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M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

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Old 11-24-2012, 11:33 AM   #1057
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Re: M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

Wiz, I love your work man. Your sliders have been getting better and better, and you've been getting closer and closer to the Holy Grail of Madden. With this latest slider set, though, something is up.

This is just one game, and I'll play a few more to really test this thing out, but there were some HUGE problems in this game. I'll run them down for you. (Note: the game was Bengals vs. Dolphins, with me playing as the Bengals.)

Number 1: Passing
I highlighted three issues with the passing game in this game, and for the most part, I guess, they are all inter-related. First off was accuracy. I know that Andy Dalton is no Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, but a final stat line of 22/47 for a 46% completion rate is hard to swallow against a Dolphins secondary that is completely average. 6 of Dalton's incompletions were dropped balls. That was a really frustrating aspect for me because with a minute left before halftime, I tried to make a drive. I threw three passes to three different players and all three dropped them. IN A ROW. And one of them was A.J. Green. And only a single reciever had a defender even looking at him within 4 or 5 yards of him. So, drops was my second issue. The third issue was, frankly, unbelievable. On third and long, I dropped back to pass, throwing over the middle to Marvin Jones. CAMERON WAKE ran stride for stride with him for 19 YARDS and picked it off. I have to believe that was a freak play because, as good as Cameron Wake is, no DE can run stride for stride with a WR.

Number 2: Running
Look, I'll be the first to admit that I'm not the best Madden player in the world, but after 4 years of playing, I am definitely no slouch. That's why I'm a little frustrated and very embarassed to say that the Dolphins ran for 335 yards on me. I'll say the good before the bad - David Garrard scrambled twice for 19 yards, and it was very fluid and believable. He escaped pressure and we reacted poorly - that was my fault, and I thought the logic and mechanics behind it was good. Now for the bad. Reggie Bush had 28 carries for 177 yards, and Steve Slaton had 16 for 139 yards. At times, their running game seemed to work realistically, and other times it was a complete what the fu**. The blocking was ridiculous; had a been an NFL ref, I would have been calling holding penalties left and right. That was what frustrated me. Many of their blocks felt and looked like holding, but it was never called. Break tackles weren't too much of an issue, though it did look like my CBs made cleaner and more solid tackles than my LBs. For the most part it was the insane blocking.

Number 3: Fumbles.
Between the two of us, there were 7 fumbles. Kind of reminded me of the Jets on Thursday, but it makes me a bit wary going forward. The animations did look smooth, and the hits were hard, but 7 fumbles seems like a bit much. (By the way, 5 of them were from Reggie Bush alone, and did I mention that he STILL put up 177 yards?)

Overall, their offense felt unstoppable. I was using the Holy Grail set, by the way, and not the Suicide set. Like I said, it was one game, and I'll have to play more before coming to a real judgement, but wow. I have to go apologize to my controller now, I threw it a few too many times.

Last edited by Weewam; 11-24-2012 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 11-24-2012, 02:06 PM   #1058
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Re: M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelers23
Looking forward to these Slider Wiz! Drop these asap, the suspense is killing me. Thanks again for the hard work.

That's you and ME both pimp.... I'm tellin ya, the TRUE ALL-MADDEN SUB-SLIDER SET has been a challenge.... I had to really "step up" my game to figure out all the weird quirks going on within the way that the A.I. logic works in TRUE ALL-MADDEN...

There is NO DOUBT that the way that sliders project themselves onto the game in TRUE ALL-MADDEN is MUCH MORE PRONOUNCED than with any other type of slider futzing....

When I release these bad boys, the feedback from the thread is going to be PARAMOUNT since I loosened up the game DRAMATICALLY, which is great for stick jockeys with average skills, but may be to looose for MADDEN VETS....

We'll see...

Stay tuned....

Slider Wiz out....

Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

the Gospel of Madden has spoken.
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Old 11-24-2012, 02:40 PM   #1059
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Re: M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weewam
Wiz, I love your work man. Your sliders have been getting better and better, and you've been getting closer and closer to the Holy Grail of Madden. With this latest slider set, though, something is up.

This is just one game, and I'll play a few more to really test this thing out, but there were some HUGE problems in this game. I'll run them down for you. (Note: the game was Bengals vs. Dolphins, with me playing as the Bengals.)

Number 1: Passing
I highlighted three issues with the passing game in this game, and for the most part, I guess, they are all inter-related. First off was accuracy. I know that Andy Dalton is no Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, but a final stat line of 22/47 for a 46% completion rate is hard to swallow against a Dolphins secondary that is completely average. 6 of Dalton's incompletions were dropped balls. That was a really frustrating aspect for me because with a minute left before halftime, I tried to make a drive. I threw three passes to three different players and all three dropped them. IN A ROW. And one of them was A.J. Green. And only a single reciever had a defender even looking at him within 4 or 5 yards of him. So, drops was my second issue. The third issue was, frankly, unbelievable. On third and long, I dropped back to pass, throwing over the middle to Marvin Jones. CAMERON WAKE ran stride for stride with him for 19 YARDS and picked it off. I have to believe that was a freak play because, as good as Cameron Wake is, no DE can run stride for stride with a WR.

Number 2: Running
Look, I'll be the first to admit that I'm not the best Madden player in the world, but after 4 years of playing, I am definitely no slouch. That's why I'm a little frustrated and very embarassed to say that the Dolphins ran for 335 yards on me. I'll say the good before the bad - David Garrard scrambled twice for 19 yards, and it was very fluid and believable. He escaped pressure and we reacted poorly - that was my fault, and I thought the logic and mechanics behind it was good. Now for the bad. Reggie Bush had 28 carries for 177 yards, and Steve Slaton had 16 for 139 yards. At times, their running game seemed to work realistically, and other times it was a complete what the fu**. The blocking was ridiculous; had a been an NFL ref, I would have been calling holding penalties left and right. That was what frustrated me. Many of their blocks felt and looked like holding, but it was never called. Break tackles weren't too much of an issue, though it did look like my CBs made cleaner and more solid tackles than my LBs. For the most part it was the insane blocking.

Number 3: Fumbles.
Between the two of us, there were 7 fumbles. Kind of reminded me of the Jets on Thursday, but it makes me a bit wary going forward. The animations did look smooth, and the hits were hard, but 7 fumbles seems like a bit much. (By the way, 5 of them were from Reggie Bush alone, and did I mention that he STILL put up 177 yards?)

Overall, their offense felt unstoppable. I was using the Holy Grail set, by the way, and not the Suicide set. Like I said, it was one game, and I'll have to play more before coming to a real judgement, but wow. I have to go apologize to my controller now, I threw it a few too many times.





I am channeling your controller's pain as I take in your criticism.... Give me a moment.....

Aaaa-oooooooooo-mmmmmmm..... Aaaa-oooooooooo-mmmmmmm ..... Aaaa-oooooooooo-mmmmmmm...... Aaaa-oooooooooo-mmmmmmm


Pffffffffffffffffffffffffft....... aaaahhhhh.... Just passed some gas, so I believe that all of the negative energy stored in your thumbs, has dissipated as methane gas into the environment....


Back to business.....


Absolutely AWESOME feedback.... I loved it.... Ya see, it is precisely THIS TYPE OF commentary that I need, so that I can substantiate what my notes and eyes are telling me as well....

Often, I am aware that the sliders dropped, may not be completely tuned for realistic competitive balance.... Why does this happen you might ask?

Welll it's actually quite simple.... Any slider tuner that spends too much continuous time tuning, by default, improves his game against the sliders that he is trying to tune..... So, often, competitive balance can be lost, because the tuner figures, "Helll, if I am running it up on my CPU opponent, then these sliders are tooo loose, gottta make them more challenging!".... And once this happens it is a VISCOUS cycle. So I soon realized that I was not helping the project, if I was to also be the guy "vetting" out the sliders, which is why the recent drops I have made, are a little "freaky"....

Bottom line is what I have always said, without you guys, their will never truly be a great SIM slider set to use....

Sooo, once again pimp, THANK YOU for your accurate assessment of what your thumbs feels and your eyes see!

Stay tuned!

Slider Wiz out....

Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

the Gospel of Madden has spoken.
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Old 11-24-2012, 06:58 PM   #1060
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Re: M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

better sliders??? whaaaaaat, guess i will be skipping my Accounting class Monday lol
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Old 11-24-2012, 08:49 PM   #1061
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Re: M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

Almost there.....


Slider Wiz out....

Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

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Old 11-24-2012, 11:27 PM   #1062
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Re: M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

Ladies:

After an 8 hour marathon, the Slider Wiz is done for the day....

Will be releasing the sliders tomorrow afternoon.

Slider Wiz out....

Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

the Gospel of Madden has spoken.
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Old 11-25-2012, 12:01 AM   #1063
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Re: M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

looking forward to it, i love your enthusiasm and commitment to a realistic simulation of the nfl, your sliders are great, well thought out, i appreciate the hard work work and the whole community is experiencing a more enjoyable game due to your diligence, thanks so much
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Old 11-25-2012, 04:37 PM   #1064
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Re: M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME





UPDATE:

Good news, and Bad news.....


Bad news for you ladies:
I am in "Family Guy" mode, possibly for the rest of the day....

Soooooooooo, probably WILL NOT get a chance to drop the "patch" on you guys.... My sincere apologies, but yesterday's marathon DID NOT earn me any brownie points with "the other boss" in the household....



Good News for you ladies:

This is what was cooking in the lab:

The NFL is won and lost in the trenches.... Tom Brady can be reduced to Brady Quinn, if his O-line decides to take the day off.... The Giants DO NOT win Super Bowls if the D-Line does not create havoc on opposing QB's....

Yeah, the "O" guys/Playmakers get all the press, but it is the INTERACTION AT THE LINE that defines real football....

Sooooooo, what I have focused on is getting the O-Line and D-Line to "interact" properly....

This means that the line of scrimmage animations are going to look a lot more like they look like on Sundays... Areas of focus are:

1) "Hand play" between D-Lineman and O-Lineman.... You will see D-Lineman animations as they try to use their swim/rim/bull rush moves to get by the O-lineman.... You will see blockers try to pancake anything in their path on power runs

2) D-Tackle Beeeeaaaaasts on the O-line will be "unleashed" to wreak havoc on up the middle runs, and occasionally (not as often as I would like) abuse poor centers for sacks and behind the line stops

3) Trying to get the "release timing" correct so that BEEEEEEAAAAAAST DE's can release properly on "around the edge" plays such as pitches, sweeps, counters, tosses, etc.... What has been happening in the present Holy Grail set is that the timing of the O-Line and D-Line are out of whack, HUGELY in favor of the D-Line for the CPU and HUGELY AGAINST the D-Line for HUM....

4) Trying to get the "missed block/tackle" aspect of the real NFL in proper ratio, to M13 to allow the running game for the HUM to be more realistic and allow for bigger run plays, and allow the HUM to better "stuff" the CPU run game.... At the present time, the CPU's blocking scheme is almost always "in perfect cadence" and quite often has the linebackers and safeties blocked off, allowing the CPU run game to abuse us....

5) Getting the timing of the pass rush to fall between 2.75 secs and 3.25 secs for blocked defenders and for unblocked defenders from about 1.9 secs to 2.25 secs.... This takes a lot of time because it has to be synced to the SPEED THRESH of choice...

Here are NON Line of Scrimmage issues that are being finessed:

1) Make sure that elite speed backs can get to the edge and start to turn in it, BEFORE the great DE's and LB's are in the proximity for an attempt at a tackle....

2) Make sure that the defensive backs are not "jumping" routes too early, creating unrealistic interception stats and outcomes...

Issues that I WILL NOT be able to get to

1) Good ratio of dropped balls, fumbles, penalties....



Stay tuned....


Slider Wiz out....

Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

the Gospel of Madden has spoken.
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