Slthree's Pro Sliders

[slthree]

Quote: Originally Posted by sroz39

Ok, I played a few first halves with your set, and there are some issues. I went and used your's as a base, and made my own changes based on YEARS of trying to make a Pro slider set for said ratings reason. QB Acc 8---10 (at 8, it seems perfect and deep passing is still possible) Pass Blk 7---9 WR Cth 10---10 (with both at 10, receivers catch to their ratings) RB Abl 10---15 (at 13, A.I. RB's don't seem to use the "turbo" button) Run Blk 7---20 (needed to drop it one, to easy to run to the outside) Awr. 9---11 (Again, wanted players to play to their ratings) Kndw 5---20 (Biggest change, A.I. doesn't play ball well enough) Int. 0---10 (STILL too easy to pick the ball off, but better) Brk Blk 0---11 Tackle 4---8 Again, some drastic changes, and some tinkering. Overall, I get the feeling that I'll be able to play on this level this year. Which makes me happy because playing against Vick last night was pure joy. I found having to call plays that I never needed to call before, just to contain him, and took my chances with him in the air. Lots of fun. Thanks slthree, because I wouldn't have given Pro a chance this year without you getting the train rolling. Now, I am very close to getting a slider set that plays perfect, but without any A.I. cheats. Great work

Your welcome. Pro can play a very good game of football with the right adjustments.

When I get a chance to play again I will try your adjusted "Knockdowns" rating. But, I think I saw plenty of knockdowns before. Still, I'll give them a shot, especially if I'm going to raise my QB accuracy

I wonder how many people will just skip this conversation because they see 'Pro' as too easy? If they could see the way Fred Taylor ran all over bcruise, they might give 'Pro' another look.

[slthree]

sroz39

I'm going to try your changes, all of them with my test teams. Let's see what happens.

i thought I had a great game with my 1st set but if it can be improved, great.
================================================
OK, 1st impression. Dunn has 3 carries for 61 yards. That by itself isn't the problem. But this is: he has broken 4 tackles in just 3 attempts. One was from Peterson who has a tackle rating of 91.

Dunn is elusive and has great moves (I love his game) but should not be breaking a Julian Peterson tackle. Dunn's break tackle rating is 69.

It's still early though
=========================================
I think I like CPU knockdowns at 20
=========================================
At the half Dunn had no new broken tackles despite 5 more carries. Thats good. My receivers had 3 dropped passes. Falcons receivers had none. Alexanders avg was just 2.5 but he did have 7 broken tackles
=========================================
I pulled Hback for Wallace to see what difference it would make and wallace was just as accurate as Hback. Don't think I like USER QB accuracy at 8. It just might be too high
===============================================
I know Seattle's receivers are very good but I think they have made too many great catches which is why I liked USER catch rating at 5

[phatjoe]

being someone who always plays on all-madden because that is the only way I can get a competitive game, I thought I would give this a shot because of the realism factor. To my disappointment, this is what I found playing one full game with Slthree's Sliders. I was Washington playing Dallas, which is kind of a moot point since I do a fantasy draft, but nonetheless my team is not spectacular or anything.

I won the game 66-21. I had 654 total yards of offense to the computer's 346 yards, but here was the most surprising thing.

My RB who happens to be Reggie Bush had 368 yards rushing on 26 carries (14.1 avg) and 5 TD. He also added 5 receptions for 58 yards and a score. ta boot he broke 16 tackles.

Another thing that wasn't even close to realistic was the number of pancakes that their line had. Their 5 starting linemen had 60 pancakes while only allowing one sack. Their RB who happens to be Najeh Davenport had 165 yards on 24 carries....with 6 broken tackles.

Passing wasn't too bad as both my QB and their QB had realistic numbers, but as someone said you can't throw a deep ball over 20 yards. I might try the modifications to Slthree's sliders in this post....but if they don't work, I will have to go back to all-madden. The game isn't fun when you put up unrealistic numbers.

[slthree]

Quote: Originally Posted by phatjoe

being someone who always plays on all-madden because that is the only way I can get a competitive game, I thought I would give this a shot because of the realism factor. My RB who happens to be Reggie Bush had 368 yards rushing on 26 carries (14.1 avg) and 5 TD. He also added 5 receptions for 58 yards and a score. ta boot he broke 16 tackles. Another thing that wasn't even close to realistic was the number of pancakes that their line had. Their 5 starting linemen had 60 pancakes while only allowing one sack. Their RB who happens to be Najeh Davenport had 165 yards on 24 carries....with 6 broken tackles. Passing wasn't too bad as both my QB and their QB had realistic numbers, but as someone said you can't throw a deep ball over 20 yards. I might try the modifications to Slthree's sliders in this post....but if they don't work, I will have to go back to all-madden. The game isn't fun when you put up unrealistic numbers.

Thanks for trying them. I'm amazed at what you did with Bush. In my tests I use Alexander and I don't see anything approaching those numbers. Maybe its a style thing. Like I said before, I play very Vanilla. I try to emulate the team's style. I don't do anything that team does not normally do on any Sunday. I'm not sure what your style of play is but I agree that your stats don't make for a fun game.

How do you run, anyway?

I'm glad the QB stats were good.

I don't even look at pancakes. I just think EA's got those all wrong.

[phatjoe]

Quote: Originally Posted by slthree

Thanks for trying them. I'm amazed at what you did with Bush. In my tests I use Alexander and I don't see anything approaching those numbers. Maybe its a style thing. Like I said before, I play very Vanilla. I try to emulate the team's style. I don't do anything that team does not normally do on any Sunday. I'm not sure what your style of play is but I agree that your stats don't make for a fun game. How do you run, anyway? I'm glad the QB stats were good. I don't even look at pancakes. I just think EA's got those all wrong.

my running style is nothing special .... I use mostly counters they are my favorite I use them about 50% of the time. The other half of running plays are between the tackles. I hate sweeps, so I never call them. I think most of my yardage was due to the highlight stick which I think EA gave too big of an advantage to rushing. The 16 broken tackles led to 190 yds after the 1st hit. I made some adjustments, so we will see what happens

[slthree]

Quote: Originally Posted by phatjoe

... I think most of my yardage was due to the highlight stick which I think EA gave too big of an advantage to rushing. The 16 broken tackles led to 190 yds after the 1st hit. I made some adjustments, so we will see what happens

Thanks for answering.

I use the Highlite stick RARELY so that may account for it.

[sroz39]

Quote: Originally Posted by slthree

sroz39 I'm going to try your changes, all of them with my test teams. Let's see what happens. i thought I had a great game with my 1st set but if it can be improved, great. ================================================ OK, 1st impression. Dunn has 3 carries for 61 yards. That by itself isn't the problem. But this is: he has broken 4 tackles in just 3 attempts. One was from Peterson who has a tackle rating of 91. Dunn is elusive and has great moves (I love his game) but should not be breaking a Julian Peterson tackle. Dunn's break tackle rating is 69. It's still early though ========================================= I think I like CPU knockdowns at 20 ========================================= At the half Dunn had no new broken tackles despite 5 more carries. Thats good. My receivers had 3 dropped passes. Falcons receivers had none. Alexanders avg was just 2.5 but he did have 7 broken tackles ========================================= I pulled Hback for Wallace to see what difference it would make and wallace was just as accurate as Hback. Don't think I like USER QB accuracy at 8. It just might be too high =============================================== I know Seattle's receivers are very good but I think they have made too many great catches which is why I liked USER catch rating at 5

- I have noticed a few more tweaks that will be neccessary, and the Dunn broken tackle issue is one of them. I'm thinking of raising the tackle slider for Human up a bit to offset the RBA slider that I put up for the CPU in my set. I find that if the RBA is lower, the A.I. runs the ball very slowly and without much use of the highlight stick/jukes/stiff arms.

- As far as the QB Accuracy goes, I did try the slider at 7, but at that number, the deep ball was starting to feel underthrown. I may try it some more tonight, but at 8, I find it's the best of both worlds. At the Pro level with some sliders, it can be a matter of pick your poison.

- I tried having the Catch slider for Human at 7 like your set has and found that there were just way too many drops. Even at 10, they drop passes they should catch. Problem is, sometimes they'll catch passes they shouldn't. Again pick your poison.

In the end, I'm going to go back and tweak a bunch tonight, starting with the Human tackling slider, Human catching slider, and then move on to the Human and CPU break block slider. The pancakes are just too high, but I remember in 06 that that was just something you had to deal with in order to have the A.I. block well. I'm gonna start at zeros for everything and move on up from there, making changes where I see fit.

My whole philosophy with making a Pro slider set is that I'd like to keep the numbers as close to 10 as possible. 10 is the default number, and it's the number at which the players will play to their ratings. It might mean having to put up with the inherent problems in the engine that EA created (i.e. high pancakes), but to me, I prefer that over creating a slider set that eliminates the problems in the engine by creating an A.I. boost somewhere else on a higher difficulty.

btw, the CPU knockdowns at 20 is the only way to have the secondary play the ball well on a pass. Otherwise, they're too slow to react and move to make a play. It doesn't mean that there's gonna be more knockdowns neccessarily. It just means that they're going to be in better position to make the play more often. Again, another problem with this engine is the QB's are too accurate. They don't miss left and right, they miss short and long. The only way EA could counter that is by increasing the amount of times a player makes a play on the ball. Hence the high number of pass deflections.

[slthree]

OK, I made some slight changes. Sroz 39, thanks for all the help. At 20 for knockdowns the Atlanta D had something like 13-15 deflections. thats too many. So, i split the difference because i like your reasoning.

I put rb ability at 15 because I want the back to be juiced and then I increased user tackle by 2. I went to 9 with user catch, just 1 short of your proposed 10. i'll see what happens


Human---CPU

QB Acc 5 to 7---10
Pass BLK 7---9
WR Catch 7 to 9---9
RB Abilty 10---13 to 15
Run Block 8---20

AWA 5---11
Knkdwns 10---10 to 15
Int 10---10
Brk Blk 0---11
Tack 4 to 6---8