People have played the game and interviews have been made but...

[Kramer5150]

Quote: Originally Posted by bkrich83

no matter how unbiased people claim to be, it's simply not true.

Oh come on now, Like I've said...time and time again,I could care less who has what license,and who is making what game.
I have no so-called loyalty to ANY video game maker,do I like Madden? yes
Did I like the 2k series? yes.

So now you're saying people are liars??

[bkrich83]

Quote: Originally Posted by CowherPower

Oh come on now, Like I've said...time and time again,I could care less who has what license,and who is making what game. I have no so-called loyalty to ANY video game maker,do I like Madden? yes Did I like the 2k series? yes. So now you're saying people are liars??

I am saying certain people aren't as unbiased as they seem to think or portray themselves as when it comes to this topic. It's really not that hard to see. Just look at every excuse certain people make when it comes to defending 2k.

You say you could care less who is making the game and have no loyalty, your posts say otherwise.

[WVUFan]

Quote: Originally Posted by CowherPower

Where did I EVER say I have hatred for Madden?? give me a break..yea,excuse me for wanting a great game. The last time I checked,this IS a Madden forum, to discuss...GUESS WHAT... Madden! That would include the good and the bad.If you can't handle complaints about Madden..

You don't have to say it, dude, it's readily apparent that you have a hatred for the series. I can post example after example of you downgrading the Madden series all-the-while boasting of the greatest of 2k5. If that isn't inherent bias, I don't know what it.

Just because you say "I don't care who has the license" after your anti-Madden rant doesn't give you carte-blanche to say what you will without being called to task for it.

Quote:

IF you bothered to read ANYTHING,I'm constantly saying everything sounds good thus far,but apparently you can't understand that,and seem to think that anybody that criticizes Madden hates the game.

Nope, you're absolutely entitled to say what you want about the Madden series, just as I'm just as entitled to say something in return.

And, for what it's worth, anyone who constantly criticizes the game while constantly praising 2k5 IS hating the game, and IS bias against the Madden series. It's fine to be that way, but it's disengenious to say otherwise.

[PacMan3000]

I actually have a question that I'd love an answer to...

In the 2K series, I felt they made HUGE strides each and every single year. In one year, they would tweak player models, make franchise mode a little deeper, add a "CRIB," allow you to add music in your stadium, AND give you great presentation and more commentary. It was huge leaps like this every single year.

Why is Madden NOT like this? They have to have more people working on the game, more money, more access to the NFL with the license now...what's the problem? Now, don't get wrong, I understand that when you are the underdog like 2K was, you have to do EXTRA work. But, is it REALLY just that EA is "lazy?" Is it that they produce so many other games, they don't have the time or resources to make significant changes each and every season? I'd love to know the thoughts on this. I know they make tons of money each year, but they DO have to make changes each and every year, right? I guess I just don't understand why they don't beef up things that their consumers blatantly have a problem with? Sure, maybe everyone doesn't have an issue with the radio announcer or maybe everyone doesn't want TV presentation...but you'd think they'd tweak the game enough where it was at least an improvement over what we had last year, right?

[bkrich83]

Quote: Originally Posted by spankdatazz22

If that were the case then I'd think it's because people aren't one-offing the issues as you are. You take the game and the effort of the developers as a collective whole. It may have been their 3rd current gen outing but it was their first using the XBox as the lead SKU to take advantage of it's superior power and hard drive, which no one had attempted at that time. It's appreciated they made the effort to enable online leagues. It's appreciated they added a halftime show/post-game highlights. Etc. It's no different than Madden in it's heyday, whenthe game's positives outweighed the game's negatives. The reason Madden gets flak is because it's negatives outweigh it's positives. It's not some conspiracy. Everytime EA doesn't pursue a feature that the public supposedly wants (refs, online leagues, etc.) the first thing the flies out of someone's mouth in defense is "they probably don't think it's feasible/it's not profitable enough for them to pursue". THAT'S an excuse. Biases exist for a reason. It's not like people are going out of their way to "pick on poor EA - they're trying hard". They bring it on themselves.

Please. Nothing but more excuses. The games aren't on an even playing field when it comes to criticism? Does EA deserve the criticism it gets? For the most part. Does it get more than it should some times. No doubt about it. Does 2k get a free pass? I don't even think anyone can question that. Just look at the excuses made for 2k, when any of it's flaws are brought up in this thread.

I somehow doubt if EA went 3 straight years making a completely unplayable franchise mode, they would get the pass 2k gets, no matter what the game had to offer.

I've hammered EA for more than my share of things (OLine progression broken for years, IR still doesn't work, unrealistic implentation of certain coverage scheme's, questionable roster AI, broken fatigue, etc.), but some people hammer Madden for the sake of hammering Madden.

Sad part is, I really haven't played a Madden game I have liked in about 4 years (Madden PC this past year being the notable exception), but even I can see when people are going above and beyond to stick it to them.

[bkrich83]

Quote: Originally Posted by PacMan3000

I actually have a question that I'd love an answer to... In the 2K series, I felt they made HUGE strides each and every single year. In one year, they would tweak player models, make franchise mode a little deeper, add a "CRIB," allow you to add music in your stadium, AND give you great presentation and more commentary. It was huge leaps like this every single year. Why is Madden NOT like this? They have to have more people working on the game, more money, more access to the NFL with the license now...what's the problem? Now, don't get wrong, I understand that when you are the underdog like 2K was, you have to do EXTRA work. But, is it REALLY just that EA is "lazy?" Is it that they produce so many other games, they don't have the time or resources to make significant changes each and every season? I'd love to know the thoughts on this. I know they make tons of money each year, but they DO have to make changes each and every year, right? I guess I just don't understand why they don't beef up things that their consumers blatantly have a problem with? Sure, maybe everyone doesn't have an issue with the radio announcer or maybe everyone doesn't want TV presentation...but you'd think they'd tweak the game enough where it was at least an improvement over what we had last year, right?

I don't get where people get lazy. Software engineers aren't lazy by nature. In EA's case, it's a matter of, it it's not broke don't fix it. They've been selling games by the millions using this exact strategy. They've got no incentive to change their ways. It sucks for the consumer like us, unfortunately this is standard business practice in the US for companies that have a market cornered or at least own a huge percentage of the market.

Just another reason why the exclusive license was poor for consumers. I wish the NFL would reconsider exclusive licensing across the board. But it's become a staple of their brand, and don't see it changing any time soon.

[WVUFan]

Quote: Originally Posted by bkrich83

I don't get where people get lazy. Software engineers aren't lazy by nature. In EA's case, it's a matter of, it it's not broke don't fix it. They've been selling games by the millions using this exact strategy. They've got no incentive to change their ways. It sucks for the consumer like us, unfortunately this is standard business practice in the US for companies that have a market cornered or at least own a huge percentage of the market. Just another reason why the exclusive license was poor for consumers. I wish the NFL would reconsider exclusive licensing across the board. But it's become a staple of their brand, and don't see it changing any time soon.

Aside from what you said (which I agree with), the awful truth of the matter is it wouldn't matter what improvements Madden made to the game, the people you see doing the majority of complaining about the game will still complain. The great majority of the players of the Madden game do not have a problem with it.

Sure, WE might, but the great lot of us put in a great amount of work looking at each detail of the game. The average Madden player couldn't care less if they see the chain gang in the sideline. They want an enjoyable game, and Madden caters to the casual gamer.

But, honestly, if they suddenly turned around and made major, complete renovations to the engine and the game, people would still complain.

[bkrich83]

Quote: Originally Posted by WVUFan

But, honestly, if they suddenly turned around and made major, complete renovations to the engine and the game, people would still complain.

No doubt about it. It's the nature of some people I guess.