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Old 04-20-2009, 07:00 PM   #73
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Re: twitter hints at improved blocking!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian_Cummings_EA
3. [Major] We DRASTICALLY reduced the tolerance (i.e. yards away) for a defender to tackle a ballcarrier. Last year it was upwards of 3 yards, which gives that feeling of 'suction'. This year it's closer to one yard, but it also scales based on the tackle rating of the player...meaning that it will just feel harder to get by the Urlacher's and R. Lewis's.
!!!

Ian, does this mean that we can finally have a realistic "SIM" Brian Russell too, with a tackling range of about an inch?







Courtesy of KSK!
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Old 04-20-2009, 07:39 PM   #74
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Re: twitter hints at improved blocking!

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Originally Posted by burne
!!!

Ian, does this mean that we can finally have a realistic "SIM" Brian Russell too, with a tackling range of about an inch?







Courtesy of KSK!
Funniest post of the day! I nearly wet I laughed so hard
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Old 04-20-2009, 07:40 PM   #75
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Re: twitter hints at improved blocking!

This last post by Ian is the most excited I've ever been for madden this year. Hearing complete reworking of blocking and changing engage/disengage rules/moves/animations is music to my ears! I'm officially jacked and he basically mentioned things I've been directly looking for for years. Might have to preorder this beast of a game and game with some OS guys opening night
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Old 04-20-2009, 09:41 PM   #76
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Re: twitter hints at improved blocking!

Ian,

With regards to running and tackling while engaged, is Madden '10 going to have proper hit detection while going into the line. IE, players running through players laying on the ground (instead of tripping/stumbling) and slow downs via friction (rubbing lineman as they run past).

This has plagged video football for years as RB's can simply bypass the pile and go full speed through tiny holes. It makes short yardage runs unrealistically easy. If the hole is tight the RB has to slow down to get through it...there's 1200 pounds of beef to get through.

This would be especially prevelant for a back such as Brandon Jacobs (or a FB). 260 pounds takes up space and needs bigger holes then a Warrick Dunn. That friction caused by the tight holes (and stumbling/slowdowns because of fallen players) needs to be represented.
----------------------------------------------

Also, how is the issue of run support from the secondary being addressed. Part of the issue in past rendeitions was that the safties would play the run between the tackles. In reality, they are alley fillers on a run play.

That is, they read run, they need to take away the outside run (sweeps as well as bounces).

This issue also exists because of overly effective WR blocking. On an inside ISO for example the WR should not stalk block the corner for a number of reasons.
1) Stalk blocking is much more difficult then represented in the game.
2) On an inside run, the WR needs to block the safety and not the corner.
3) WRs, in general, are lazy on blocking...especially on non-perimeter runs.
4) Corners, in general, are stronger (and more physical) then receivers.

In essence, the constantly bounce outside should be negated because a DB should be there. A Cover 2 corner needs to close that edge down and a Cover 4 safety needs to effectively run the alley.

Bouncng an inside run should be rare, and usually the result of a missed tackle to force over-pursuit. The corner should be either unblocked, or able to reasonably get rid of that block. The safety's should come down to playy the alley. On a dive/iso there should be two unblocked defenders outside of the TE (and really, the DE should also be helping), making that quite a futile effort.
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Old 04-20-2009, 09:46 PM   #77
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Re: twitter hints at improved blocking!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian_Cummings_EA
We typically tune "SIM" to All-Pro, and any time we play competitively here we always play on All-Pro. But I was playing the art director today with more of a focus on presentation and cameras and other stuff, so we went for the more casual experience. I'd like to try again on All-Pro and see what kind of experience we have.

It's definitely still in progress, but I can say a few things about why the running game got much more effective as well...

1. [Minor] The game speed makes running inherently a bit easier. You have more vision to hit your holes.

2. [Minor] The changes to turn rates apply to both defense and offense, but user controlled defenders (i.e. Mike) aren't necessarily used to them so they have the tendency to overpursue plays since they're used to being able to always hold sprint and still make a play.

3. [Major] We DRASTICALLY reduced the tolerance (i.e. yards away) for a defender to tackle a ballcarrier. Last year it was upwards of 3 yards, which gives that feeling of 'suction'. This year it's closer to one yard, but it also scales based on the tackle rating of the player...meaning that it will just feel harder to get by the Urlacher's and R. Lewis's.

4. [Major] we also changed pretty much how all of our blocking works, and added all kinds of new animations and technologies (some announced, some not).

So all of these things immediately tip the scale to the offense so we have to tune accordingly.

To re-balance the first few (especially the lower tackle tolerance yardage) we really just need to keep tuning pursuit. If a player could "tackle" you from 3 yards away last year, that hides a lot of pursuit issues that come out when he can't tackle you unless he's within arm's reach. This is still ongoing, and I think you saw it in rough shape at community day. LB's would crash right into the middle and then get hung up and not be able to get back outside. Which leads to the second one...

We have to re-work how our players 'disengage'. We're working on giving them the full ability to tackle while still engaged, which helps a lot, but is also a tough balance because you have to do some pretty complex checks to see if he's "free enough" to tackle a guy, or else the suction problem comes back. The other main thing is just with animation and logic - guys need to be able to shed free of a guy in the opposite direction, and do it FAST. This will not only help outside runs but QB scrambling shenanigans.

Both are high on the list...being tuned as we speak.
Nice...
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Old 04-20-2009, 10:40 PM   #78
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Re: twitter hints at improved blocking!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian_Cummings_EA
We typically tune "SIM" to All-Pro, and any time we play competitively here we always play on All-Pro. But I was playing the art director today with more of a focus on presentation and cameras and other stuff, so we went for the more casual experience. I'd like to try again on All-Pro and see what kind of experience we have.

It's definitely still in progress, but I can say a few things about why the running game got much more effective as well...

1. [Minor] The game speed makes running inherently a bit easier. You have more vision to hit your holes.

2. [Minor] The changes to turn rates apply to both defense and offense, but user controlled defenders (i.e. Mike) aren't necessarily used to them so they have the tendency to overpursue plays since they're used to being able to always hold sprint and still make a play.

3. [Major] We DRASTICALLY reduced the tolerance (i.e. yards away) for a defender to tackle a ballcarrier. Last year it was upwards of 3 yards, which gives that feeling of 'suction'. This year it's closer to one yard, but it also scales based on the tackle rating of the player...meaning that it will just feel harder to get by the Urlacher's and R. Lewis's.

4. [Major] we also changed pretty much how all of our blocking works, and added all kinds of new animations and technologies (some announced, some not).

So all of these things immediately tip the scale to the offense so we have to tune accordingly.

To re-balance the first few (especially the lower tackle tolerance yardage) we really just need to keep tuning pursuit. If a player could "tackle" you from 3 yards away last year, that hides a lot of pursuit issues that come out when he can't tackle you unless he's within arm's reach. This is still ongoing, and I think you saw it in rough shape at community day. LB's would crash right into the middle and then get hung up and not be able to get back outside. Which leads to the second one...

We have to re-work how our players 'disengage'. We're working on giving them the full ability to tackle while still engaged, which helps a lot, but is also a tough balance because you have to do some pretty complex checks to see if he's "free enough" to tackle a guy, or else the suction problem comes back. The other main thing is just with animation and logic - guys need to be able to shed free of a guy in the opposite direction, and do it FAST. This will not only help outside runs but QB scrambling shenanigans.

Both are high on the list...being tuned as we speak.
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Old 04-20-2009, 11:17 PM   #79
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Re: twitter hints at improved blocking!

Quote:
Originally Posted by burne
!!!

Ian, does this mean that we can finally have a realistic "SIM" Brian Russell too, with a tackling range of about an inch?







Courtesy of KSK!
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Old 04-20-2009, 11:22 PM   #80
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Re: twitter hints at improved blocking!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sven Draconian
Ian,

With regards to running and tackling while engaged, is Madden '10 going to have proper hit detection while going into the line. IE, players running through players laying on the ground (instead of tripping/stumbling) and slow downs via friction (rubbing lineman as they run past).

This has plagged video football for years as RB's can simply bypass the pile and go full speed through tiny holes. It makes short yardage runs unrealistically easy. If the hole is tight the RB has to slow down to get through it...there's 1200 pounds of beef to get through.

This would be especially prevelant for a back such as Brandon Jacobs (or a FB). 260 pounds takes up space and needs bigger holes then a Warrick Dunn. That friction caused by the tight holes (and stumbling/slowdowns because of fallen players) needs to be represented.
+1

You have a friend in me 'bro. You should know that this is something I left in my feedback down in Orlando and something I mentioned to Ian personally as well.

2K8 didn't feature much collision detection in the run game, but 2K5 really shined here IMO. I'm not sure if the Ian and team can make big strides in this area this year, but I'm hoping we get a little something there. There was a push the pile animation in Madden 08 though it was infrequent. I'd settle for something like that this year. By the way, I'm primarily talking about colliding with your blockers. There needs to be animations for that.
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