Madden 2006 - A Review...........

[Pared]

Wow. Just wow.

I can't believe I just sat here and read this entire thread. I promised myself I'd stay away from the boards come release time for this game and I did, to a certain extent.

This thread has it all. First you have someone who presents a really great review. (Kudos to you, KB) He goes and completely points out specifics as to why he feels the game is flawed. You know, that's something that, when people read reviews, they get blasted for b/c they DON'T do that. And here you have a review that lists them, and it gets blasted as well. Is there no common ground that can be reached?

Then, after the review, there are those outraged with what is said, like always, and names start being called. Mind you, in all this, not once were the specifics listed in question addressed in these posts with counterexamples. No, just comments how the "other game" had issues as well. (I guess I'm the only one who found that odd)

Ya know, if I hadn't read it here, I would never had known KB is a mod over at 2kSports. Nope. I honestly feel he gave the game a fair shake. It's what I've been trying to do only having one NFL title this year. Last year, I enjoyed 2k5 more than Madden, yet when I defended the positives of Madden, I was labeled a "fanboy." This year, I've decided to stay out of all that waste of time, for the most part, aside from this thread. I find it completely disturbing that most of you can't address the issues put forth by KBomber. He didn't rant and rave about the negatives; He simply listed them. Is that over the top? Did he denounce Madden? No. Some of you fellas need to lighten up.

Did you ever think that reason reading about some of these issues get tiresome solely because EA will not address them properly? Here's an example I noticed on the boards this year:

Mario running. Yes, it's not completely gone, but OMG what a difference there is this year. It's VERY noticeable. It's even less of an issue in Madden than in NCAA. It's amazing how this completely changes the ground game.

But EA has finally made a decent attempt at addressing it, and it goes overlooked... at least, to the extent that it's not as talked about as I thought it would be.

The problem herein lies in the OTHER issues EA has yet to address. I know, it's a shame, we have something to compare the Madden series to in the 2k series... but isn't that how it should be? If it weren't for 2k Games MLB baseball this year, I wouldn't realize how great MVP really was. Enough about that, I'm not trying to get sidetracked.

My point is, stop going in and reading comments here with a certain prejudice all the time. There are those that simply can't take constructive criticism, and that's understandable... but for goodness sake, it's always a refreshing take when you read someone post that they enjoyed the game, listed the flaws, then does NOT focus on the flaws, but would rather discuss other merits of the game as well.

For that KB, you get a

[KBomber]

Quote: Originally Posted by Gilateen

Did some of you guys forget that this was still a video game? I have been reading alot of posts from people who dont like the game cuz they cant dominate right out the box. So next they look for sliders and stuff to make the game easier or to their liking. I think some of you guys expect too much from a VIDEO GAME. Its supposed to be fun regardless of flaws, glitches and such. You make the game not fun by looking for glitches and whining on message boards instead of playing the game. If you dont like the game, fine, no problem, dont play it. But to constantly have to read bitchy posts from men and future men you would think that guys had cycles on here. State what you dont like and move on. A pattern is going on and its catching on everywhere. One person finds out they dont like something in a game, then the next 10 or 15 people see that and now they dont like it. It goes from message board to message board. And its getting out of hand. EA can care less what people think, Sega can care less also. Money is the bottom line. You can have all the ideas you want, submit them to Steve and Shawn or whomever. At the end of the day, something is always left out and an excuse is made. You think CEO's are going to lose sleep? The reason why we dont get what we want in video games is they still have to appeal to EVERYONE!! What is garbage to one man is gold to the next man. So if they can satisfy 3 out of 5 people, the job is accomplished and money is made. OH freakin well...then we have "Wishlist" threads. These threads really should be named DREAM THREADS cuz people ask for too much or too much BS. Its very rare you see a gaming company use something from a WISHLIST thread...its too much BS in there.

I'm going to disagree with you to some aspects of your post, especially the part about some gaming companies not caring about what people think. Two of my more favorite developers recently have been 2K Sports and Hypnotix. When both became part of GLobal Star or Take 2 Interactive, I thought it was fantastic because both had similar qualities.

Hypnotix was a company that used to go out of their way to listen to their public. Their forums had a very unique group of people who posted to it and the interaction between them and some of the Hypnotix guys who openly posted to their own forums and discussed aspects of their games with their fans was amazing. People from those forums were actually featured in Outlaw Volleyball and I'm sure that the one guy who shows up in some of the cut scenes from Outlaw Tennis is also a former forum member at Hypnotix

2K Sports listened to their public as well and I know this based on the involvement that I had on two of their games, NBA 2K5 and College Hoops 2K5. NBA 2k4 was a game that had issues. Prior to its development phase, I personally compiled all of the suggestions and opinions as voiced on their forums in order to provide a detailed synopsis of what gamers were looking for in NBA 2k5. Trust me, based on what was in 2k5, they listened. The changes were geared by information from those "Dream Threads" -- that's one of the reasons that I respected 2K Sports, I knew, personally, that they listened having been involved in the process

Another example was College Hoops. One of the phenomena that occured with C-Hoops 2K4 was the interest in developing legacies online at the 2K SPorts forums. Some of them were an artform, in fact, they were so well done. Not only did 2K SPorts give those guys their own section of the forum to play with and house their legacies, they made that part of the game with the ESPN News feature. I know that was the intent of that feature because I wrote it and was approached based on a legacy that I wrote called "The Long Hard Road of Major Bone", found on the 2K Sports forums. In fact the main reason why I never finished Bone was because I was so busy writing the stuf for "News", one of the things that I've always thought about going back to remedy. Through that experience, I got to work with Rob Jones, albeit remotely, but over the course of that relationship we got to speak on a lot of issues related to creating a game. He understood what we as a gaming public were looking for and that's what made College Hoops so damn good. That he is on the NBA game now suggests to me that it's going to be dynamite -- he gets it, in spades

I got into videogames because of injuries. I can't fathom playing actual sports anymore, heck I can't imagine taking a step without discomfort for the rest of my life. The increase in quality has been astounding from where we started years ago and, hey I'm 37, I remember and played all of the systems, so I know. These games can be revelatory experiences and as good as they are, they can still get better. NFL 2K4 put me under a helmet again with only an Xbox, what's the upward limit of the new hardware realistically?

We'll find out with continuous evolution. To me that won't come in exclusive environments. That's my point in a nutshell

Have fun..................

[Gilateen]

Eloquently put.

[gooberstabone]

Quote: Originally Posted by KBomber

I'm going to disagree with you to some aspects of your post, especially the part about some gaming companies not caring about what people think. Two of my more favorite developers recently have been 2K Sports and Hypnotix. When both became part of GLobal Star or Take 2 Interactive, I thought it was fantastic because both had similar qualities. Hypnotix was a company that used to go out of their way to listen to their public. Their forums had a very unique group of people who posted to it and the interaction between them and some of the Hypnotix guys who openly posted to their own forums and discussed aspects of their games with their fans was amazing. People from those forums were actually featured in Outlaw Volleyball and I'm sure that the one guy who shows up in some of the cut scenes from Outlaw Tennis is also a former forum member at Hypnotix 2K Sports listened to their public as well and I know this based on the involvement that I had on two of their games, NBA 2K5 and College Hoops 2K5. NBA 2k4 was a game that had issues. Prior to its development phase, I personally compiled all of the suggestions and opinions as voiced on their forums in order to provide a detailed synopsis of what gamers were looking for in NBA 2k5. Trust me, based on what was in 2k5, they listened. The changes were geared by information from those "Dream Threads" -- that's one of the reasons that I respected 2K Sports, I knew, personally, that they listened having been involved in the process Another example was College Hoops. One of the phenomena that occured with C-Hoops 2K4 was the interest in developing legacies online at the 2K SPorts forums. Some of them were an artform, in fact, they were so well done. Not only did 2K SPorts give those guys their own section of the forum to play with and house their legacies, they made that part of the game with the ESPN News feature. I know that was the intent of that feature because I wrote it and was approached based on a legacy that I wrote called "The Long Hard Road of Major Bone", found on the 2K Sports forums. In fact the main reason why I never finished Bone was because I was so busy writing the stuf for "News", one of the things that I've always thought about going back to remedy. Through that experience, I got to work with Rob Jones, albeit remotely, but over the course of that relationship we got to speak on a lot of issues related to creating a game. He understood what we as a gaming public were looking for and that's what made College Hoops so damn good. That he is on the NBA game now suggests to me that it's going to be dynamite -- he gets it, in spades I got into videogames because of injuries. I can't fathom playing actual sports anymore, heck I can't imagine taking a step without discomfort for the rest of my life. The increase in quality has been astounding from where we started years ago and, hey I'm 37, I remember and played all of the systems, so I know. These games can be revelatory experiences and as good as they are, they can still get better. NFL 2K4 put me under a helmet again with only an Xbox, what's the upward limit of the new hardware realistically? We'll find out with continuous evolution. To me that won't come in exclusive environments. That's my point in a nutshell Have fun..................

Great post. Yes, I still think that those companies with the "mom n' pop" mentality do care what people think. Usually, when something becames so popular, so mainstream... it starts to suffer. Music, movie sequels, videogames...

[LBzrule]

Quote: Originally Posted by KBomber

Having put in almost a week on Madden 2006 (Thanks, Blockbuster, for that great new late policy...) I think that I've finally got enough time in to put together my review of this title. Without further delay, my review of Madden 2006 2. On a running play, the offense correctly checks off against the D and using the Playmaker feature, redirects a run to the opposite side of the field. After receiving the ball, teh RB goes into a bizarre slowdown mode where he seems to almost run in place until a DE from the opposite side of the field tackles him in the backfield for a loss. Had he actually moved forward as was being input to the controller, there was nothing but real estate ahead and no defender in position to make a play on the ball. This is the kind of thing that is rampant in Madden 2006 in order to preserve the competitive drama, but it is artificial and non-sim 3. Quarterbacks throwing strikes off their back foot while being hit by a defender into double and even triple coverage 40 and 50 yards downfield while not even being able to follow through on their throwing motion. This has been in the game since 2003 and is stupid. There is no other word for it Beyond those issues there are still a variety of money plays, especially on offense where the D seems to have big issues with RB's coming out of the backfield on pass plays and any type of curl pattern by WR's Overall, there is an absence of logic to Madden's gameplay, especially in the line and how relates to the running game. If you want to run inside, it seems as though the only option is to go Dive. If you select an off-tackle play, you invariably have to go sweep because the O-Line rarely is able to create a hole and the defensive recovery to any hole made is not realistic in my mind. Line play seems to be a consistent weakness of this title with a very generic and relatively unrealistic feel to this element of the game Defensively I think that there are way too many turnovers although the D-Line seems to struggle to ever get pressure on the QB. The balance is skewed towards the LB and Secondary in an unrealistic manner. Also, once a player is caught in the blocking animation, there seems little chance of liberating them and the entire exercise becomes a button-mashing goulasche. Finally the timing of plays just seems wrong. Where is the improvement? Why are we seeing a regression in quality on a continuous basis in these important areas? Don't get me wrong, I love the NFL Films tunes, but it's going to take more than that. Ambient sound is also lacking and don't get me started on the commentary. If EA hasn't been able to get John and Al in the booth since 2004, why not just go to different commentators and get some fresh voice work? No sideline reporter, clunky looking presentation graphics. Are we to assume that year two of exclusivity is going to fetch us something better? Year One doesn't seem to support this concept .

After playing some more online games the last few days, while I first bought these comments, I'm going to have to change my perspective on them. Espeically after playing guys using Jamal Lewis and Jerome Bettis I have seen and I have run several off tackle running plays where I actually ran in both B and C gaps. I played against someone using Jamal Lewis yesterday and he kept hitting my defense in the B gap 6 yards here, 5 yards there. A truck stick here and a truck stick there I have seen the scenario of a DE coming from the other side of the field. But it is not like presented here as if it happens every time someone runs an off tackle play. Thus I would not call it un sim. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it does not. Alot of it has to do with the alignment of the defense.

I'm sure the QB thing has to be there, although I have yet to see it against the A.I. And I sure have not seen it in online games. My one complaint with the A.I is that it is kinda easy, just like ESPN was. My third day with the game, I beat the Colts 6 to 3 and held Manning under 150 passing.

RB's out of the backfield can be defended. It again depends on the call. A cover 2 zone it's an INT. If you run man coverage and then go with Man Lock the Linebacker covers the RB really tight. This is a correctable issue IMO. You can make a game plan adjustment by simply assigning the OLB's to the backs and they may never be open. That issue can be solved through smart game planning.

Never have problems getting my defensive line to get pressure. Again alignment of the defense is an important part of it. And there is a contradiction here. First the argument is made that the defense has trouble with certain routes. Then the argument is made that the game is skewed to give the advantage to the LB's and DB's Which is it? From my perspective, especially in online games, the game plays alot like 2k5, with nearly unstoppable TE lobs, but that's only if the other user gets time to throw it, which I do not give him. Now I wholeheartedly agree with the blocking. Good gawwd that's one of the most annoying things about the game to me. You cannot get off a block to save your life. To be honest if it were not for that, as far as the gameplay, I would not have too many issues with it.

When you say the timing of the plays just seems wrong, more needs to be said there. Just left it as a blanket statement.

As far as improvements, I think there are plenty here, although alot of them have already been done. Tiburon just took some of those things I re-worked them to enhance their game. I'm not here to grade the review, I think it was a good review, although I think differently on some of the issues.

The biggest problem game play wise for me is the blocking and lack of double team blocking. I really do not have problems with them allowing the curls and hitches be high percentage routes. This has been in video games before. There was a game last year where the curl was money too in particular against man coverage. But alas, I'm not here to compare and debate about which game is better.

Good review

Have fun...

[Graphik]

Quote:

70's kids are loving all the games out now cuz we know how far video games have come. But nowadays, some of you guys forget video games are meant for fun. Once you start bitchin about a game, you are gettin too emotional and need to get a grip.

I used to say things like this to. That we should appreciate the games of today since we came a long way, etc. But every once in a while, a game spoils you to the point that thats all you're willing to accpet. I mean, after seeing the amount of features and options that TT put into they're games, you would think that since they rasied the bar, other companies would follow suit. But good ol EA follows no one. They continue to give consumers the shaft each and every year with a mediocore title and you would think a game that rarely changes much at all would be glitch and flaw free but thats not the case with EA.


Think about this, if you find a non-sports game that pushes the envelope off the table with superb graphics and presentation, non-linear gameplay and total indepthness, would you honestly be able to go back and play similar games that are'nt even on the same level? Would you just accpet that or would you keep looking/waiting for something better?

And in the oh-so-limited sports genre, alot of ppl say that gameplay matters the most. Well, of course it should but dont you think we've come far enough in technology where gameplay can be accompanied by better graphics, presentation and innovative features? There is really no excuse for a game to not have both unless the company making the title is low on rescources or has a small dev team. We've convinced ourselfs that since dev teams only have a year compared to non-sports games, that the amount of innovation will be kept at a minimum. Well, I'm starting to believe thats all BS. Its been done before so why should I believe that it cant be done at all? Why should I be forced to take a step backwards when I've already seen what could be done?

[Briman123]

Quote: Originally Posted by Graphik

I used to say things like this to. That we should appreciate the games of today since we came a long way, etc. But every once in a while, a game spoils you to the point that thats all you're willing to accpet. I mean, after seeing the amount of features and options that TT put into they're games, you would think that since they rasied the bar, other companies would follow suit. But good ol EA follows no one. They continue to give consumers the shaft each and every year with a mediocore title and you would think a game that rarely changes much at all would be glitch and flaw free but thats not the case with EA. Think about this, if you find a non-sports game that pushes the envelope off the table with superb graphics and presentation, non-linear gameplay and total indepthness, would you honestly be able to go back and play similar games that are'nt even on the same level? Would you just accpet that or would you keep looking/waiting for something better? And in the oh-so-limited sports genre, alot of ppl say that gameplay matters the most. Well, of course it should but dont you think we've come far enough in technology where gameplay can be accompanied by better graphics, presentation and innovative features? There is really no excuse for a game to not have both unless the company making the title is low on rescources or has a small dev team. We've convinced ourselfs that since dev teams only have a year compared to non-sports games, that the amount of innovation will be kept at a minimum. Well, I'm starting to believe thats all BS. Its been done before so why should I believe that it cant be done at all? Why should I be forced to take a step backwards when I've already seen what could be done?

Thats not true people still play Counter-Strike 1.6 over Counter-Strike: Source and 1.6 is from the times of 1998. Aside from Custom made Maps CS 1.6 hasn't changed for years and people love it and play it. When it comes to non-sports games usually the older titles with bad graphics are the best.

[gooberstabone]

Quote: Originally Posted by Briman123

Thats not true people still play Counter-Strike 1.6 over Counter-Strike: Source and 1.6 is from the times of 1998. Aside from Custom made Maps CS 1.6 hasn't changed for years and people love it and play it. When it comes to non-sports games usually the older titles with bad graphics are the best.

But overall, I think the main point of his post that shouldn't be lost in all of this is that although games have come a long way and we are grateful for that, if one company comes along and shows what can be done this generation in terms of graphics and presentation, then it's only natural to come to expect that from other companies that have similar resources... and DEFINITELY if they have more resources.

It's like all of this time we've be shown one thing and so we figure that "Well, that must be as good as it gets since they are the industry leader." But then someone else comes along and offers something that pushes the genre (in presentation for instance). It's only fair to feel "Wait, why don't they have this in the other product."