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canes21 · 06-08-2019, 09:55 PM

The OP I posted is under the spoilers. I am editing this because there seems to be a bunch of confusion about what this thread is actually about. To keep it somewhat short and simple, the idea I am proposing is that if we are going to be getting an ability system and are going to be stuck with it, would you rather EA follow the path they are now where a very small fraction of the league has these abilities so that stars are different. Or would you rather the system be expanded to become more like 2k's badge system where a lot more of the league has badges, some players have none. Some players have 1 or 2 badges that make them extremely specific role players that are only good at one or two things. Think Kyle Korver. Great catch and shoot type of player, terrible at everything else. He is a role player that badges have aided with making him play more like his real self better than the ratings could. Some plays have loads of badges. These are the stars. Think Kevin Durant. Can score in a million different ways. Pretty decent defender as well.

The idea is that if Madden expanded the library of abilities and all players had potential access to them that we'd get more player differentiation. More role players. More stars that are specifically great at the things they are in real life. I am not saying every player needs an ability. Some will have none. Some guys like Ted Ginn will still be rated as average at best, but will have an ability or two that helps make him become the true deep threat he is. Think of your team's roster. Think of their best players. Then think of your role players. Then think of your worst players. Depending on who your team is, your best player may be a superstar that has many abilities that make him play more like himself and they will become a true threat on the field. Your lesser players that are role players will have an ability or two that make them excel at the job they are given, but if they are asked to do more through poor play-calling or being in the wrong scheme then they are quickly exposed. Then there are your team's worst players. These guys have no abilities, they are all around weak players.

Right now Madden is just creating a system where we will have a relative handful of players that play differently. The rest of the league will still feel the same like they have in Madden the last 10+ years. If we can expand to have a great library of abilities and start assigning them properly we can finally start to get a game where all players are beginning to feel and play differently and more uniquely. Stars will be great in many areas. Good players will be good in some areas. Okay players will be good in one or two areas. Average players will be that, average. Ratings have been failing us. They are not giving us the differences in players we desire. If the ability system can aid the ratings and give us the differences in players we've been clamoring for for years, then why would we not want to expand that system and get it league-wide so that all players finally play more like their real life counterparts.

I am not asking all players get filled with abilities thus making them useless. I am simply asking for a vast library of abilities that allow players to start playing more differently from one another. Average players, role players, good players, star players, hall of fame players... they will all start to show their true differences with this proposed system. Is that not what we want?

Spoiler

Kid OS · 06-08-2019, 10:43 PM

There is no way a person could read all of that and say no.

Yes 100x. You should work at EA

AndreSwagassi86 · 06-08-2019, 11:16 PM

Are we referring to the Xfactor Zone abilities or the Superstar abilities.

I ask because we don’t have the number of players who will have at least 1 Superstar ability.
We know 50 players will have X Factor Zone abilities.

In franchise the Players Dev trait will determine if a player can unlock Either superstar or Xfactor abilities later in they’re career.

Now if we’re talking Superstar abilities I think every player should have at least 1 or in franchise the ability to unlock at least 1.

Comparing these abilities to badges in 2K is a little off the wall because majority of 2K badges are Not situational yet Randomly generated and Tiered We don’t know why some badges activate. With the superstar abilities we know why it happened and when.

Some of your examples can be used here like Kyle Korver

We Know what he’s there for he’s not playing elite defense or handling the ball well on the court. But he’s there for shooting, manly catching and shooting so he’ll at least have the catch and shoot badge ... it may be bronze, silver, or gold ... but the catch and shoot badge doesn’t activate in all catch and shoot situations.

But take an ability like Slot-o-matic on a player we know that lining him up in the slot is what keeps that ability activated.

All in all I agree if we’re referring to the Superstar ability and not the XFactor

Giving everyone an Xfactor ability is like giving everyone Hall of Fame badges

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Stats85 · 06-08-2019, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by canes21


	As we all know, the Superstar X-Abilities are only limited to the 50 or so players with the proper development traits. While it is a nice step in the right direction to bring about some real differences between players in the league, it does seem a bit shortsighted to limit abilities to a small fraction of players. It does make those few players more special, but I believe that you could open it up to where all players in the league regardless of their development trait could have abilities while keeping the elite guys elite by their sheer amount of abilities, their tier of ability, or any other way I simply haven't listed. Moving forward I would like to see EA really open up their abilities system. Make sure every single position group can have these abilities. Offensive linemen and special teams players deserve to have unique abilities as well. The game would really start allowing players in every position to start feeling more unique and more like a real player and less like the product of a spreadsheet if the league was full of players with all sorts of combinations of abilities. I think a system that allowed even your most average of players to have abilities would spice up the franchise mode and roster management much more than the current system. Let's think about how the NFL breaks down right now with regards to players and their abilities. Your average NFL player is good in one or two areas generally. He is average in a few others, then is weak in a few as well. These guys are solid fill-in players, can make some decent role players. Your good players may be similar to the average players, but instead of being weak in as many areas, they are simply average in them as well. These guys are really good role players. If you are only as strong as your weakest link, these guys are great pieces to sure up one side of the ball. Your really good players start to be average in all of their weaknesses, but also do a lot more things well than your average player. These guys are the guys you build teams around. Get a few of them to compliment a great player or two or even a star player and have some role players on the rest of the squad and you will make noise. Your great players are even better in more areas while remaining average or above average in the rest. A couple of these on one side of the ball already makes you an above average team. If you can build a team with a few of these players and find some sold role players you will be solid. You get into the stars and they have few weakness. They are good at whatever the scheme asks them to be good at. They still have some weaknesses, but not near as many as the good or even great players. These guys will make teams that are average elsewhere be hard to beat because they are just that good. You have to give them so much attention that you open yourself up to be beat in multiple areas. Having just one of these guys on either side of the ball gives you a chance every Sunday. Then you get into the guys that are going to be in the HoF. They are great in many areas. Generally well rounded players. They have few weaknesses. Their skills that are considered "weak" are still better than a lot of players at that position. There is no need to explain what these guys can do for you. One of these players can carry any team into the postseason. If Madden can start using the abilities to compliment their ratings and make those player categories really starting to become noticeable then the gameplay on and off the field will take off. We can finally look at 75 overall players, look at their abilities, see what they are strong at, see what roles they can fill, and make decisions on that. Look at how NBA 2k uses their badge system. Your okay players that are there for depth have a handful of badges at times. Some guys like Marcus Smart are just great defenders, but are not going to ever lead your team in any offensive category. His badges are all defensive oriented and it is clear what role he will play on a team. Kyle Korver has great shooting badges. He can catch and shoot better than anyone. He can nail down some contested 3's better than most. He can't stop a cold and if you want him out there doing anything other than to score then you are not gonna be happy. Then you have guys like Draymond Green. He is great defensively. An elite defender and his badges show that. He also has some decent offensive badges. He is a well rounded player who leans defensively, but is a great piece to add to a stacked lineup. Then you go to your stars. These guys have 20-30+ badges. They are elite offensively. They are near elite defensively. They have badges that make them outhustle everyone on the court. They have badges that allow them to make the opponent work so hard they drain their stamina at higher rates. Just one of them will carry you into the playoffs... in the Eastern conference. I know Madden struggles with implementing features one year and actually working on them in future releases, but if they can actually take the foundation they are laying here and open it up with many many more abilities that are open to all players we can start seeing player separation much like NBA 2k has. Building a huge abilities system will only help the ratings system that constantly suffers year in and year out. Adding tiers to the abilities and limiting certain animation to certain abilities and tiers will bring about even more differentiation. Should Madden build up their abilities system and expand it to where all players can have certain abilities?

They should expand it

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canes21 · 06-08-2019, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndreSwagassi86


	Are we referring to the Xfactor Zone abilities or the Superstar abilities. I ask because we don’t have the number of players who will have at least 1 Superstar ability. We know 50 players will have X Factor Zone abilities. In franchise the Players Dev trait will determine if a player can unlock Either superstar or Xfactor abilities later in they’re career. Now if we’re talking Superstar abilities I think every player should have at least 1 or in franchise the ability to unlock at least 1. Comparing these abilities to badges in 2K is a little off the wall because majority of 2K badges are Not situational yet Randomly generated and Tiered We don’t know why some badges activate. With the superstar abilities we know why it happened and when. Some of your examples can be used here like Kyle Korver We Know what he’s there for he’s not playing elite defense or handling the ball well on the court. But he’s there for shooting, manly catching and shooting so he’ll at least have the catch and shoot badge ... it may be bronze, silver, or gold ... but the catch and shoot badge doesn’t activate in all catch and shoot situations. But take an ability like Slot-o-matic on a player we know that lining him up in the slot is what keeps that ability activated. All in all I agree if we’re referring to the Superstar ability and not the XFactor Giving everyone an Xfactor ability is like giving everyone Hall of Fame badges Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

As I tried to explain in the OP, the idea is to expand on the current abilities in place and build up a library of abilities for all positions. Abilities that create the equivalent of a Kyle Korver type role player for your team. A guy that is not a great player, he is good at best, mostly average at this point, but he has abilities that give him a role that can make him successful in the right offense being used in the right way.

AndreSwagassi86 · 06-08-2019, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by canes21


	As I tried to explain in the OP, the idea is to expand on the current abilities in place and build up a library of abilities for all positions. Abilities that create the equivalent of a Kyle Korver type role player for your team. A guy that is not a great player, he is good at best, mostly average at this point, but he has abilities that give him a role that can make him successful in the right offense being used in the right way.

I got that , I’m just asking do you feel each player should have a Zone ability ... as those are the ones only distributed to 50 players.

Or The Superstar abilities ...

There’s a difference between the two. And I don’t feel every player should have a Zone ability. But yes/no every player should have at least 1 Superstar ability or in franchise the ability to develop at least 1.

Edit: it’s said to be at least 100+ Superstar abilities , so there might be a large number of players who have at least 1....

I say yes and no because I’m franchise the players should be able to develop at least 1 ability

2K can be used as an example again , every player in 2K doesn’t have a badge. But in MyGM the mentor system allows for development of 1

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Kid OS · 06-09-2019, 12:15 AM

The easiest way to clean up this mess is by giving each player different tendencies.

pump fake, take off, audible, call timeout, force pass, take sack, throw ball away, cover up ball, truck, spin, juke, hurdle, fall vs reach, run after catch, secure ball, aggressive catch, tip-toe, break route, sit in zone, line up on ball, double move at line, chop block, double end vs tackle, drive block, form pocket, chip end, release on blitz, quick blitz, patient blitz, bulldoze, finesse, put hand up, abort rush, stay in zone vs lurk, watch QB, call audible, call timeout, pursue quickly vs safely, rip ball, go for INT, play WR's hands, turn head around, undercut route, trail receiver, face QB, long vs short backpedal, slow vs fast backpedal, shuffle technique, T- step technique, physical press, interference, low stance, high stance, big hit, secure tackle, break on ball vs break on WR's hips, fair catch, chase ball, let bounce, catch on run, run towards sidelines vs middle, kick middle, kick right, kick left, etc

canes21 · 06-09-2019, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndreSwagassi86


	I got that , I’m just asking do you feel each player should have a Zone ability ... as those are the ones only distributed to 50 players. Or The Superstar abilities ... There’s a difference between the two. And I don’t feel every player should have a Zone ability. But yes/no every player should have at least 1 Superstar ability or in franchise the ability to develop at least 1. Edit: it’s said to be at least 100+ Superstar abilities , so there might be a large number of players who have at least 1.... I say yes and no because I’m franchise the players should be able to develop at least 1 ability 2K can be used as an example again , every player in 2K doesn’t have a badge. But in MyGM the mentor system allows for development of 1 Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

The idea behind this thread is that every player should have the ability to have any ability or zone ability regardless of their development trait. This doesn't mean every player should have at least one ability of any sort. I just think it would better serve the gameplay if we had more abilities of both types that were available for all players.

View Poll Results: Should all players have the potential to have abilities?
Yes	13	44.83%
No	10	34.48%
You really typed all of that?	6	20.69%
Voters: 29. You may not vote on this poll

06-08-2019, 09:55 PM	#1
canes21 Hall Of Fame OVR: 41 Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Tennessee Blog Entries: 2	Should the X-Abilities be expanded to be available to all players? The OP I posted is under the spoilers. I am editing this because there seems to be a bunch of confusion about what this thread is actually about. To keep it somewhat short and simple, the idea I am proposing is that if we are going to be getting an ability system and are going to be stuck with it, would you rather EA follow the path they are now where a very small fraction of the league has these abilities so that stars are different. Or would you rather the system be expanded to become more like 2k's badge system where a lot more of the league has badges, some players have none. Some players have 1 or 2 badges that make them extremely specific role players that are only good at one or two things. Think Kyle Korver. Great catch and shoot type of player, terrible at everything else. He is a role player that badges have aided with making him play more like his real self better than the ratings could. Some plays have loads of badges. These are the stars. Think Kevin Durant. Can score in a million different ways. Pretty decent defender as well. The idea is that if Madden expanded the library of abilities and all players had potential access to them that we'd get more player differentiation. More role players. More stars that are specifically great at the things they are in real life. I am not saying every player needs an ability. Some will have none. Some guys like Ted Ginn will still be rated as average at best, but will have an ability or two that helps make him become the true deep threat he is. Think of your team's roster. Think of their best players. Then think of your role players. Then think of your worst players. Depending on who your team is, your best player may be a superstar that has many abilities that make him play more like himself and they will become a true threat on the field. Your lesser players that are role players will have an ability or two that make them excel at the job they are given, but if they are asked to do more through poor play-calling or being in the wrong scheme then they are quickly exposed. Then there are your team's worst players. These guys have no abilities, they are all around weak players. Right now Madden is just creating a system where we will have a relative handful of players that play differently. The rest of the league will still feel the same like they have in Madden the last 10+ years. If we can expand to have a great library of abilities and start assigning them properly we can finally start to get a game where all players are beginning to feel and play differently and more uniquely. Stars will be great in many areas. Good players will be good in some areas. Okay players will be good in one or two areas. Average players will be that, average. Ratings have been failing us. They are not giving us the differences in players we desire. If the ability system can aid the ratings and give us the differences in players we've been clamoring for for years, then why would we not want to expand that system and get it league-wide so that all players finally play more like their real life counterparts. I am not asking all players get filled with abilities thus making them useless. I am simply asking for a vast library of abilities that allow players to start playing more differently from one another. Average players, role players, good players, star players, hall of fame players... they will all start to show their true differences with this proposed system. Is that not what we want? Spoiler As we all know, the Superstar X-Abilities are only limited to the 50 or so players with the proper development traits. While it is a nice step in the right direction to bring about some real differences between players in the league, it does seem a bit shortsighted to limit abilities to a small fraction of players. It does make those few players more special, but I believe that you could open it up to where all players in the league regardless of their development trait could have abilities while keeping the elite guys elite by their sheer amount of abilities, their tier of ability, or any other way I simply haven't listed. Moving forward I would like to see EA really open up their abilities system. Make sure every single position group can have these abilities. Offensive linemen and special teams players deserve to have unique abilities as well. The game would really start allowing players in every position to start feeling more unique and more like a real player and less like the product of a spreadsheet if the league was full of players with all sorts of combinations of abilities. I think a system that allowed even your most average of players to have abilities would spice up the franchise mode and roster management much more than the current system. Let's think about how the NFL breaks down right now with regards to players and their abilities. Your average NFL player is good in one or two areas generally. He is average in a few others, then is weak in a few as well. These guys are solid fill-in players, can make some decent role players. Your good players may be similar to the average players, but instead of being weak in as many areas, they are simply average in them as well. These guys are really good role players. If you are only as strong as your weakest link, these guys are great pieces to sure up one side of the ball. Your really good players start to be average in all of their weaknesses, but also do a lot more things well than your average player. These guys are the guys you build teams around. Get a few of them to compliment a great player or two or even a star player and have some role players on the rest of the squad and you will make noise. Your great players are even better in more areas while remaining average or above average in the rest. A couple of these on one side of the ball already makes you an above average team. If you can build a team with a few of these players and find some sold role players you will be solid. You get into the stars and they have few weakness. They are good at whatever the scheme asks them to be good at. They still have some weaknesses, but not near as many as the good or even great players. These guys will make teams that are average elsewhere be hard to beat because they are just that good. You have to give them so much attention that you open yourself up to be beat in multiple areas. Having just one of these guys on either side of the ball gives you a chance every Sunday. Then you get into the guys that are going to be in the HoF. They are great in many areas. Generally well rounded players. They have few weaknesses. Their skills that are considered "weak" are still better than a lot of players at that position. There is no need to explain what these guys can do for you. One of these players can carry any team into the postseason. If Madden can start using the abilities to compliment their ratings and make those player categories really starting to become noticeable then the gameplay on and off the field will take off. We can finally look at 75 overall players, look at their abilities, see what they are strong at, see what roles they can fill, and make decisions on that. Look at how NBA 2k uses their badge system. Your okay players that are there for depth have a handful of badges at times. Some guys like Marcus Smart are just great defenders, but are not going to ever lead your team in any offensive category. His badges are all defensive oriented and it is clear what role he will play on a team. Kyle Korver has great shooting badges. He can catch and shoot better than anyone. He can nail down some contested 3's better than most. He can't stop a cold and if you want him out there doing anything other than to score then you are not gonna be happy. Then you have guys like Draymond Green. He is great defensively. An elite defender and his badges show that. He also has some decent offensive badges. He is a well rounded player who leans defensively, but is a great piece to add to a stacked lineup. Then you go to your stars. These guys have 20-30+ badges. They are elite offensively. They are near elite defensively. They have badges that make them outhustle everyone on the court. They have badges that allow them to make the opponent work so hard they drain their stamina at higher rates. Just one of them will carry you into the playoffs... in the Eastern conference. I know Madden struggles with implementing features one year and actually working on them in future releases, but if they can actually take the foundation they are laying here and open it up with many many more abilities that are open to all players we can start seeing player separation much like NBA 2k has. Building a huge abilities system will only help the ratings system that constantly suffers year in and year out. Adding tiers to the abilities and limiting certain animation to certain abilities and tiers will bring about even more differentiation. Should Madden build up their abilities system and expand it to where all players can have certain abilities? CT Pittbull, scitychamps87, 4thQtrStre5S and 3 others like this. __________________ “No one is more hated than he who speaks the truth.” ― Plato Last edited by canes21; 06-09-2019 at 01:12 PM.

06-08-2019, 10:43 PM	#2
Kid OS Pro OVR: 0 Join Date: Sep 2016	Re: Should the X-Abilities be expanded to be available to all players? There is no way a person could read all of that and say no. Yes 100x. You should work at EA scitychamps87 likes this.

06-08-2019, 11:16 PM	#3
AndreSwagassi86 Rookie OVR: 0 Join Date: Oct 2014	Re: Should the X-Abilities be expanded to be available to all players? Are we referring to the Xfactor Zone abilities or the Superstar abilities. I ask because we don’t have the number of players who will have at least 1 Superstar ability. We know 50 players will have X Factor Zone abilities. In franchise the Players Dev trait will determine if a player can unlock Either superstar or Xfactor abilities later in they’re career. Now if we’re talking Superstar abilities I think every player should have at least 1 or in franchise the ability to unlock at least 1. Comparing these abilities to badges in 2K is a little off the wall because majority of 2K badges are Not situational yet Randomly generated and Tiered We don’t know why some badges activate. With the superstar abilities we know why it happened and when. Some of your examples can be used here like Kyle Korver We Know what he’s there for he’s not playing elite defense or handling the ball well on the court. But he’s there for shooting, manly catching and shooting so he’ll at least have the catch and shoot badge ... it may be bronze, silver, or gold ... but the catch and shoot badge doesn’t activate in all catch and shoot situations. But take an ability like Slot-o-matic on a player we know that lining him up in the slot is what keeps that ability activated. All in all I agree if we’re referring to the Superstar ability and not the XFactor Giving everyone an Xfactor ability is like giving everyone Hall of Fame badges Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports crunchy10 likes this.

06-09-2019, 12:15 AM	#7
Kid OS Pro OVR: 0 Join Date: Sep 2016	Re: Should the X-Abilities be expanded to be available to all players? The easiest way to clean up this mess is by giving each player different tendencies. pump fake, take off, audible, call timeout, force pass, take sack, throw ball away, cover up ball, truck, spin, juke, hurdle, fall vs reach, run after catch, secure ball, aggressive catch, tip-toe, break route, sit in zone, line up on ball, double move at line, chop block, double end vs tackle, drive block, form pocket, chip end, release on blitz, quick blitz, patient blitz, bulldoze, finesse, put hand up, abort rush, stay in zone vs lurk, watch QB, call audible, call timeout, pursue quickly vs safely, rip ball, go for INT, play WR's hands, turn head around, undercut route, trail receiver, face QB, long vs short backpedal, slow vs fast backpedal, shuffle technique, T- step technique, physical press, interference, low stance, high stance, big hit, secure tackle, break on ball vs break on WR's hips, fair catch, chase ball, let bounce, catch on run, run towards sidelines vs middle, kick middle, kick right, kick left, etc

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Should the X-Abilities be expanded to be available to all players?