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View Poll Results: Whichsstem is better?
The Number System 43 67.19%
The Perk System 9 14.06%
Both Combined In A Way 12 18.75%
Voters: 64. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-30-2009, 11:57 PM   #25
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Re: What would you rather have?

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Originally Posted by CreatineKasey
Love the ideas! That'd really breathe life into a sports game! GJ thinking outside the box.
The worst part is most of it has been done before and therefore could easily be done again. It is just a matter of putting together all the ideas from previous games with a few little twists added in. The original head coach had the ratings ranges. The new head coach had the maxes for potential, the learning and potential, the coaches effecting development, and the personalities to an extent. NBA 2k9 kinda did the hiding ratings in favor of more general letter grades at least to an extent. APF did the abilities.

I think with all these systems out there each having their advantages they really need to look into taking the best parts of each. The only real problem is with all the ratings I would want to add there would be a lot more work going into rating players.
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Old 03-31-2009, 12:30 AM   #26
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Re: What would you rather have?

I'd rather a 1-99 scale for speed, than a gold silver bronze generic rating for speed.

Or for any rating that matter.
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Old 03-31-2009, 12:49 AM   #27
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Re: What would you rather have?

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Originally Posted by Exonerated
I'd rather a 1-99 scale for speed, than a gold silver bronze generic rating for speed.

Or for any rating that matter.
How about the 1-99 rating existing within the game code but hidden from our view?

I really like the idea of a small random variability on a game to game basis. Not everyone plays at the same level every game. It'd be nice to see this replicated in a game.
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Old 03-31-2009, 12:58 AM   #28
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Re: What would you rather have?

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Originally Posted by CreatineKasey
How about the 1-99 rating existing within the game code but hidden from our view?

I really like the idea of a small random variability on a game to game basis. Not everyone plays at the same level every game. It'd be nice to see this replicated in a game.
How would we edit players?

Its true that players have good days and bad days. Lets say a QB with 92 deep accuracy. Can have a range of 87-97 accuracy, depending on good and bad days? How do we determine good and bad days? What about a PLay Now game?

I've seen the hot/cold streak for NCAA 09 and the heat bar for NBA 2K9, Player Form in FIFA 09. I guess player Form could also be used in Madden. It can be Great - Good - Neutral - Bad - Terrible in terms of form.

But I hate seeing Form for FIFA 09 before the game.
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Old 03-31-2009, 01:35 AM   #29
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Re: What would you rather have?

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Originally Posted by CreatineKasey
I'm a 100% ability guy. I think measurables just don't do players justice. Whenever the numbers game comes up I always just think of Jerry Rice and all his unbelievable intangibles. He wasn't the fastest, strongest, or most agile yet he was the best football player ever. How can that be best represented? Abilities.

It gives players a life that numbers just do not.

RB A has 92 speed 68 STR 88 AGIL 84 OVR
RB B has 89 speed 70 STR 85 AGIL 84 OVR

Does that really separate much of anything? Would it correctly characterize each player effectively?

RB A has a speed ability, a quick feet ability and has a superb spin move
RB B has a strength ability, a superb stiff arm and truck stick, and he gets stronger the more he gets the ball. Both players succeed under certain playcalling and playstyles, but they are DIFFERENT playstyles which would be effectively characterized with abilities.

Dave Megget VS. Christian Okoye in APF. Perfect example. One guy has bad hands, is a heavy, workhorse, straight ahead plow. The other RB (Megget) has good hands, is extremely agile and can return kicks very well. Both could have the same OVR but both play extremely different and is EFFECTIVELY characterized with abilities.

This style of describing players just gives them a life numbers don't give. Some may argue "what about all the non ability attributes" well they can be hidden, but be within an average range, which would be expected for the majority of NFL players. Abilities can just point out outstanding abilities.

I think it is important to NOT show the numbers of players. Having ratings unknown draws attention to the style of the player not the number.

It's not like when you watch football you think "boy that Ronde Barber is about a 92 zone coverage". You say "boy that Ronde Barber really excels in zone coverage". To me it is a no brainer.

I don't like viewing my video game football as just a bunch of polygons with numbers attached to them. That's what happens in a numbers-based game in my opinion.

A pitfall for this system could be the issue of average and below average players lacking in abilities along with a way to decipher them and know whether they'd work in their system. I.E. possession WR that's a role player or 3-4 DE not a 4-3 DE.

I understand there is a "Weapons" system in Madden but personally that just didn't cut it because the game still reverts back to viewing players as numbers.

Numbers can and have worked in the past, I just think abilities work far better for a sports game.

I apologize this got a bit long. I just really strongly believe in this topic.
Bravo!!!
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Old 03-31-2009, 01:44 AM   #30
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Re: What would you rather have?

Abilities is a 1-2-3-4-5 system. Numbers are 1-99.

A guy with quick feet versus a guy with not as quick feet. 99 agi v 70 agi. If ratings worked (not the issue in debate here), these players are starkly different.

One of these players has a good stiff arm, and the other can return kicks????

RB A has 99 stiff arm, RB B has 99 KICK return.


Numbers have far more flexibility.
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Old 03-31-2009, 02:03 AM   #31
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Re: What would you rather have?

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Originally Posted by Exonerated
Abilities is a 1-2-3-4-5 system. Numbers are 1-99.

A guy with quick feet versus a guy with not as quick feet. 99 agi v 70 agi. If ratings worked (not the issue in debate here), these players are starkly different.

One of these players has a good stiff arm, and the other can return kicks????

RB A has 99 stiff arm, RB B has 99 KICK return.


Numbers have far more flexibility.
Yes, I agree in terms of determining player abilities numbers are the way to go. That is why I think they should be in the background controlling everything. In terms of realistic scouting and viewing of players though they are not the most realistic way to go. Can you really watch kyle orton play and tell me be like yeah, his mid range accuracy is 78? No, that is completely unrealistic. You can however watch him play and be like, yeah, his mid range accuracy is in the medium to maybe slightly above average area.
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