Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

[jip4]

Quote: Originally Posted by reyes the roof

If Patrick Turner is doing well, his catching, route running, catch in traffic and ability to beat press coverage etc don't get better because he is doing well. The way it would really happen is his catching, route running, etc go up first and that is what would cause him to do well

Exactly. Progression causes performance, not vise-versa.

[TeamBuilder]

Quote: Originally Posted by jip4

I'm sorry, this is the point that you keep missing. Real life players have ability levels, which determine the level that they play at. Madden ratings are our attempts to quantify those ability levels. But all we can do, mostly, is guess at them. And as we learn more about certain players, we can adjust their Madden rating. But it's not because their ability level has changed. It's because how much we know about them has changed. Video game Madden players have madden ratings, which determine the level that they play at. We don't have to attempt to quantify those ratings. Because we know exactly what they are.

I hear what you're saying and I understand what you're saying. But I think what you're missing is that a player in real life can improve his ability in a certain area. A wide receiver with suspect hands, the more balls he catches the better his hands will get. If he catches 60 balls in a year why can't he progress a little bit in that rating?

If an "F" rated player in my franchise catches 60 passes he won't progress a single point... but if an "F" rated player catches 60 passes in real life... he will get an increased catch rating in a roster update... That's all I'm saying.

[jip4]

Quote: Originally Posted by TeamBuilder

I hear what you're saying and I understand what you're saying. But I think what you're missing is that a player in real life can improve his ability in a certain area. A wide receiver with suspect hands, the more balls he catches the better his hands will get. If he catches 60 balls in a year why can't he progress a little bit in that rating? If an "F" rated player in my franchise catches 60 passes he won't progress a single point... but if an "F" rated player catches 60 passes in real life... he will get an increased catch rating in a roster update... That's all I'm saying.

1. Of course players can get better. I'm not talking about axing progression all together, here.

2. This is not true, and I'm not sure why you think it is (at least not in terms of catching balls on game day). In fact, it's the other way around: The better his hands get, the more balls he will catch.

3. "But if an 'F' rated player catches 60 passes in real life" then he wasn't really an 'F' rated player. But in Madden an F rated player really is an F rated player.

4. Roster updates = re-evaluation, not progression. And there's no need to re-evaluate players when we know exactly just how good they are.

[TeamBuilder]

Quote: Originally Posted by jip4

1. Of course players can get better. I'm not talking about axing progression all together, here. 2. This is not true, and I'm not sure why you think it is (at least not in terms of catching balls on game day). In fact, it's the other way around: The better his hands get, the more balls he will catch. 3. "But if an 'F' rated player catches 60 passes in real life" then he wasn't really an 'F' rated player. But in Madden an F rated player really is an F rated player. 4. Roster updates = re-evaluation, not progression. And there's no need to re-evaluate players when we know exactly just how good they are.

"F" rated potential, not "F" rated OVR, so why can't he improve? That's why I think his potential shouldn't be set in stone.

The whole point of this thread was that a player shouldn't have a set potential rating, it should be able to fluctuate, there shouldn't be any certain spot where it says "okay you can't get better".

[Glorious Arc]

Quote: Originally Posted by TeamBuilder

"F" rated potential, not "F" rated OVR, so why can't he improve? That's why I think his potential shouldn't be set in stone. The whole point of this thread was that a player shouldn't have a set potential rating, it should be able to fluctuate, there shouldn't be any certain spot where it says "okay you can't get better".

Your definition of potential is what is causing most of this debate. Potential when defined into football terms means that it is the players MAX abilities to perform. If that his max(meaning his highest) then how could it possibly get any higher? If anything it should only get lower if he gets hurt but that is the only way it should be able to move. No one IRL ever gets a higher potential. If that was the case then I could become the next HOF player and so could you and so could your 12 grade math teacher. Do you see how flawed the system is by saying potential is not the max a person can ever achieve?

The real definition of Potential is this...

1 : existing in possibility : capable of development into actuality <potential benefits>
2 : expressing possibility; specifically : of, relating to, or constituting a verb phrase expressing possibility, liberty, or power by the use of an auxiliary with the infinitive of the verb (as in “it may rain”)

Another set of definitions

1.	possible, as opposed to actual: the potential uses of nuclear energy.

2.	capable of being or becoming: a potential danger to safety.

3.	Grammar. expressing possibility: the potential subjunctive in Latin; the potential use of can in I can go.

4.	Archaic. potent 1 .

–noun

5.	possibility; potentiality: an investment that has little growth potential.

6.	a latent excellence or ability that may or may not be developed.

7.	Grammar. a. a potential aspect, mood, construction, case, etc. b. a form in the potential.

8.	Electricity. electric potential (def. 1).

9.	Mathematics, Physics. a type of function from which the intensity of a field may be derived, usually by differentiation.

10.	someone or something that is considered a worthwhile possibility: The list of job applications has been narrowed to half a dozen potentials.

[TeamBuilder]

Quote: Originally Posted by Glorious Arc

Your definition of potential is what is causing most of this debate. Potential when defined into football terms means that it is the players MAX abilities to perform. If that his max(meaning his highest) then how could it possibly get any higher? If anything it should only get lower if he gets hurt. The real definition of Potential is this... 1 : existing in possibility : capable of development into actuality <potential benefits> 2 : expressing possibility; specifically : of, relating to, or constituting a verb phrase expressing possibility, liberty, or power by the use of an auxiliary with the infinitive of the verb (as in “it may rain”)

In Madden I don't think you can say a player has an "actuality" because it's like trying to predict the future. That's where PBP should have an impact. I'm not saying it should all be PBP I'm just saying that it should factor in to the point where a player doesn't have a pre-determined "actuality".

[likebuttababy11]

It was perfect on the old xbox from 2006-2007,the last one on xbox was messed up w/ defenders losing their awareness,I remember Julius Peterson losing like 20 the 1 year and he was down to like 34 ovr awr after 3 years.It was cool to do the training camps to upgrade your player 1,3,5,7 points.

[jip4]

Quote: Originally Posted by TeamBuilder

In Madden I don't think you can say a player has an "actuality" because it's like trying to predict the future. That's where PBP should have an impact. I'm not saying it should all be PBP I'm just saying that it should factor in to the point where a player doesn't have a pre-determined "actuality".

Again, too egalitarian. Give me 5 stud offensive linemen and a crappy defense, and I could put up some decent stats. Doesn't make me better than Adrian Peterson.