Wildcat cheddar already...sigh...

[PGaither84]

I'm sorry to say but a lot of these ideas are ridiculous, over the top, and un-sim. To me the solution to a lot of the problems seem simple. Ranked games should be on All-Madden difficulty, 8min quarters with accelerated clock going all game and set to 20 seconds.

-The harder difficulty alone should impact how effective cheesers will be.

-8min quarters will reduse a lot of the hurry up as players do not like to play long games and hurry up will make 8min quarters games long.

-Accelerated clock running all game long will realistically shorten the time players have to make several audibles and pressing A/X to hury to he line should increase the chance of a false start.

In regards to the Wildcat, if it isn't already in place the real QB should not be abel to be subsituted out of the formation and no matter what you audible into, he should always go back under center/shot gun if you are not in the WC.

These are not only realistic solutions to cheeser problems, but are how the game should play anyway. I do not expect or want a ranked game to be 15min quarters, i save that for unraked, offline play. However, I cannot imagine anyone who wants to represent real football and discourage cheese play that would be agaisnt this.

You should make up or force penalties that aren't realistic, fix the core of the problem. Force accelerated clock, make it run all game, and make the quarter length longer to compensate for it being on. Unranked should be wide open for game type and where real cheese palyers can go to play other people online.

When the game becomes more realistic, the gameplay will follow. There is an old rule in engineering, "Form follows function." It's simple and to the point. If madden isn't sim, players will abuse the system in an unsim way. get used to it. If madden is true sim, then real answers will solve those problems. People will tell me Vick was the best scrambling QB, but it was without a doubt Fran Tarkington. Tarkington's scrambling ability and style make people forget that he held all the major passing records until Marino came along. To have your mobility and skills make people forget you are the leagues best passer is something else. Tarkington, Vick, and others show that you can be successful as a scrambling QB, but they also teach you that you die by the very sword you live by. Tarkington lost 3 Superbowls, and when Vick's lanes were shut down by Philly, he couldn't do anything.

There are real solutions to these cheese problems. the real problem isn't that you can scramble, isn't that you can rocket catch, it's that there is no real containment, that the D doesn't attack the RC. The way people audible isn't even realistic. Making the pre-snap sim will erase that. You need to force a QB to finish his audible and adjustment cadence/signal before you can stop it and move on.

I know it's a lot to read and thank you.

[shttymcgee]

Quote: Originally Posted by Moostache

DING DING DING!!!! Winner, winner chicken dinner! The single easiest solution to controlling what many people would consider cheesy gameplay (constant shifts and players out of position and specific things like mobile QB scrambles all over the field like in past years) is to more aggressively apply PENALTIES to the game! I have been calling for this since before Madden NFL 06 and nothing has changed my mind very much in the last few years either... If someone has to worry about getting an elevated number of holding calls if they are constantly taking the QB out of the pocket (outside the tackle box - thus giving the DE and OLB an advantage to reach the QB that is NOT expressed in the game currently, namely that the OT MUST disengage or face a holding call!!!), then players would soon learn that it is a bad strategy to do so... This holds true for dozens of cheesy things....constant audibles? False starts and offsides should be far more prevalent....constant bump and run? The CBs should be so gassed by the second half that you are seeing Defensive holding and Illegal contact penalties left and right (or second and third stringers forced to play because the starter is too gassed to go any more)...constant and persistent scrambling? In addition to more holding calls, this should result in illegal man downfield (a penalty that was in 2K5 I believe btw...). Using the actual rules of the game - and having the penalties called in gameplay when players blatantly ignore the situations that would likely cause more penalties or miscues in real life - is one of two ways to instantly amp up the realism of the franchise without doing anything else to the game....the other way is by implementing an accurate and progressive fatigue system that portrays how players tire over the course of a play, a drive, a quarter, a half and a game...

I don't think I agree with the bump and run idea. Some teams (see 2007 Giants) literally play bump and run coverage on every down. Sometimes they pass #1 on to the safeties, but they always align in a press alignment.

[PGaither84]

Quote: Originally Posted by shttymcgee

I don't think I agree with the bump and run idea. Some teams (see 2007 Giants) literally play bump and run coverage on every down. Sometimes they pass #1 on to the safeties, but they always align in a press alignment.

And you can't forget the Patriot's game plan against the Rams "Hit them when they have the ball and hit them when they do not have the ball." Being physical isn't bad if your team is physical. If your DBs are not BnR players, they should get burned often enough to prevent you from wanting to call it all game long. The WR/DB interaction blog looks like it solved this to an extent.

[stux]

No matter what they do these cheesers will always find a way around it to cheese.

This is the reason my Madden is offline franchise only.

It is like in a FPS, after a while there are always hackers, glitchers, and people finding anyway they can to have an advantage that wasn't meant to be that way and isn't realistic.

MMO's suffer from the same problems.

Unfortunately, this doesn't end in the gaming community, there are plenty of liars, thieves, and cheats in real life. And a lot of them find ways around the laws, ways not to get caught, or laws that aren't enforced or if they are are still profitable.

The only way they are going to have a chance to slow it down is if they monitor what they are doing and keep changing the game to prevent it with constant updates OR create some system that looks for what they are doings and marks them as cheesers. But again they would still need to continuously add to the list of goofy crap they come up with for detection.

No one can never stop this kind of crap completely. If someone wants to cheat they can always find a way.

[Moostache]

Quote: Originally Posted by PGaither84

And you can't forget the Patriot's game plan against the Rams .

You mean "cheat because the league is gutless and the referees are terrified of being seen as too strict and determining the outcome of the game"?

What the Pats did - first to the Rams in the SB and later to the Colts in the AFC title game - was plain and simple cheating...the rules say no contact beyond 5 yards...the tape of those games will show literally dozens of examples of Pats players breaking the rules with impunity!!!!

[RufusTruthfist]

Quote: Originally Posted by Moostache

You mean "cheat because the league is gutless and the referees are terrified of being seen as too strict and determining the outcome of the game"? What the Pats did - first to the Rams in the SB and later to the Colts in the AFC title game - was plain and simple cheating...the rules say no contact beyond 5 yards...the tape of those games will show literally dozens of examples of Pats players breaking the rules with impunity!!!!

You'll get over it.

Eventually.

[RufusTruthfist]

If the guys who have actually played the game, and experienced the Wildcat firsthand, are not worried then neither am I.

[SouthernBrick]

Quote: Originally Posted by PGaither84

I'm sorry to say but a lot of these ideas are ridiculous, over the top, and un-sim. To me the solution to a lot of the problems seem simple. Ranked games should be on All-Madden difficulty, 8min quarters with accelerated clock going all game and set to 20 seconds. -The harder difficulty alone should impact how effective cheesers will be. -8min quarters will reduse a lot of the hurry up as players do not like to play long games and hurry up will make 8min quarters games long. -Accelerated clock running all game long will realistically shorten the time players have to make several audibles and pressing A/X to hury to he line should increase the chance of a false start. In regards to the Wildcat, if it isn't already in place the real QB should not be abel to be subsituted out of the formation and no matter what you audible into, he should always go back under center/shot gun if you are not in the WC. These are not only realistic solutions to cheeser problems, but are how the game should play anyway. I do not expect or want a ranked game to be 15min quarters, i save that for unraked, offline play. However, I cannot imagine anyone who wants to represent real football and discourage cheese play that would be agaisnt this. You should make up or force penalties that aren't realistic, fix the core of the problem. Force accelerated clock, make it run all game, and make the quarter length longer to compensate for it being on. Unranked should be wide open for game type and where real cheese palyers can go to play other people online. When the game becomes more realistic, the gameplay will follow. There is an old rule in engineering, "Form follows function." It's simple and to the point. If madden isn't sim, players will abuse the system in an unsim way. get used to it. If madden is true sim, then real answers will solve those problems. People will tell me Vick was the best scrambling QB, but it was without a doubt Fran Tarkington. Tarkington's scrambling ability and style make people forget that he held all the major passing records until Marino came along. To have your mobility and skills make people forget you are the leagues best passer is something else. Tarkington, Vick, and others show that you can be successful as a scrambling QB, but they also teach you that you die by the very sword you live by. Tarkington lost 3 Superbowls, and when Vick's lanes were shut down by Philly, he couldn't do anything. There are real solutions to these cheese problems. the real problem isn't that you can scramble, isn't that you can rocket catch, it's that there is no real containment, that the D doesn't attack the RC. The way people audible isn't even realistic. Making the pre-snap sim will erase that. You need to force a QB to finish his audible and adjustment cadence/signal before you can stop it and move on. I know it's a lot to read and thank you.

Not sure about the 8 minutes for ranked game, but i can dig it. That would be at least a 2 hour game. Hour in a half at the most.