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Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

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Old 03-31-2009, 10:25 PM   #57
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Re: Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

random. who gets the ball should be based on fatigue level relative to others,strength,and ball handling,
Pileups should only be done in some situation not everytime the ball is fumbled that would get crazy. plus to you could have same team members on top and one or two opposing going for the ball or even ball sqiurting out of pile every once in a while. the attempt to pile causes the ball to bounce out of bounds. qb dropping snap diving undercenter. multiple players tackling causing fumble.

check out what they did with the rugby series for their scrums i never played the game so i couldn't be helpful with that

you guys worked so hard to get away from the button mashing making people take finger off of sprint button to get proper jukes and spins. don't reintroduce it for the sake of a feature
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Old 03-31-2009, 10:31 PM   #58
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Re: Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

This is actually where the Awareness Rating would be key - here is quick awareness:






If it is going to be user based, maybe something like what they did on Resident Evil 4. When there is something crazy about to happen you have to react to a sudden combination of buttons very quickly.

I think this would be good to use as far as using it as your opening to grab the ball.
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Old 03-31-2009, 10:36 PM   #59
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Re: Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

No button mash, destroys controllers and just isnt fun or strategic.

I say timing game ala Fuzion frenzy or some sort of stick game like splinter cell and picking locks.

NO MASH!!!!
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Old 03-31-2009, 10:37 PM   #60
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Re: Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

Also take note of the crazy emotion the players show after the decision. The outcome of the new pile up feature will be a little less cool if the players just stand up and walk like zombies to the bench.
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Old 03-31-2009, 10:51 PM   #61
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Re: Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PGaither84
Button mashing rewards only the player who has a turbo controller and not skill. Stick skills and timming are part of playing madden. Button mashing is not. There is a destinct difference here.
This is my main problem with what seems to be the #1 anti-button mashing argument. You do not build your game around avoiding problems with turbo controllers. You build it for the basic system. I'm all for taking away the advantages that cheesers may have, but not at the risk of not utilizing the best available control scheme.

It's not like these scrums are going to happen on every play either, it might happen once a season for all we know. If there's a stick skill solution that makes sense, I wouldn't be opposed to it. I'm just saying I'm not going to go against button mashing because some people have turbo controllers.

And I personally don't understand the argument that hitting buttons is "arcade". I understand that gameplay elements that don't reflect the game of football isn't "sim", but I don't see the argument against pushing buttons. I have good stick skills, but I've always interpreted that as my use of the controller as a whole (not excluding the buttons themselves). Last time I checked, arcade games have sticks too. They're different types of skills, but being able to hit a button faster than another is a skill, just like manipulating a stick is a skill. I don't get the difference, but maybe it's just me.

I also said in my post that ratings should somewhat play a part. If a little dude gets the ball and no one's close, I don't want to see a big guy take it away. I don't mind some luck being involved either with balls squirting out (sounds bad, I know). But I think if it's a 50/50 ball and you have a lineman and a CB, then the lineman should have somewhat of an advantage and the CB would have to really dominate the button mashing or stick skill whatever type of control scheme you want to use to obtain the ball.
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Old 03-31-2009, 10:51 PM   #62
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Re: Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

I could deal with a QTE in this one situation only if you guys don't already have a better implementation.

I'd set it up like this - fumble, a plie-up ensues, then we start QTE:

It would be a series of 4 button presses (using the XBox 360 controller for this example) to help determine who got the ball with a very small roll of the dice included.

QTE #1 - Flash X, B, Y, or A and User has to match it - This controls one arm of your ball carrier trying to grab the ball. If you get it right, he gets an arm on it, get it wrong and he doesn't - BUT he still has another chance because ...

QTE #2 - Flash X, B, Y, or A and User must match it. This is for the other arm or weaker arm (left arm for right handers). If you match it, you get that arm on the ball. So at this point, you have either one arm or two arms around the ball in the pile.

QTE #3 - Flash X, B, Y, A, LB or RB and User must match it. This is for grip. If user matches this one than he gets a solid grip on the football with one arm or both arm if he nailed the first two QTEs. If user misses this one, but has matched either of both of the first two QTEs, he doesn't lose the ball, because there is still one more. If this is the third miss in a row, it goes to a 95% chance of CPU ball with a slight "roll of the dice" logic for a bit of unpredictability.

QTE #4 - Flash X, B, Y, A, LB, or RB and User must match it. This one controls whether or not you get a team mate to pile over you and help "protect" the football. Matching all 4 gives you a 95%+ chance of coming up with the fumble, the only variable being the "roll of the dice".

Now obviously, it breaks down to lower percentages of success depending on how many of the 4 QTEs you match. If you match strong arm, grip, and team mate protection, you would have ~80% recovery odds. If you get weak arm, grip, team mate protection you get ~70% success. Strong arm plus grip only or strong arm plus team mate only = 60% Weak arm with grip only or weak arm with teammate only = 50%. Only strong arm = less than 40% and only weak arm = less than 30%.

Obviously these percentages can be tweaked to whatever the team would like. This has been my idea for handling a fumble pileup in a football game since 2006/2007 or whenever God Of War I came out for PS2. I thought that by applying percentages to the QTEs it makes a seemingly arcade way to handle the plieup more sim, but also gives the user control over the fumble more than having it completely random.

You could also include a speed slider for the QTE as well or just adjust speed as you go from Rookie, Pro, All Pro, All Madden. A slider would be better though, for gamers who maybe can't react as quickly but still like to play the game at it's highest level of AI.

Obviously it is long and drawn out when I type it but in real time it would be a succession of QTEs in probably 3-5 seconds or less in real time as the pileup is occuring.

What are some opinions on this? I know people pretty much have a love/hate for QTE but in the right place they useful IMO. I could even envision using it for Kicking FGs depending on distance with it quicker or more button presses or longer FGs and shorter and fewer buttons for less short FGs or XP.

Everyone wants to overhaul the kicking game and while this wouldn't address punting or KR/PR, it could be of use for making kicking harder and therefore more realistic as opposed to booming 50+ yarders every game.
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Last edited by JohnDoe8865; 03-31-2009 at 10:53 PM. Reason: spelling errors
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Old 03-31-2009, 10:58 PM   #63
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Re: Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

You know the first thing you will be doing when the demo comes out on August 4 or 11 is try to see what the fight for the fumble actually it.

At least I know I will.
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Old 03-31-2009, 10:59 PM   #64
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Re: Could we please have more info on fight for the fumble?

for this to be successful first there needs to be a strength and weight check.
factor in fatigue.

After these checks it becomes button smashing x or a or whatever.

The higher the equation from the previous checks the less you have to smash the x button....

so if Warrick Dunn(180lbs) goes up against Grady Jackson(360lbs) then Grady should not have to press that hard to get the ball during a pileup.
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