of substitutions on the NFL. It's why hurry up / quick tempo / change tempo offenses are so popular, because it doesn't give nearly enough time to make substitutions.

Matthew Slater has been to six straight pro-bowls. He's a guy who Bill Belichick, arguably the greatest coach of all time, values more highly than nearly any other player on the roster. Likewise, players like Tevin Coleman v. Devonta Freeman. Freeman is an incredible talent, one of the best running backs in the NFL, but if Tevin Coleman were healthy for that late drive for Atlanta, Atlanta would have won the super bowl because Coleman does blitz pickup better than Freeman. Madden will never be able to account for players like this. Generally every back picks up the blitz about equal in Madden... but imagine if in Simulation playstyle, pass blocking ratings really mattered, so a back like Dion Lewis was significantly better at blitz pickup than someone else, so it made you really think about who to sub in?

Madden generally lacks any situational changes to the game, which might be the most significant aspect of managing an NFL game. I doubt we'll ever see anything added because they lack a committment to the sim-style of the game, but it's a nice thought experiment.

[artofperfection]

Quote: Originally Posted by Haze88

Madden has some preset packages in team playbooks. I know Atlanta had OLB rush in Nickel by default for Vic Beasley. But there is no formation in the Pats book like that, unless you are referring to the 3-3-5 odd which is 2 MLBs and an OLB shifted down to a DE-like position. Custom packages need to return

It may be the Jets. One of them is screwy. In order to get the guy I want at that position I have to either formation sub him, or put him as #2 ROLB in my depth chart. I thought it was NE though. I can check again when I have a chance.

[R8ders24]

Not if EA has anything to do with it

Sent from my SM-G955U using Operation Sports mobile app

[timhere1970]

It wouldn't be hard to implement some of this. Just need some optional depth chart positions. Third down ends and such. I have done some of this myself through formations subs and reserve certain sets for specific situations. You have to do your own playcalling for it to work. The built in playcalling in madden is not sufficient on defense as it is incapable of considering down and distance. Which, is a huge part of football strategy.

[fballturkey]

You can do this somewhat right now with package substitutions, assuming you’re playing out your games. I do it frequently to get my Cohenesque RB into the game for screens/etc.

What we need are custom packages. Many of them are weird right now, like how putting in your RB2 also flips your WRs. Let me pick if I want a weird package with like a certain TE out wide and the RB lined up at slot. That would help us do a lot of the things we want to do.

The other side of it is player ratings like people have mentioned. Madden just doesn’t have a good enough rating system, especially on defense, for role players. You have it a little bit on offense because there’s power backs, speed backs, Redzone type WRs (though height needs to matter more,) etc, but on D it’s almost always a binary better/worse thing.

[TMJOHNS18]

Two possibilities I was thinking of were to either give the user a few sets of depth charts that can either be manually set or auto-ordered, or player designations.

The depth chart setup would be in a similar way to NBA 2k's substitutions (3P shooters, defense, bench, etc.), you could just use R1/L1 to cycle quickly through the personnel packages. As an added touch, would be nice if showed substitutions, if you go from Base-D w/ run personal to Dime w/ pass rushers, you'd see they guys change out and it would take time. If you offense didn't make any changes you'd either risk getting caught subbing/line up late, or wouldn't be allowed to. Same thing goes for offense, in its current state you can substitute everybody instantly when under 2 min. This is something that really needs to change.

A second and potentially less time consuming/complicated approach is player designation. This is something that can be built off of the current packages feature available during the game. In its current state its limited, but with player designations it could be expanded without having to change much. Instead of 'Scat Back' being RB2, you could designate/assign the role to any player you wanted. Tag guys as pass rushers/run defenders/wildcat qb/etc., and now you have more control over who you quick sub.

The only problem with the current package system is that you can only apply one package per formation. But, it would still be a step in the right direction if we could edit the types of packages (or even create them) for offense/defense. Even if kept simple it could go a long way, especially if it's tied to the gameflow system. The CPU could then run a 2MIN offense with 2MIN personnel.

One disconnect you see between the NFL and Madden is gameflow effecting snap counts. In the NFL, you see this all the time with RB's. If they can't block or catch then they'll be replaced by someone when a team is needing to pass more. In Madden, if AP entered the game as the lead back, the Saints (well, Cards now) would have kept him in until the bitter end, no matter how much they were trailing by.