Confirmation that there will be no refs?

[Kid OS]

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

Huh? The difference between shaving my eyebrows and not shaving my eyebrows doesn't have the millions of dollars and thousands of man-hours attached to the consequences which comes with deciding what to work on in a AAA game development schedule. If I'm wrong about that, though, please do tell me which way I should style my face as to make that money enter my bank account.

Go to a plastic surgeon and ask for the Kardashian special.

[CM Hooe]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kid OS

If I see a referee mod for PC, it is going to be very bittersweet.

If you see a referee mod for Madden 20 PC, the refs will likely look and act exactly the same as they do in Madden 19 PC (unless and until modders do additional work).

The justification for the decision as given by Clint Oldenburg was that the refs looked like crap and the game looks better without them. That's an artistic choice on the part of the developer, they are allowed to make that decision, and people are absolutely correct to artistically criticize Madden 20 for the absence of referees on the field decreasing authenticity.

In addition to that, the subtext that I personally read is that improving referees to meet their graphics quality targets was not within their development time budget. Which, again, I understand because there are so many more important things in this game than referees. You said it yourself, 95% of players won't notice they are gone, so it is easy to justify cutting them now and fixing them later.

[4thQtrStre5S]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sphinx

I can't believe we are having an 8 page discussion about refs being removed. It's not like penalties are removed just refs who most of us didn't notice. Maybe removing them allowed them to do something else that we aren't aware of. I don't know and honestly I don't care. If the gameplay is good and cfm is reasonably engaging then what the heck does it matter if a ref is on the field or not?

Exactly. It is just some people have to belly-ache about something. There always seems to be experts with better ideas and yet none of these experts are churning out a quality American football game.

I know, they lack the capital..If only they had EAs money. smh...

[Darth Aegis]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kid OS

What happened over the last 12 months that made having referees in the game impossible? I really want to know. Remember when EA told us that turf tape was a tough add and wasn't going to be able to be in Madden 19... I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for the turf tape (Maybe they weren't happy with the results and wanted to wait another year to work on it, but were outed by the modding community), but the referee issue is not a good look. If I see a referee mod for PC, it is going to be very bittersweet. I honestly believe that EA removed the refs for the sake of not having them. It feels like EA has been removing and excusing things since nineteen ninety eight when the undertaker threw mankind off hеll in a cell, and plummeted sixteen feet through an announcer's table.

Actually, it's a 9 month cycle not a 12 month cycle.

[Darth Aegis]

Quote: Originally Posted by 4thQtrStre5S

Exactly. It is just some people have to belly-ache about something. There always seems to be experts with better ideas and yet none of these experts are churning out a quality American football game. I know, they lack the capital..If only they had EAs money. smh...

A lot of these comments remind me of the armchair or Monday morning Quarterbacks.

[ForUntoOblivionSoar∞]

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

Unless you have a blue badge to enter Tiburon's Orlando office, there's absolutely no way you - or I, or anyone else here who doesn't have a pink name - are in a position to make any useful qualified assessment about the team's internal project velocity.

Rex's comments in the past give some good insight, however. Notably, he said almost all their limitations were due to either technology or resources. Looking at EA's financial numbers, there isn't much of an excuse for resource limitation.

His comments on MUT are particularly damning to people who attack the "popular opinion" here that the monetized live service mode definitely affected the quality of the game. Rex all but confirmed that they were right, and the ceaseless EA champions were not. At least on that particular issue.

Considering he probably has an NDA, I can't even imagine how damning what he HASN'T said would be.






But at least I have this, which pretty much proves my argument: "Devs care about player and community sentiment. Execs care about sales." Straight from the mouth of Rex Dickson. He even mentions that he personally wanted to fully utilize ESPN license, and the NBC license they have, and implement a full half time show, etc. He said that the team was prevented from doing that, but "couldn't go into" why. Read between the lines and it's clear why: execs didn't think the QUALITY IMPROVEMENT would be worth the resources spent.



In other words, they COULD do it, but WON'T because it isn't a money maker. Like MUT is.

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

As to any assessment of quality, Madden consistently is one of the top-selling domestic video games every single year, it makes beaucoup bucks in recurrent user spending in MUT, it has hit 80+ on Metacritic on all platforms for at least the past five years, and it remains a cultural touchstone; "Madden" is still synonymous with the total sports video games landscape in the US. I don't think Tiburon cares but so much as to what other games are doing as long as the continue hitting their own goals. If you think they aren't doing enough each year to make you happy, I recommend you spend your money and attention on something else.

Any game with the NFL license will be a top seller, and this response doesn't actually address the quality of the game in relation to the quality of other AAA titles.


Just because something sells more doesn't mean it's better. Everyone knows the NFL is the top sport in this country and it's not close. In fact, television revenue from the NFL is greater than the NBA, MLB, NHL, and MSL, combined.



That is why Madden is a top seller.








As for my attention, as discussed above, the NFL license is too powerful for me to not buy this game.







And none of this means I think the game is bad, or that I have a problem with the devs. Not even close. But I KNOW it could be better if the people in control of it (execs) suddenly were replaced by people who care about it and see it as more than a financial asset.

[Kid OS]

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

If you see a referee mod for Madden 20 PC, the refs will likely look and act exactly the same as they do in Madden 19 PC. The justification for the decision as given by Clint Oldenburg was that the refs looked like crap and the game looks better without them. That's an artistic choice on the part of the developer.

which is exactly what I said... EA removed the refs because they felt like it. Had nothing to do with 'laying off employees' and 'cutting expenses' or 'referee movement' stuff... It was an artistic choice... because EA felt like it.

[CM Hooe]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kid OS

The ole, "spend your money and attention on something else" move. Kinda hard when there is no competition

On the contrary, there is more competition for your video gaming time and money than there has ever been in any point in your life time. Stop narrowly limiting yourself to just NFL-licensed AAA football video games, you are doing yourself as disservice.

Might I recommend any of the top AAA games on Twitch, any of the top-selling indie games on itch.io, or any of the top-selling games on the Google Play Store.