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Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

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Old 12-18-2017, 03:15 AM   #89
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Re: Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

I am curious to see the numbers on MUT. I know I am bored with the mode. Now I can have HB Jerome Bettis as a LDE who potentially plays better than JJ Watt or Clowney? No thanks...

The cycle is just too fast for the game and what should be done to improve it. Maybe "Longshot" was a hit, but I found it to be a waste of resources and though they added Longshot player cards for MUT, the characters, IMO, and the statistics were uninspiring.

I would have used the resources, if possible, to eliminate some of the animation dependent game play outcomes.

I would have created a menu system that resembled something like a coach's office, locker room and team meeting room. The outside of the stadiums was a nice, little, addition, but its new value wore off quickly due to the lack of supporting pre-game and post-game environments. I would like to see players in the locker room before and after the game, and a half time that included a system to alter game plans with a nice locker room back drop with a white board.

The game is generally stale. Lacks life. Immersion is no where to be seen.

MUT player cards should be more dynamic. A user could invest in a player card they believe will increase in value due to the performance of the real player throughout the year, for example. I would like the ability to assign chemistry to player cards because at this point, I do not bother matching chemistry because, for the most part, I am not a fan of the one or two players I need to fill out a chemistry.

This year EA/Tiburon tried to promote users to create a team of players that were all on the same team in real life; Packers for example. As you got more team players and leveled up uniforms and stadiums, etc. your players, who were on the same team, packers, received raises in play rec and awr.

Problem was, AWR and PRC are generally useless, except maybe offensive line, and it would appear most people didn't bother with the leveling system once they realized it was a waste of time and resources. (This system, by my assumption, was put in place to highlight the new OL AWR system, but I would call it a failure)

Ultimately, and this is the very tough part, they do not need to allocate more resources to Madden, they just need to do a better job picking the proper areas to work on.
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Old 12-18-2017, 08:25 AM   #90
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Re: Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

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Originally Posted by DaGreatOne21

and thats not going help the game get better.



.
The ideas/suggestions/disappointments/constructive criticism is better served on Twitter where some of the developers are active.

The way to get the game better is to send the ideas from here to Twitter, based on my recent observations.

CM also currently works for the recent former developer of CFM of Madden, so, I don't think all the info that CM provides should be greatly dismissed, either. A person will process it however they want process it and should be given all options, and frankly, if Cam Weber didn't make you feel better, I doubt this reference will, either.(not a slight, just an observation)
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Old 12-18-2017, 08:53 AM   #91
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Re: Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

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Originally Posted by Toupal

2. Madden 13 reboots Franchise with CFM- Arguably the worst rendition of franchise mode, Madden 13 removed a lot of valuable features that we have yet to get back today. Because of this, Franchise had to start back at Day zero, and we still don't have a large portion of what we once had.
Here is a link in regards to new additions to Madden 12.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPvqzHvS2Io
This is the exact opposite of what they did this year.
I want to address this one, because I was the #2 designer on Franchise Mode for M12 and M13.

MUT did not make this happen. It happened because there was no way to bring the existing franchise mode online, and we were never going to have the resources to do it as two separate modes. We needed 1 unified franchise mode to be used online and offline, and however incomplete M13's CFM was, we did accomplish that.

Yes, MUT had decent size team and maybe some of those heads could have been helpful, but honestly, I'm not sure they would have made a dent. 9 women can't make a baby in 1 month. I'm pretty sure our team was bigger than theirs, and we definitely had more designers/producers.

We knew there was going to be a catchup period. Your impression may well be that M12's franchise mode was a better one, but under the hood it was not. It was a mess of legacy code going back to at least 1999. It was hacked to hell to the point that you couldn't remove anything for fear of destroying some basic system that kept the whole thing up and running.

M13 runs on a unified asset manager that can be easily manipulated by the designers. It has a very powerful test bed. Now, I'm gone now, so I can't say one way or another why it hasn't been used to its potential, but the potential is there. With a reasonable number of resources (most of which were devoted to Longshot this year from what I can tell), a lot could be accomplished.

There's a guy that was in the building when I was there, I wont name him. He was on NCAA, and he did all the rosters, progression, and stats for NCAA. One dude. They need him on Franchise Mode. He is a mathematician, i.e. his degree is in math. I don't know if he'd come at Madden with the same passion because he was a massive CFB fan, but that's the kind of guy that could shore up all the mathematics processes in Madden because of his analytical expertise.
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Old 12-18-2017, 10:52 AM   #92
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Re: Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

Quote:
Originally Posted by adembroski
I want to address this one, because I was the #2 designer on Franchise Mode for M12 and M13.

MUT did not make this happen. It happened because there was no way to bring the existing franchise mode online, and we were never going to have the resources to do it as two separate modes. We needed 1 unified franchise mode to be used online and offline, and however incomplete M13's CFM was, we did accomplish that.

Yes, MUT had decent size team and maybe some of those heads could have been helpful, but honestly, I'm not sure they would have made a dent. 9 women can't make a baby in 1 month. I'm pretty sure our team was bigger than theirs, and we definitely had more designers/producers.

We knew there was going to be a catchup period. Your impression may well be that M12's franchise mode was a better one, but under the hood it was not. It was a mess of legacy code going back to at least 1999. It was hacked to hell to the point that you couldn't remove anything for fear of destroying some basic system that kept the whole thing up and running.

M13 runs on a unified asset manager that can be easily manipulated by the designers. It has a very powerful test bed. Now, I'm gone now, so I can't say one way or another why it hasn't been used to its potential, but the potential is there. With a reasonable number of resources (most of which were devoted to Longshot this year from what I can tell), a lot could be accomplished.

There's a guy that was in the building when I was there, I wont name him. He was on NCAA, and he did all the rosters, progression, and stats for NCAA. One dude. They need him on Franchise Mode. He is a mathematician, i.e. his degree is in math. I don't know if he'd come at Madden with the same passion because he was a massive CFB fan, but that's the kind of guy that could shore up all the mathematics processes in Madden because of his analytical expertise.
So then what must we do as people who want to enjoy franchise mode to make them take advantage of this system's capabilities and put real effort into the mode?
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Old 12-18-2017, 11:15 AM   #93
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Re: Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

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So then what must we do as people who want to enjoy franchise mode to make them take advantage of this system's capabilities and put real effort into the mode?
All one can do is get your ideas/suggestions to Rex on Twitter, he asked last week about what the community would like to see in CFM and hope for the best.

All indications are that CFM will see improvements for Madden 19, the shot from the 2k team, the buzz on Twitter and all over, the hiring of extra people for CFM, and the survey from Rex last week.

For now, it's a waiting game till June because we all know that it will be radio silent till than on anything for Madden 19, although there might be some crumbs on Twitter.
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Old 12-18-2017, 02:53 PM   #94
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Re: Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

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Originally Posted by roadman
All one can do is get your ideas/suggestions to Rex on Twitter, he asked last week about what the community would like to see in CFM and hope for the best.

All indications are that CFM will see improvements for Madden 19, the shot from the 2k team, the buzz on Twitter and all over, the hiring of extra people for CFM, and the survey from Rex last week.

For now, it's a waiting game till June because we all know that it will be radio silent till than on anything for Madden 19, although there might be some crumbs on Twitter.
It's all for naught if they once again refuse to be mathematically sound. CFM is at it's core a text sim with the option of using Madden gameplay for user games. Until they put probabilities and statistics in the hands of someone who can employ them (and TRUST HIM), it's always going to come up short. Be it progression, stat gen, salary cap usage, draft ratings, something will always be broken.

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Old 12-18-2017, 03:21 PM   #95
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Re: Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

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Originally Posted by adembroski
It's all for naught if they once again refuse to be mathematically sound. CFM is at it's core a text sim with the option of using Madden gameplay for user games. Until they put probabilities and statistics in the hands of someone who can employ them (and TRUST HIM), it's always going to come up short. Be it progression, stat gen, salary cap usage, draft ratings, something will always be broken.
Thank you for the insight.

The question is, why would EA bother to shore up CFM? Even if it just meant applying 1-guy's worth of effort to shore up the numbers, what's the value proposition to spending that resource? The number of people that will care are a drop in the bucket, and as we've seen on this forum, even the most ardent and hard-core among us still buy the game year-after-year anyway, so if it makes no difference in their sales even among the hardest of hard-core, it makes no sense for them to spend the resources (minimal though they may be).

Ultimate Team and the perpetual monetization after the initial sale of the game is where all games - not just Madden - are heading (or already are there), because that's where the money is. Any and all changes or alterations to the game will be done with MUT in mind first, second, and third. Any improvements elsewhere in the game will be largely incidental.
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Old 12-18-2017, 03:38 PM   #96
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Re: Is Ultimate Team Ruining Madden (And other Sports Titles)

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Originally Posted by pietasterp
Thank you for the insight.

The question is, why would EA bother to shore up CFM? Even if it just meant applying 1-guy's worth of effort to shore up the numbers, what's the value proposition to spending that resource?
Because nobody new buys Madden for MUT. Nobody who doesn't already play MUT cares about MUT.

They don't market MUT to you until you own the game. They know a loot-box card game doesn't sell on its own, and sports games without franchise modes don't sell at all.

Also, look at Madden. What was the big new feature? Longshot. By your logic, what's the point of that either? The prime development directive right now is more users, more units, expand the audience. That's why we have play styles.

In fact, this reinforces my point. MUT didn't hurt CFM in '18, Longshot did.

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