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Old 07-28-2008, 10:59 AM   #25
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Re: looks boring 2 me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nza
The problem is Madden simply doesn't excel in small, minute detail. Whether you think the game needs to first rework the fundamentals or not, the fact is most gamers like us here are impressed when the small things are done right - things an average Madden fan may not even really notice. Basically, the fewer things that remind you this is a videogame, the better. I think this is the reason Madden has lacked heart, soul, spirit etc - because it seems EA are not interested in the really small stuff that collectively make a big difference.

A lot can be said for a sports game that offers new sights, sounds and experiences many games into usage. Outside of tackle animations, chances are once you've played one game of Madden, you've basically seen it all regarding what the game has to offer. Stuff like the rivalry code is a step in the right direction, but 09 will probably be much the same as before in this regard. They need to make the game feel more alive and this can be done by lots of small details that keep the experience fresh and new for longer, even if only from time to time. Reason #2132412 why 2K5 was cherished was because hundreds of games in, you may have just noticed the blimp going over the field, or you may have just seen your first illegal chop block by a RB on a DE. Remember when helmets used to fly off in Madden after huge hits? Madden was never known for small details like this, but it has somehow gone even further back in this regard with the move to the new consoles.

Give players real emotion after events, not phony feeling canned celebrations. Then make some players, like Marvin Harrison, very humble and quiet. Get the chain gang back out and add a degree of human error to ball markings, setting the home team crowd roaring when it comes up 2 inches short on measurement. Now that arms are dynamically tracked in catching, make defenders sometimes actually reach for the facemask and pull it. Work on making heads track the ball and other players, even if it doesn't directly influence gameplay. You can go on and on all day, and all this stuff adds to the experience.
While I agree with your point of view that Madden is stale due to the fact that it's missing "the little things". We have to understand (and I think most do) that we have a bigger problem on our hands... As of 08 next gen, we have had an unplayable product released. Forget "the little things", give me a game I can play for more than two weeks without a game killing bug turning up. As I have stated before, I am just looking for a solid release this year that I will be able to play at length without reverting back to last gen due to multiple game play issues. Let them get that right, then they can start adding "the little things". Ian said it best in a post I read a while back when referring to adding player specific running styles:

"Why add player specific running styles when the default ones don't work correctly..."

Basically he was saying, why work on the fluff when the basic running doesn't feel right. I agree. Let them get the gameplay nailed down first and then add "the little things" later. Ian and co. think they have the gameplay in place with 09, and if this is true, that will be enough for me for this year at least. If it is true, then I expect something special in 2010 when they start adding the bells and whistles, but I am still really happy that Madden 09 will at least be solid because it's all we have.
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Old 07-28-2008, 11:30 AM   #26
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Re: looks boring 2 me

Its called IMMERSION!!! Madden has a lack of it, and it shows. They so focused on the casual gamers, that they are forgetting about the hardcore gamers. Refs on field, pre-half-post games shows, franchise like 2k5 did it. If madden was to do this, the majority would be content. Look at all pro 2k8 sidelines and the interaction between players. Stuff like that holds it WOW factor and keep people playing, even after years..look at 2k5. So madden needs to prioritize PRESENTATION and FRANCHISE!!. Gameplay is always good, so just tweak that.
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Old 07-28-2008, 11:54 AM   #27
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Re: looks boring 2 me

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigeastbumrush
They need to mo-cap more one-off situations; like when a guy gets a first down, he makes a 1st down signal or if a guy makes a huge hit, he hops around and celebrates with his teammates, etc.
I'm reviewing the game at the moment and happy to report that players do make 1st down signals pretty regularly. (Though not too much!)
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Old 07-28-2008, 12:35 PM   #28
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Re: looks boring 2 me

Quote:
Originally Posted by cdon2k
While I agree with your point of view that Madden is stale due to the fact that it's missing "the little things". We have to understand (and I think most do) that we have a bigger problem on our hands... As of 08 next gen, we have had an unplayable product released. Forget "the little things", give me a game I can play for more than two weeks without a game killing bug turning up. As I have stated before, I am just looking for a solid release this year that I will be able to play at length without reverting back to last gen due to multiple game play issues. Let them get that right, then they can start adding "the little things". Ian said it best in a post I read a while back when referring to adding player specific running styles:

"Why add player specific running styles when the default ones don't work correctly..."

Basically he was saying, why work on the fluff when the basic running doesn't feel right. I agree. Let them get the gameplay nailed down first and then add "the little things" later. Ian and co. think they have the gameplay in place with 09, and if this is true, that will be enough for me for this year at least. If it is true, then I expect something special in 2010 when they start adding the bells and whistles, but I am still really happy that Madden 09 will at least be solid because it's all we have.
Yeah, but with all that said, it's a perfect example of lowering your expectations to meet whatever Madden is going to be this year. You're right; Madden 08 was a broken product. Though that is the case, should we lower our expectations of what a next gen football game should be in the year 2008? Personally, that's why I sitting on the fence as to if I'm going to pick up this year's installment in the series.
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Old 07-28-2008, 12:51 PM   #29
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Re: looks boring 2 me

LOL People are still saying "wait for next year's Madden. That will be the one that will blow us away." ? Every year I read that on Madden forums.
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Old 07-28-2008, 01:05 PM   #30
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Re: looks boring 2 me

Madden has lost the fun factor for me. When I got Madden 2001 on the PS2, it was new and exciting because it was innovative. Now 8 years later, it is still pretty much the same game. 8 YEARS! Better graphics does not mean innovation. Every year we all think that next year will be the year of new innovation and EA makes us belive that but it does not happen.

I am an Orioles fan and I compare this football gaming downturn with the downturn of the Orioles. There was a point 2 years ago that I just finally lost faith in the team (after 8 losing seasons) and stopped watching them because I knew that the only way the O's would get better is if Angelos would sell the team. I feel the same way with Madden. I feel that only until EASports loses the NFL license or gets rid of Tiburon, then we will get innovation and the game will be fun again. Madden is boring now. Every year we get pretty much the same game with no innovation whatsoever. This year I haven't even played NCAA FB which is very interesting because I used to count the days until it came out. There's just no interest anymore.

Now that the O's have Andy MacPhail at the helm I have a lot more interest - if Angelos could finally have a change of heart (which I never thought would happen) then maybe there's hope for EA. Until then, I won't be playing football anymore. Only innovative and exciting games like MLB the Show and MLB Power Pros take up most of my time now.
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Old 07-28-2008, 02:20 PM   #31
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Re: looks boring 2 me

The scoreboard stuff mentioned a page or two back... yeah, its pretty bad. I have no idea what its supposed to represent and I never have. All I know is that its an idea that shoulda died 3 years ago. Hopefully well never see it again after 09. Hopefully.

The presentation looks like its getting there, but it certainly needs more beef. I dont care about using real networks etc., just copy a network style. My opinion is that a football game nowadays has to be more than just the in-game, it has to be a total experience. 2K5 really spoiled us, but by now that game should be blown out of the water.

I enjoy NCAA 09, but sometimes I wonder why the presentation is so weak. Whats holding the EA Football Teams back? NCAA 07 360 had overlays and all kinds of stats popping up.The cutscenes were beautiful. And even though I\'ll say that NCAA 09 looks great, it feels empty from a presentation standpoint. Its like, I make a good play and they seldom go to an auto-replay. With 2K Football, the auto-replays were constant, and the angles were great. The replay angles in EA football are mostly terrible. I dont get it. Why havent they taken notes from 2K?

One of the things Ive observed over the years, is that when one product has excelled in an area that people loved, the competition tries to copy and/or top it in some way. Presentation is an area where EA has got to steal what 2K did. If they really care and want this thing to get to where fans are expecting it, theyve got to do it. Theyve got make this a top priority. There is nothing wrong with admitting defeat in some areas. Im just getting frustrated with how every year this 4 year+ old game is still wearing the presentation crown. Id even say the 2K3 and 2K4 versions are still ahead, and those were very well presented games if anyone remembers them... but theyre also very old games now and they shouldnt be ahead there, they should be long forgotten.
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Old 07-28-2008, 02:43 PM   #32
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Re: looks boring 2 me

Every year the same ol song and dance.

Most of you need to get it through your heads that Madden will in no way, shape or form ever be 2K5. EA decided years ago to go in a totally different direction than the team at VC had invisioned. It just wont happen. The masses have spoken and the masses simply want Madden to look, feel and play like Madden. I'm not holding my breath for a wealth of cut-scenes, dynamic player interaction and superior presentation. Just expecting more of the same solid, notice I said solid Madden gameplay with the few bells and whistles EA has been known for since the dawn of time. Expect nothing more or nothing less.
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