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Honestly, Madden 09 the game that's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

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Old 12-30-2008, 07:16 PM   #257
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Re: Honestly, Madden 09 the game that's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

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Originally Posted by rgiles36

It's not rational to think that Tiburon decided to rest on its laurels the day the license was secured. That wouldn't make great business sense.
I can't remember who it was, or what the thread was about... but someone here brought up an excellent point in another thread that tackles this...

The poster mentioned how it's common for a company to spend more money to stay ahead of or stay with their competition and less when they've either cornered the market or completely eliminated their competitor(s) since the spending would no longer make sense.

We never look at the negative side of that coin when a product is satisfying us, but when things fall apart like they have this gen, you start to wonder. Then you sometimes hear the devs talk of doing things cheaper, and you start to wonder a little more. Now from a business perspective, it's only smart to try and do things for cheaper if you're going to get the same or similar sales results, I understand that. But the question is (and should be on the minds of every consumer), will that translate into a better product? Does doing it cheaper (meaning less time spent or less personnel devoted, or LESSER-skilled personnel devoted with a combination of both the later conditions) directly mean a lesser product?

Well, all I know is that when a national pizza chain started using cheaper ingredients, started cutting jobs, and started using a new cooking system that made the pizza's faster, the pizza became subpar and I could no longer eat there. Sure, lots of people still do because they're loyal to the brand, all their friends and family go there. The company advertises well, and during the high seasons they give away all kinds of discounts and incentives to keep the traffic flowing so sales are very, very strong... hmmmmm...

Sound familiar? LOL. I'm just say'in...
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Old 12-30-2008, 09:02 PM   #258
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Re: Honestly, Madden 09 the game that's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

i dont think lack of competition is a cop out at all. Everyone in the forums talks of how this game needs a huge change. What more of an incentive would EA have to produce an innovative polished game than to see its historic franchise being overtaken by Espn Football 2k9. Ceo's speak in terms of sales and profits. No one likes losin money. No way would EA let their claim to fame be out done.

And they definately wouldnt fight back against 2k with the weapons feature, online leagues?(for lack of a better term) and madden iq
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:08 PM   #259
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Re: Honestly, Madden 09 the game that's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

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Originally Posted by FresnoST.
well they should take a year off then and just release a couple of patches for '09 if they're going to actually use this as one of their official excuses in every feature of the game..
thats never going to happen. EA is required to release a yearly NFL football title per the deal with the NFL.
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:15 PM   #260
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Re: Honestly, Madden 09 the game that's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

on the topic of whether or not its a cop out to say that EA is resting on its laurels, here's my take.

Its no secret that competition breeds better product. Whether it be video games, cars, kitchen appliances, what have you. If you don't have anyone to "one up" then its easy to become complacent.

With that said, in regards to the Madden franchise, Madden's arguably two best games were '04 & '05 and yes its because 2k was putting on the pressure. But I think thats only part of the equation. '04 & '05 were also Madden's 4th and 5th installments on the PS2/Xbox. I think that has something to do with it too. And I also think that Ortiz's ideas of where to take the series were anywhere but towards a "realistic" state of football. He seemed to be more geared toward pleasing the online crowd and making the game entertaining for head to head play.

But having said that, let me also say this. It doesn't matter what the reasons are for the downfall of Madden. The only thing that matters, at least to me, is that they get out of this hole they're digging and get the game back to the level that it was during its most successful years. And I believe that Ian and Phil will get it back to that level. Madden may not have competition per se, but they do have one motivating factor that to me is more important that competition, a dwindling fanbase.
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:46 PM   #261
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Re: Honestly, Madden 09 the game that's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

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Originally Posted by rgiles36
I think that's a cop out that's used way too frequently among this community and several others.
I most certainly agree with this. There are tons of shooters. Tons of racing games. Tons of rpg's that are str8 garbage. Competition really pushed those games to greatness.

Even sports games like Sony's NBA, 2k's MLB , Even Live for the past few years, have had stiff competition and weren't pushed above average games. So why was Live 07 atrocious? There just wasn't any competition for it. lol

The games are just like sports teams. It takes money; organizational leadership; great strategy and game planning ; developmental talent, skills, and tools; and even heart. If the tools are there but the time frame to implement the necessary changes aren't there....Or if the direction isn't the best...no tools or resources or licenses can help...U can only create/develop to the best of ur ability and see how the end product is recieved.

Competition may push improvement...but doesn't create improvement. In fact, it can push u into regression. Or even complacency. Forcing take unecessary changes, chances, and unfortunately mistakes. Or doing just enough to surpass miniscul competition. Improving just enought to be better than...u make a D, ill make a D+.... Competition isnt the end all of improvement or greatness..sure it an help...but the final determation is the abilities of the team, its direction for a title..implementation of new features...enhancement of the existing...and basically..what they want out of a title...if the artist is satisfied with his creation...no competition can force him to edit his piece.
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:50 PM   #262
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Re: Honestly, Madden 09 the game that's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

Just thought I'd through these two cents in:

I had Madden 09 for about two weeks before I couldn't stand to look at it anymore. Right back to the store.

I pray that EA never gets their greedy little paws on exclusive licenses for NHL games. God only knows what a steaming pile that game would turn into.
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Old 12-31-2008, 02:59 AM   #263
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Re: Honestly, Madden 09 the game that's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

^^^

Thats not fair.

Ea Canada has does an impressive job with Fifa 09. Its a really good game imo.

Ea can certainly make good games.

It begs the question: Why isn't madden as good?
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Old 12-31-2008, 04:58 PM   #264
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Re: Honestly, Madden's sucked the enthusiasm out of me

Great Post! Good to hear real opinions from football gaming fans.

I agree with most what everyone has said. The root of the problem with Madden is the culture of EA. Let's review the history when Madden had competition:

1.Late 90s: Fans saw the use of polygons in other sports games like Sony's Basketball Series. Madden Fans wanted the same from EA for their football game , but what did EA say back then : Polygon players in a football game can't be done, it would take too much memory and slow down the game , making it unplayable. So what happens, 989 Sony releases Gameday which had Polygon model football players. And if I remember correctly, that game was just awesome to play. With this competition, it blows EA's claim out of the water and the next year we get polygon model players in madden.

2.Early 2000s : We see all these other games starting to use online. Even on dial up. We want Madden online, how awesome that would be. EA says it can't be done with dial up. What happens. the competition, Sega, releases their 2k game online on the Dreamcast. Even dial up, the game plays exceptionally smooth. Blows another one of EA's excuses out of the water. With the competition, EA releases madden on ps2 in it's 2nd/3rd installment for that system with online capabilities.

I'm sure I"m missing more, but those were the 2 things that came to mind where EA's bull**** excuses to make their football game better were blown out of the water by competition. I look at the masterpiece that is NBA 2K9 and I think to myself why can't Madden be like this? If we had to label Madden as a scout would label a football prospect, we'd label it a 'tweener'. Someone good enough for college but can't cut it in the pros. It feels, look, plays like it's stuck somewhere in a imaginary console between the ps2/xbox and PS3/XBOX360. As you guys said, I look at other games on the next gen systems and see how those games are using the power of these systems. Madden sure isn't.

If it wasn't for competition in the past to push madden, we probably would be playing the same Madden 2D genesis/snes looking type of game on our ps3's and 360s. We would ask them to upgrade everything, but probably get some b.s. excuses from EA.

Last edited by hyacinth1; 12-31-2008 at 05:01 PM.
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