Regression. WTF EA?

[Rayzaa]

Quote: Originally Posted by tg88forHOF

Strictly regarding backup/practice squad progression: I regularly have practice squad guys grab at least one upgrade point per season on default or near-default XP. If they have better than normal progression (which is who you should be targeting for developmental players), 2 isn't unusual. For active roster backups, 2, even 3 is routine. The keys are: Scheme fit: Depth guys need to be scheme fits to have a realistic chance of progressing (this is especially true for PS guys). This is fairly realistic...a scheme fit has skills and college experience that fit what the coaches are giving them in practice and film. If you want to argue that EA put too much emphasis on the mechanic, or that there's room to improve the implementation, I'd agree with you, but as implemented, it makes sense. A couple points in a few key skills is what I'd expect for somebody practicing, but not seeing snaps. Coach development traits: These make a big cumulative difference, and that's as it should be. Like I said above, development for depth guys should mostly be about how easily they pick up what the coaches are putting down, and both sides matter. Look at Pat Mahomes....a year sitting with a QB whisperer like Reid (and having an experienced dude like Smith take an active interest in helping) had him come out with "mental" skills way past what anybody expected. Adjusting auto-subs: This is a no-brainer. Snaps are huge. I think we're all getting used to the new progression world. 1-3 points of OVR per year, mostly among guys who fit in that team's world, is pretty reasonable compared the the real NFL.

I've never had a PS player get any progress upgrades from this game and you won't find any quick developers on a PS. At least in my game there isn't. I had a rookie LT rated a 69 on my roster but needed to sign a player in FA' cy because my QB got hurt and only had one other on my roster and then game told me I couldn't play another game til I signed another so I added to cut someone or place one on the PS. Well that LT was my lowest rated player on my OL and I had enough of them so I moved him to the PS.
Planned to put him back on the roster after that week and the Redskins plucked him off my PS even though they didn't need a OL and he was their 3rd string LT.
So after that I searched every player on teams PS and all are Normal Dev.

[tg88forHOF]

Quote: Originally Posted by Rayzaa

I've never had a PS player get any progress upgrades from this game and you won't find any quick developers on a PS. At least in my game there isn't.

I put Quick developers on the PS occasionally, depending on how I'm drafting for a position...if I have a low OVR developer with Quick, and veterans that are still workable, I'll throw the Quick on the PS. It's not ideal, but roster spots are how they are. At any rate, I was talking about both PS and roster depth.

And you and I are clearly having different experiences. I just finished a franchise season with standard XP sliders. Of the 10 guys on the PS, 6 gained at least 1 point. Of those 6, 1 had already gained one midseason, so 2 for the year. All were Normal dev.

The scheme fit and coach dev traits are cumulatively huge.

[Rayzaa]

Quote: Originally Posted by tg88forHOF

I put Quick developers on the PS occasionally, depending on how I'm drafting for a position...if I have a low OVR developer with Quick, and veterans that are still workable, I'll throw the Quick on the PS. It's not ideal, but roster spots are how they are. At any rate, I was talking about both PS and roster depth. And you and I are clearly having different experiences. I just finished a franchise season with standard XP sliders. Of the 10 guys on the PS, 6 gained at least 1 point. Of those 6, 1 had already gained one midseason, so 2 for the year. All were Normal dev. The scheme fit and coach dev traits are cumulatively huge.

Seems many on here are having different experiences. I don't know if it's the different consoles we have or what but some post their experience of having a lot of trouble with something and I'm not having any trouble with that same thing and vice versa.

So when I read the sliders some have posted, ....it may work well for some and not for others so i think it's best to try the sliders on your own as things don't seem to be working the same for everybody.

[tg88forHOF]

Quote: Originally Posted by Rayzaa

Seems many on here are having different experiences. I don't know if it's the different consoles we have or what but some post their experience of having a lot of trouble with something and I'm not having any trouble with that same thing and vice versa. So when I read the sliders some have posted, ....it may work well for some and not for others so i think it's best to try the sliders on your own as things don't seem to be working the same for everybody.

Sure, but that's why I keep going back to the variables that realistically make things different (no, not which console we're on).

Does everybody having issues with this have the same coach dev traits? Do they all do weekly practices that benefit the players on their PS with the same frequency? Do they all have the same number of scheme fits on their PS? Exact same XP sliders?

We don't know, because nobody ever checks that part. They just post that it's not working the way they want, so it's either a bug or a bad design. I get it...gamers do that. But those things all have a larger effect on progression than most people realize.

It's POSSIBLE there's some weird issue causing it to perform differently for different people....but that's literally the least likely reason on a long list of reasons.

[tg88forHOF]

Let me put it this way:

The first couple seasons of my first franchise on 19, I had a similar experience to what you're describing.

Then I stopped, thought about all the XP I was leaving on the table via scheme, coach, and practice choices, and now I manage young player development very actively and consciously.

Now I'm having a very different experience.

[Rayzaa]

Quote: Originally Posted by tg88forHOF

Sure, but that's why I keep going back to the variables that realistically make things different (no, not which console we're on). Does everybody having issues with this have the same coach dev traits? Do they all do weekly practices that benefit the players on their PS with the same frequency? Do they all have the same number of scheme fits on their PS? Exact same XP sliders? PS players are really the least of my worries. Sure I sign a couple here and there but most of the time they move on. We don't know, because nobody ever checks that part. They just post that it's not working the way they want, so it's either a bug or a bad design. I get it...gamers do that. But those things all have a larger effect on progression than most people realize. It's POSSIBLE there's some weird issue causing it to perform differently for different people....but that's literally the least likely reason on a long list of reasons.

I'm not talking about just PS players. I'm talking about game play and sliders being the same and having different results, etc. Coach traits got nothing to do with that other stuff.

[tg88forHOF]

Ah. That wasn't clear, because we were talking about experience gain and progression. I'm not sure what those other things have to do with this, unless you're trying to say that because people sometimes report different experiences with other, unrelated parts of the game, that makes it more likely there's a bug of some sort at play here.

But that would be silly.

Anyway, you're right...coach traits don't affect those things. But a whole ton of other variables, that are different from user to user, or even the same user under different circumstances, do.

If you want to say that the various mechanics we deal with are poorly (or just not) explained, too complicated, or have too many knobs and options to allow us to have a consistent experience, I'm with you all the way. I think all those things are true.

Look at this thread: people think AWR and PRC represent intelligence, when that's demonstrably not what either stat does in-game. That happened (partly) because EA didn't tell us exactly what either rating DOES do...not specifically enough to eliminate uncertainty. We had to take what they gave us, gather our own anecdotal evidence, and guess at the rest.

In the scenarios you're talking about, a bug that causes random behavior (beyond RNG we don't know about) in response to identical scenarios on standardized versions on standardized systems is among the least likely causes. Doesn't mean it can't happen, just means it's way down the list.

[Rayzaa]

Quote: Originally Posted by tg88forHOF

Ah. That wasn't clear, because we were talking about experience gain and progression. I'm not sure what those other things have to do with this, unless you're trying to say that because people sometimes report different experiences with other, unrelated parts of the game, that makes it more likely there's a bug of some sort at play here. But that would be silly. Anyway, you're right...coach traits don't affect those things. But a whole ton of other variables, that are different from user to user, or even the same user under different circumstances, do. If you want to say that the various mechanics we deal with are poorly (or just not) explained, too complicated, or have too many knobs and options to allow us to have a consistent experience, I'm with you all the way. I think all those things are true. Look at this thread: people think AWR and PRC represent intelligence, when that's demonstrably not what either stat does in-game. That happened (partly) because EA didn't tell us exactly what either rating DOES do...not specifically enough to eliminate uncertainty. We had to take what they gave us, gather our own anecdotal evidence, and guess at the rest. In the scenarios you're talking about, a bug that causes random behavior (beyond RNG we don't know about) in response to identical scenarios on standardized versions on standardized systems is among the least likely causes. Doesn't mean it can't happen, just means it's way down the list.

Agree,EA don't explain anything. Apparently the sliders aren't even the same. I thought at first they all made things better when going above 50 but that's not the case. Some are better going below 50 but how can we know with no tutorials?