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Old 11-07-2009, 08:31 PM   #1
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Game Speed and Threshold

For some reason, I remember reading that the slower the game speed the higher the threshold should be. I don't know if it was someone's sliders or a "standalone" post/thread.

Is this the case or should the threshold always be around 50-60 for most realistic speed differences regardless of game speed?

Just wondering because with the threshold at 65 and very slow, suddenly games are offensive shoot outs with lots of big plays, especially by the faster players. For example, had a deep pass where Harvin beat the CB in single coverage and took it all the way. Anyone in space with speed is suddenly a big threat and the only thing I changed was the game speed.

I put it at 90 and it curtailed it but I didn't know if it was realistic.

One thing I notice - speed (or speed + ACC) is making a very noticable difference. Fast guys just blow by slow ones and stand out like night and day on the field. Pretty interesting - especially with an *over* 50 threshold - usually it's going under 50 where you see that.
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Old 11-07-2009, 08:43 PM   #2
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Re: Game Speed and Threshold

Hi KB. I read here that you should first pick the game speed you want to play on, then adjust sliders. I'm playing on slow and believe my threshhold is at 90.
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Old 11-13-2009, 04:20 PM   #3
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Re: Game Speed and Threshold

I've found a cure for big-plays-by-slow-players-acitus. Try lowering the threshold. I play with it at 0 on fast and I absolutely love it. For the most part you'll only make huge plays by players with 90+ speed. Now that doesn't mean that you won't be able to break 30 yard runs with someone like Brandon Jacobs, it just means that instead of it being a 70 yard TD, it'll just be a 30 yarder where a fast cornerback or safety will catch you. I feel like this is much more realistic.
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Old 11-13-2009, 04:37 PM   #4
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Re: Game Speed and Threshold

Lowering Threshold gives faster players more separation, correct?
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Old 11-14-2009, 01:30 AM   #5
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Re: Game Speed and Threshold

Yeah, 0 would make faster players pull away more from slower ones. If the fast player is the chaser, then he will close ground on the slower player more quickly.

Wonder if it would make fast players too strong.

Of course, there's some realism in that as a slow player can't catch up to a fast one unless he has a good angle (and even then, it depends), and speed kills in the NFL - but would speed kill too much by being almost impossible to contain. I mean, in the Bears game Thurs. a LB tackled Hester from behind - would that be possible, assuming good position by the LB, on 0 threshold, or would Hester just accelerate so fast he'd just run away without a problem?

Could try it and see - not like it will hurt anything by trying.
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Old 11-14-2009, 11:06 AM   #6
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Re: Game Speed and Threshold

This is still a mystery to me.

Let me know your finds KB and others. I'm not starting my offline chise until we get patch 2 anyway.

I will post some info that came out on this before M10 was released. It may or may not help. http://insideblog.easports.com/defau...ed&PageIndex=1

Posted Feb 1st 09-- Overall Game Speed --
After all of above changes were made, we all really were enjoying the way the game started to feel. It was much more realistic...and gave off a much less 'frantic' feel (if that makes sense). We had one more big area to tackle though - and that was GLOBAL game speed. While playing Madden NFL 09, often times you may have felt like the result of the play was "scripted"...everything happened so fast that it was often very difficult to have an influence on the outcome of the play. On running plays, holes closed up immediately. On passing plays, defensive backs came out of nowhere to deflect a pass. For Madden NFL 10 we knew that we all preferred a slower game - one that felt more 'sim' and more realistic. But this is often a hotly contested topic. This poll proves that people never can seem to agree on game speed. So what did we do? Well first we decided to decrease the game speed by 5% overall. As subtle as that change to game speed may sound, it has drastically improved the overall control of the game. It is definitely easier to identify the hole created by the offensive line. Scanning the field as routes develop make it easier to keep passes out of harm's way. But we know that not everyone wants that style, so we also included a GAME SPEED SLIDER. Finally right?
How Game Speed Changes (+ a Slider) Affects Gameplay: Control +7, Realism +10, Customization +7



-- Ratings Changes --
After Donny re-rated every player in the speed rating, and we had tuned our speed curves to truly make our game showcase the differences between the players, we were feeling pretty damn good. Being that speed was our biggest concern though, we wanted to check our sanity and tested some different player ratings and how fast each player (in a specific rating range) ran 40 yards in our game. These results will probably surprise you...they sure did us:


D'oh! Looks like we went a little too far! I think we can all agree that we won't be seeing too many folks running a 7.8 second 40 yard dash (video game developers might have those times, but not NFL athletes). This immediately brings to light the very real clash that can exist between fun and realism in sports games. We thought we were dead on - we thought the game felt great, was fun to play, and was really showcasing the differences between players. But when you look at the numbers, it is obvious that doing something that you feel makes the game more fun to play can differ quite greatly from a full realistic simulation. So what do we do? Well, first, we can't break our mantra...again, we're all for realism and authenticity in Madden NFL 10. But also we realize that we're making a game for millions of people, most of which are focused on a fun yet competitive experience, and many of them could probably care less about realistic 40 times. So what's our solution? Read on...
Within minutes of seeing these results, we knew right away that we needed to be able to tune the "speed difference" independently, and tune it per skill level. So our engineers built a nice system for us where we can compress this range however much we see fit, and also set the defaults for each skill level as well. You will see below that a good way to make Pro and Rookie difficulties a little easier is to spreads the ranges of speeds out, while on All-Pro / All-Madden we want to emulate real life as much as possible. We want you to boot up and say hello to Sundays in the NFL.

These numbers are very subject to change, but here's an example of the speed ranges based on the skill level:


NOTE: To be ultra clear, this is NOT the scale we use to determine the speed rating of a player! This showcases how fast a player runs 40 yards currently in our game based on the rating that he is given. Donny determines the actual speed ratings of the players based on many different factors...not just the 40 time of a player.
We also realized that you, the loyal Madden gamer, may not agree with these numbers. Many may believe that speeds should always be a constant, and difficulty should be handled in other ways (I sort of straddle that line myself). But to address everyone's concerns, we just went ahead and exposed our tuning values into a "speed differential" slider into gameplay settings. If you want to play on Pro mode but want all of the players to have more realistic speeds, you can do so. If you want to play on All-Madden but want the really fast players to truly feel faster than everyone else, you can do that as well. That way hopefully everyone can be happy.
How Realistic Player Speeds Affect Gameplay: Overall Gameplay + 10

- Ian Cummings
Lead Designer, Madden NFL 10

Last edited by dfos81; 11-14-2009 at 11:19 AM.
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Old 11-14-2009, 12:37 PM   #7
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Re: Game Speed and Threshold

I was looking for that chart - thanks dfos81

Of course, with it listed by skill level - still leaves the mystery of what threshold "All-Pro/All-Madden" refers to... *sigh*

By the rest of slider convention, All-Pro would 50, All-Madden...75?

But of course, they wouldn't make the same speed times.

*sigh* even in a visual representation, they didn't clearly state the threshold that produced those times...

That said, there's not a lot of difference between 99 and 45...that would seem to indicate a higher threshold.

Someone ran some times (might have been Megatron) @ various thresholds with various speed ratings and thresholds - gonna have to look for his thread now.

Edit: Found Megatron's post:
http://www.operationsports.com/forum...post2040316352

Though, this was done on Fast speed.

So it leaves me wondering what to do about slow or very slow like I was using.

Hmm...

Last edited by KBLover; 11-14-2009 at 12:48 PM.
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Old 11-15-2009, 04:35 AM   #8
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Re: Game Speed and Threshold

Just one game, but had a nice 23-6 win over the Browns with the Ravens. Pass defense was pretty tough on both sides. Flacco only completed 53% with 1 TD and 1 INT.

Run game was pretty solid - granted it was against the Browns. Rice had 4.5 ypc (26 for 114 yds). McGahee was even better - probably because he wasn't as worn out as Rice. I need to come up with a better way to rotate backs.

Their run game was nice also. Lewis had over 5 YPC. Derek Anderson was really why they lost - just couldn't move the ball at all in the air. I think he had like 3 yds per attempt or something.

Both sides got 3 turnovers. 2 INTs and a FR for my D, 2 FR and a pick for their D.

I used Very Slow/85 (I usually run slow/60 or 65). Speed still mattered significantly. Rice ran away from DEs and slower LBs on outside runs. DBs closed ground, slower guys like McClain couldn't outrun anyone.
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