From an admitted 2k/APF guy..

[LBzrule]

Quote: Originally Posted by metallicatz

Perhaps, but keep in mind that APF is a straight up port of 2K5. I spent hundreds of hours playing 2K5 (I stayed away from last gen Madden after NFL2K1 on dreamcast came out adn was 2K all the way from there to 05) and was playing like an old pro after 5 minutes of APF because it was pretty much the same exact game. And that was with 3 years in between the release of those two games. You have to hold 2K to the same bar of expectation as EA.

Yes and no. Do you know how many people worked on All Pro? I'll just say it this way, it wasn't even a 10th of the personnel that works on Madden year in and year out. Not even a 1/10. And for them to even have a game that is even mentioned in the same sentence with Madden is a F'ing travesty. EA should be held to a higher standard for three reasons.

1) They have more hands.
2) They have more money.
3) They have the license.

This is not to say that people should expect VC or anyone else to make a sh#tty a$$ game. But it is to say, nobody who develops football games has the resources and access to NFL that EA does and for EA to have that privilege no other game should even be mentioned in a sentence with their game. Yet we are going into our 4th go around and old games are still being compared and not only are old 2k games being compared, but old Madden games themselves are still being compared.

I'm not being an apologist here, but there are certain issues that need to be put out there when talking about holding people to the same bar. Secondly, I do think APF was a disappointment for many people in many ways. But you even giving it a shot says something about how you perceived that state of football games when you purchased it.

[Methlab]

I just want you guys to know that I am well aware of the "Madden looks good" let down that happens every year. I know it! Trust me, just look at my post history, I bash EA without mercy. I have not bought Madden in years...I play 2k like a madman.

Something about the new vids just struck me as looking really good. I liked a lot of things in that Pats/Giants vid. Maybe I'm nuts, but the game looks different and looks like it may actually be a great game this year.

[UNC_Pete]

Quote: Originally Posted by Methlab

I just want you guys to know that I am well aware of the "Madden looks good" let down that happens every year. I know it! Trust me, just look at my post history, I bash EA without mercy. I have not bought Madden in years...I play 2k like a madman. Something about the new vids just struck me as looking really good. I liked a lot of things in that Pats/Giants vid. Maybe I'm nuts, but the game looks different and looks like it may actually be a great game this year.

Fool me once..

[SageInfinite]

Quote: Originally Posted by LBzrule

Yes and no. Do you know how many people worked on All Pro? I'll just say it this way, it wasn't even a 10th of the personnel that works on Madden year in and year out. Not even a 1/10. And for them to even have a game that is even mentioned in the same sentence with Madden is a F'ing travesty. EA should be held to a higher standard for three reasons. 1) They have more hands. 2) They have more money. 3) They have the license. This is not to say that people should expect VC or anyone else to make a sh#tty a$$ game. But it is to say, nobody who develops football games has the resources and access to NFL that EA does and for EA to have that privilege no other game should even be mentioned in a sentence with their game. Yet we are going into our 4th go around and old games are still being compared and not only are old 2k games being compared, but old Madden games themselves are still being compared. I'm not being an apologist here, but there are certain issues that need to be put out there when talking about holding people to the same bar. Secondly, I do think APF was a disappointment for many people in many ways. But you even giving it a shot says something about how you perceived that state of football games when you purchased it.

[FlyingFinn]

Quote: Originally Posted by LBzrule

Yes and no. Do you know how many people worked on All Pro? I'll just say it this way, it wasn't even a 10th of the personnel that works on Madden year in and year out. Not even a 1/10. And for them to even have a game that is even mentioned in the same sentence with Madden is a F'ing travesty. EA should be held to a higher standard for three reasons. 1) They have more hands. 2) They have more money. 3) They have the license. This is not to say that people should expect VC or anyone else to make a sh#tty a$$ game. But it is to say, nobody who develops football games has the resources and access to NFL that EA does and for EA to have that privilege no other game should even be mentioned in a sentence with their game. Yet we are going into our 4th go around and old games are still being compared and not only are old 2k games being compared, but old Madden games themselves are still being compared. I'm not being an apologist here, but there are certain issues that need to be put out there when talking about holding people to the same bar. Secondly, I do think APF was a disappointment for many people in many ways. But you even giving it a shot says something about how you perceived that state of football games when you purchased it.

Like I said in another post:

LBzrule for President

[countryboy]

Quote: Originally Posted by FlyingFinn

Like I said in another post: LBzrule for President

sorry, I just read both of the threads where you say this and it made me laugh. LBz seemingly always has good posts, and right on the money as well.

[metallicatz]

Quote: Originally Posted by LBzrule

Yes and no. Do you know how many people worked on All Pro? I'll just say it this way, it wasn't even a 10th of the personnel that works on Madden year in and year out. Not even a 1/10. And for them to even have a game that is even mentioned in the same sentence with Madden is a F'ing travesty. EA should be held to a higher standard for three reasons. 1) They have more hands. 2) They have more money. 3) They have the license. This is not to say that people should expect VC or anyone else to make a sh#tty a$$ game. But it is to say, nobody who develops football games has the resources and access to NFL that EA does and for EA to have that privilege no other game should even be mentioned in a sentence with their game. Yet we are going into our 4th go around and old games are still being compared and not only are old 2k games being compared, but old Madden games themselves are still being compared. I'm not being an apologist here, but there are certain issues that need to be put out there when talking about holding people to the same bar. Secondly, I do think APF was a disappointment for many people in many ways. But you even giving it a shot says something about how you perceived that state of football games when you purchased it.

Maybe, but i'm not sure that's true. According to the Phil Holt interview in the new Game Informer the EA Tiburon team working on Madden is about 35 people strong with another 15 people as far as support personnel totaling 50. I would have a hard time believing there are only 5 people working on the 2K football series. It's not like EA has hundreds of people working on Madden every year, but that seems to be the perception among many.

I gave APF a shot soley based upon the last gen performance of the 2K series, or reputation alone. I was not happy when it was announced there would be no franchise mode since that's pretty much all I play in sports games. Personally I don't care about things like the "crib", 1st person football, and all that other stuff. But I have to have franchise mode. And like I said, with all of 2K's advertising about "the resurrection of video game football" I was really disappointed to find it was just a bare-bones port. I'd already played the hell out of 2K5 and didn't want the same experience for another console cycle so I walked. And to be honest, I got more enjoyment out of NCAA 07 than I did out of APF both on the field and off the field. That's just me. I don't claim to be the benchmark for what constitutes a valid football gaming experience. I just know I had fun with NCAA 07, and isn't that the whole point to begin with? These are video games, nothing to be taken so seriously as many do on these forums. To hear some of these guys talk it sounds like EA raped their mothers or something and they have so much pent up hatred it's sometimes hard to believe they're actually just talking about a video game (not saying you're one of them or anything)..

[grunt]

Quote: Originally Posted by countryboy

sorry, I just read both of the threads where you say this and it made me laugh. LBz seemingly always has good posts, and right on the money as well.

Not always but the vast majority of the time.