RPO's

[canes21]

I know they have been brought up before and this isn't a thread asking why they aren't in the game. I am familiar with the devs saying the way the blocking ai and defensive ai are built right now that RPO's are impossible to make, but something about this has been irking me.



I forget how many years ago it was NCAA first introduced the ability to hold A or X on play action passes and that would result in handing the ball off and turning the play into a running play. You could do this out of all formations. I essentially was running RPO's without even knowing it in my dynasty because I ran a lot of spread looks with lots of PA plays where I would hand it off when I had the numbers. This feature found its way to Madden the following year I believe.


I'm curious as to whether or not it is feasible for EA to not look into that already created feature to assist with getting RPO's into the game. You literally can run if you want with the method I was using in my dynasty. Could the AI not get a script to read the numbers in the box and then make a decision based off of that and the QB's awareness on whether or not to go through with handing it off or essentially running a play fake and passing it?


This just seems so simple so I have to be missing something I presume.

[roadman]

Not sure if this is the right answer, but there is so much legacy coding already in the game and what I recall hearing this past summer is that old technology doesn't work well with new technology.

So, what may have been in NCAA several years ago, may not work well with frostbite and new technology.

That is my best educated guess.

[canes21]

I just tested to see if that feature was still in the game and sadly it is not. I wonder what year it was removed? You literally were able to run RPO's with it in the game. I don't remember it being overpowered or out of balance either as it was a staple of my offense in NCAA 14.

[bk1ross]

Who do i get in touch with terms of developers to show them formations Madden needs to add. Because the L.A. Rams playbook is not true to life....do to them running "11" personnel...the default playbook has I-Form, Weak, and Strong formations in which they dont run at all especially since they dont have a fullback on the roster....also the singleback formations have too many sets that have 2 TE sets....Rams rarely have 2 tight ends on the field at the same time. I have still photos of formations they use in singleback that are not in the game and the tight alignments by the wideouts. I hope and wish they would put this in the game.

[Darth Aegis]

Everything seems easy until you actaully do it lol. For every Offensive play in the game there has to be a defensive counter. Things like this take time if they want to do it correctly, months even yrs, if they even can with the current code. People need to realize there not making the game for just the sim gamer. Always hope for Madden 2020 but the playbooks havent really changed in over a decade so I'm doubtful. The sim guy left the building a yr ago, so theres that.

[CM Hooe]

Quote: Originally Posted by canes21

I just tested to see if that feature was still in the game and sadly it is not. I wonder what year it was removed? You literally were able to run RPO's with it in the game. I don't remember it being overpowered or out of balance either as it was a staple of my offense in NCAA 14.

That's not a proper run-pass option, the concept has a very specific meaning in the NFL.

The run-pass option as it exists in the NFL has the offensive linemen on the front side of the play run blocking - commonly for an outside zone run / toss / some other run where blockers move laterally, given that OLs in the NFL may not travel further than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage on a passing play. The offensive linemen on the backside of the play in turn are pass blocking for a quick pass. A receiver on the backside of the play (the pass blocking side) often runs a quick route such as a slant or slot bubble screen. The quarterback reads the movement by the linebacker / nickel back on the backside of the play; if he crashes the run then he pulls the ball and throws the slant, else he hands the ball off.

Aborting the pass part of a shotgun playaction pass is not a run-pass option. The blocking assignments are different for playaction passes, and a quarterback typically does not have second and third passing progressions in an RPO (though that is changing). He certainly doesn't have the ability to wait for long-developing pass routes or concepts, given that the majority of his linemen are run blocking. Allowing the user to treat any shotgun playaction pass as a run-pass option is not realistic whatsoever.

I speculate that the behavior you describe was A) deemed an exploit in competitive play and removed on that account; B) removed when all handoffs were rebuilt a couple years ago (this happened within the past three years but I don't remember which specific Madden game did it); C) deemed an unrealistic implementation of the run-pass option concept and removed; or D) some combination of the above.

[canes21]

I know what an RPO is. The point of the thread was a mechanic that allowed the user to nearly replicate RPO's was already there in the past.

[CM Hooe]

Quote: Originally Posted by canes21

I know what an RPO is. The point of the thread was a mechanic that allowed the user to nearly replicate RPO's was already there in the past.

I think my explanation illustrates why that the old mechanic you describe did not replicate or nearly replicate the modern run-pass option concept. It mimicked the RPO by providing an option to give the ball to the running back out of a called shotgun playaction pass play, sure, but it certainly did not provide this option in any realistic capacity. I went to the lengths I did explaining RPOs to make that point as clearly as possible.

If you truly care about "sim" in Madden, then you must agree that shoehorning that old mechanic back into the game is not a feasible stop-gap to the issue of the lack of RPOs in Madden for the reasons I provided. I want RPOs in the game too - the offensive concepts in the game need a refresh for the rapid advancements NFL offenses have made in the past three years, and they were popularized in the NFL by one of my favorite team's rivals - but I also want those new concepts built into the game correctly.