Developers on the EA Forums part II

[Rawdeal28]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sef0r

Yeah, Dudd's post was spot on. There are a lot of things they can try and fix (or patch) but they (Tiburon) will never be able to do so until they create a whole new engine. Here are some things I found to be interesting. Are there any more attributes added to player ratings? Not this year actually…after adding new ratings consistently over the past 3 years, this year we wanted to really focus on tuning our (now rather large) current list of ratings. We have a wishlist of about 50 more ratings that we want to try and add, and hopefully we can get to some new ones each year. I would like to know how many of those ratings are actually used by the core gameplay engine. They have increased the number of rating categories by a huge amount but are using the same core engine since 2002. I am pretty sure that a lot of ratings are complection related and not actually used in game. I am in the thinking that there needs to a lot less in this area. Are nano-blitzes still a problem? We’ve added back the popular slide protection feature this year as well as tuned our pass blocking AI (and animation system) extensively, so nano’s should all be preventable this year. This tells me "Yup, nano-blitzes can still be created". How is slide protection suppose to solve this problem? You get 4 choices, slide LEFT, RIGHT, OUT and IN. You would choose slide IN for some Nano blitzes but what about the ones that bring pressure from both in and out? I don't see Nano-Blitzes ever really going away, but then again I don't see exploitable glitches ever dissapearing from Madden, or any game for that matter. This is a case of "It is what it is". Have spectacular catches / jet pack catches been toned down? Yes, definitely. The spectacular catches have been toned way down in terms of how powerful they are, and defenders also have a much easier chance of knocking the ball out (since the receiver is really putting himself out there on big leaping catches like that). So what is it? Has it been toned WAY down or have you given defenders another easy way to tackle hard,i.e. my small CB is now a HARD HITTER who will knock the WR on his a$$ for jumping so damn HIGH. I honestly believe this will still be there and it really should not be. No WR should be able to jump that high while running, most of those catches you see in the NFL are endzone catches where they are positioning themselves for a jump ball. Are Linebackers/Corners still super-human when it comes to making a play on a pass? This has been tuned way down as well. You will see MUCH more realistic defensive pass coverage / play from the linebackers and corners. They have a much harder time making plays on the ball that they don’t “see”, they react in a much more realistic time-frame to the play (using their play recognition rating) and the distance at which they can make a play on the ball in the air has been drastically tuned down…so more often than not you’ll see them try to set up for a big hit to jar the ball loose instead of warping over to swat the ball down. If this is true, it solves one of the bigger problems I have with Madden since 2004.

hold on there buddy. everyone is quick to jump to this "new engine" theory. there is NO guarantee a new engine will fix everything u guys talk about.

now i agree the things u mentioned does need to be fixed and they said they worked on it. lets play the game first then see if they really worked on it.

[Sef0r]

Quote: Originally Posted by Rawdeal28

hold on there buddy. everyone is quick to jump to this "new engine" theory. there is NO guarantee a new engine will fix everything u guys talk about. now i agree the things u mentioned does need to be fixed and they said they worked on it. lets play the game first then see if they really worked on it.

Of course there is NO guarantee it will fix everything, but Tiburon would be a really BAD developer if they didn't go in with a plan and core ideas of what the new engine will be capable of doing.

The idea is to basically get rid of their crap animation system they have going now.

They said they worked on lots of things last year too and I played 2008 only to see all that crap they talked about go by the way side. They replaced Jetpacking with Spectacular catches, they didn't fix the nano blitzes, they didn't fix the DB play, they didn't remove the player being shot by a shotgun animation...the list would go on and on.

They don't NEED the euphoria engine, they can develop one themselves it just needs to be a new physics engine.


EA's best bet is to set up a new team to start on the next next gen of Madden engine while having this gen's team work on their yearly updates. That way when it comes time for next next gen consoles it wont be Madden 2011 (the port of the 360 version).

[Rawdeal28]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sef0r

Of course there is NO guarantee it will fix everything, but Tiburon would be a really BAD developer if they didn't go in with a plan and core ideas of what the new engine will be capable of doing. The idea is to basically get rid of their crap animation system they have going now. They said they worked on lots of things last year too and I played 2008 only to see all that crap they talked about go by the way side. They replaced Jetpacking with Spectacular catches, they didn't fix the nano blitzes, they didn't fix the DB play, they didn't remove the player being shot by a shotgun animation...the list would go on and on. They don't NEED the euphoria engine, they can develop one themselves it just needs to be a new physics engine. EA's best bet is to set up a new team to start on the next next gen of Madden engine while having this gen's team work on their yearly updates. That way when it comes time for next next gen consoles it wont be Madden 2011 (the port of the 360 version).

alright, well i dont believe its a crap animation system and millions of people who still agree with me.

whatever EA does, there are still gonna be people who find ways to cheese/or glitch the game. u cant anticipate how a user is gonna play ur game. u can find something wrong with anything and any game if u really dedicate time to look for it and play the game all the time. and u dont really come across the nano blitzing, spectacular catch, and jetpacking unless u play randoms online or play in the tournament (for the most part). i assume most people on OS who play madden are "sim" players. so if ur playing other people on here (like a a good portion of them do) how much are u gonna see this cheesing/glitch stuff in ur games? (not counting the DB play because post patch last year it was much better) not much i believe. now im not saying it shouldnt try to be fixed but its not that high of a priority when u got other stuff to work on in the game.

[SageInfinite]

Quote: Originally Posted by Rawdeal28

alright, well i dont believe its a crap animation system and millions of people who still agree with me.

I gotta agree, their animation system is garbage. The only reason people don't notice it is because they've been conditioned to Madden football. If EA were to change their core animation system to add more flexibility and realism, people would see the difference and probably never wanna go back to the "Madden" game.

[edubbs]

I just hope they fix the effectiveness of Quarter and Dime Defenses vs. Big offensive sets, and just in general.

I played this IDIOT yesterday online, that ran a Quarter Defensive set, that GURANTEED he got a sack or pressure in 2 seconds or less. This was using just a 3 man rush......with the Rams no less!

He would pinch his line pre-play and...... BAM! Three man rush guranteed sack or pressure. To make it even worse, I couldn't even punish him on the ground when he ran this set.

It's sooo mind renching, just thinking about how bad the physics and animations are in this game. They still have not fix this issue, that has been in this franchise in some form for years now.

You shouldn't have to use slide protection to get protection against a 3 man rush, straight up the gut against a 5-6 man protection scheme.....

The dime and quarter defenses have always been waaaay to effective against the run in this game. And this fool that I played yesterday really exploited the lackluster physics and animations in this franchise, during the game.

I have no defense for anyone who 'claims' that the gameplay engine Tiborun is using is a good one.

Anytime you can use the Rams or Lions and run quarter D and Dime D exclusively and have success, something is definately not right on the programming/physics side of the game.

Which all relates right back to the lackluster engine.

[Rawdeal28]

Quote: Originally Posted by edubbs

I just hope they fix the effectiveness of Quarter and Dime Defenses vs. Big offensive sets, and just in general. I played this IDIOT yesterday online, that ran a Quarter Defensive set, that GURANTEED he got a sack or pressure in 2 seconds or less. This was using just a 3 man rush......with the Rams no less! He would pinch his line pre-play and...... BAM! Three man rush guranteed sack or pressure. To make it even worse, I couldn't even punish him on the ground when he ran this set. It's sooo mind renching, just thinking about how bad the physics and animations are in this game. They still have not fix this issue, that has been in this franchise in some form for years now. You shouldn't have to use slide protection to get protection against a 3 man rush, straight up the gut against a 5-6 man protection scheme..... The dime and quarter defenses have always been waaaay to effective against the run in this game. And this fool that I played yesterday really exploited the lackluster physics and animations in this franchise, during the game. I have no defense for anyone who 'claims' that the gameplay engine Tiborun is using is a good one. Anytime you can use the Rams or Lions and run quarter D and Dime D exclusively and have success, something is definately not right on the programming/physics side of the game. Which all relates right back to the lackluster engine.

i agree with everything u just mentioned. but like i said before, u were playing a random online (i assume cuz i dont think someone u call an idiot would be someone u know and play regularly. lol). i play madden most of the time with my brother and my friends (head to head) and until i played joe schmo online i had NEVER came across this stuff or even knew it exist. because me and my friends play realistically. were not trying to cheese each other to get our rank up.

no matter what engine u have for the game, people will find a way to cheese/glitch and play unsim-like to beat you. a new engine will just give u a different set of problems, and it may just irk you more than these do now.

[ODogg]

Quote: Originally Posted by Rawdeal28

no matter what engine u have for the game, people will find a way to cheese/glitch and play unsim-like to beat you. a new engine will just give u a different set of problems, and it may just irk you more than these do now.

I have been saying this for a long time. Anytime you take a game with as many options and on the field choices as football offers there can be no perfect engine to offer only a 100% realistic simulation. Simply giving the user choice offers the possibility that your experience will be highly unrealistic.

Admittedly Madden/NCAA could do some things to help deal with cheesing/unrealistic play better but anyone that thinks the engine is the cause of such stupidity is sadly mistaken. Idiocy runs rampant in all online games, sports and otherwise and most certainly is not limited by any means to EA's football games.

[Rawdeal28]

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

I have been saying this for a long time. Anytime you take a game with as many options and on the field choices as football offers there can be no perfect engine to offer only a 100% realistic simulation. Simply giving the user choice offers the possibility that your experience will be highly unrealistic. Admittedly Madden/NCAA could do some things to help deal with cheesing/unrealistic play better but anyone that thinks the engine is the cause of such stupidity is sadly mistaken. Idiocy runs rampant in all online games, sports and otherwise and most certainly is not limited by any means to EA's football games.

i knew there had to be someone who agreed with me.

and that last paragraph, thats the gospel right there man.