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Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

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Old 09-07-2009, 01:29 PM   #265
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Re: Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamBuilder
Remember Madden 2006 for XBOX, with Donovan McNabb on the cover? That game had perfect progression.

-Young players would progress in their first few years (as they should).

-Every 4 weeks your players would progress if they played well.

-Pre-season was useful because if you played well your players would progress.

-Making a run in the playoffs would progress your players. Makes perfect sense, playoff experience.


I remember I would use the Cardinals and start 65 overall rated John Navarre. I played on All-Madden and threw 31 TDs and 34 INTs while going 15-1 (won 6 games by one FG). Navarre progressed up to a 72 OVR and then after the playoffs progressed to a 75 OVR. The next year I had 38 TDs and 14 INTs and he finished the year at 89 OVR after the Super Bowl. NOW THAT WAS PERFECT PROGRESSION.

From Madden 02-06 on PS2 I miss preseason progression the most. If you played your young guys 24yrs and younger and they played well they would progress in the preseason. This was sweet. Now preseason seems pointless in new current gen platforms compared to how it was in last gen's.
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Old 09-07-2009, 01:46 PM   #266
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Re: Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

I am in the camp of not having stats dominate progression. The reason for that is a human player can be good enough at Madden to boost the stats of a young player by playing out a game. In that case, who cares who you draft? You can always draft a 6th round QB and throw 35 TDs with him or a running back and rush for 1300 yards.

I think this is where simulation sports games have a leg up on console sports games. I have not played Front Office Football but I imagine its franchise mode is light years beyond Madden. I play a lot of OOTP though (Out of the Park Baseball). Although there is still quite a few people who do not like OOTP's progression, I always find it better than anything else in the market when comparing to console sports games. OOTP has peripheral ratings such as intelligence and work ethic. In OOTP you can see a prospect's potential rating. But the cool thing about that is that a potential rating may increase or decrease (breakthrough and bust players).

Simulation sports games have several advantages though. First, simulation sports games can only be simmed. So they do not worry about a human player inflating a player's stats by being too good at the game. Also, simulation sports games have the luxury to focus on franchise aspects because that is their bread and butter. They do not have to worry about graphics or physical gameplay.
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Old 09-07-2009, 03:08 PM   #267
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Re: Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

I just remembered something from Head Coach 09 that would be a great addition and I think it would solve the main issue people seem to have here. In HC, statistical performance was factored into the overall rating. They still had progression ratings though so players couldn't just become a physical beast by putting up good stats. But players that performed well could/would demand larger contracts because of their performance. And it worked both ways. If a good player put up bad stats, then his overall dropped. I remember that there was this issue with adding Favre to the game last year because they didn't have his stats on the disc, so if they gave Favre the accurate amount of years without any stats, then his overall would've been too low and he wouldn't even have started for the CPU Jets. But if he was listed as a rookie then his overall would've been high enough to be the starter.

So anyway, this would allow for physical progression to be more realistic and the overall rating would represent both ratings and stats...which would also be more realistic. Doing this and hiding the progression rating for a certain amount of time would be great additions, imo.
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Old 09-10-2009, 04:29 PM   #268
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Re: Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

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Originally Posted by TeamBuilder
I think the point is that there should be no letters or numbers that determine potential. But like I said before, I basically agree with you but it just leaves me with the huge hole that it's pre-determined that Patrick Turner can't be great.
Now idk if you like to cheat (i personally dont) but I dont remember what thread it was but someone how to change potentials:

1)Take Patrick Turner who has a C potential.
2) Raise his ratings to make him a 99 or whatever rating you want.
3) Because you upped his ratings the game sees it as his cap rating and that he has capped.
4) Return his ratings to what they were before.
5)Start a Franchise and BOOM Turner's potential will be what you edited it to be.
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Old 09-10-2009, 04:39 PM   #269
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Re: Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by krc1130
Now idk if you like to cheat (i personally dont) but I dont remember what thread it was but someone how to change potentials:

1)Take Patrick Turner who has a C potential.
2) Raise his ratings to make him a 99 or whatever rating you want.
3) Because you upped his ratings the game sees it as his cap rating and that he has capped.
4) Return his ratings to what they were before.
5)Start a Franchise and BOOM Turner's potential will be what you edited it to be.
Yea I saw that in another thread as well, it's not really my style. Thanks for the info though. I also noticed it when editing player positions in franchise mode. Take Jeff Backus for example (left tackle for Detroit). If you change him to a guard position his overall rating moves into the 80s which forces his potential to upgrade from "C" to "B", because it wouldn't make much sense if a player rated in the 80s has "C" potential. It's stating the obvious but it's similar to what they were talking about in other threads.
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Old 09-10-2009, 05:19 PM   #270
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Re: Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

Going out on a limb here but what about this...

Just get rid of the overall rating. Hear me out...

Who cares what the overall is anyway? You run your franchise with a certain system. At least I do anyway. If i want a speed back then i look at speed, acc, agility, whatever. If i want a power back then i look at trucking, strength, etc. Same for a WR or whatever position i'm looking to fill. The overall helps as a quick sort but it doesnt necessarily mean anything to me.

I like the potential idea but it should be hidden. I dont want to know. IRL do i know 100% somebody is going to turn into a HOF player? no. Nor do i know 100% he will be crap.

For progression there should be hidden characteristic categories that affect skill ratings. Learning should be set to affect how much AWR increases. A work ethic category should be set to affect how much certain skill categories increase. i.e. catching for a WR, or pass/run blocking footwork for OL, etc. All of these would increase with experience but for the "A" potential players you see it increase faster. "F" potentials hardly at all.

Then your players who perform well, will still perform well because they fit in your "system". But there could be a player who would perform better in a shorter amount of time due to his potential being greater.

Just my thoughts...
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Old 09-10-2009, 06:00 PM   #271
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Re: Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaddyDunc
Going out on a limb here but what about this...

Just get rid of the overall rating. Hear me out...

Who cares what the overall is anyway? You run your franchise with a certain system. At least I do anyway. If i want a speed back then i look at speed, acc, agility, whatever. If i want a power back then i look at trucking, strength, etc. Same for a WR or whatever position i'm looking to fill. The overall helps as a quick sort but it doesnt necessarily mean anything to me.

I like the potential idea but it should be hidden. I dont want to know. IRL do i know 100% somebody is going to turn into a HOF player? no. Nor do i know 100% he will be crap.

For progression there should be hidden characteristic categories that affect skill ratings. Learning should be set to affect how much AWR increases. A work ethic category should be set to affect how much certain skill categories increase. i.e. catching for a WR, or pass/run blocking footwork for OL, etc. All of these would increase with experience but for the "A" potential players you see it increase faster. "F" potentials hardly at all.

Then your players who perform well, will still perform well because they fit in your "system". But there could be a player who would perform better in a shorter amount of time due to his potential being greater.

Just my thoughts...
This is one thing I really liked about Head Coach, the overall rating for a player was based on what your philosophies were. For example, if you ran a 3-4 defense, you would set the philosophy to favor a good 3-4 DE, which would make power/size much more valuable than speed/finesse.

On the current system, it's all the same. Robert Mathis and Ty Warren would both get high 80's ratings at defensive end. But in a 3-4, Mathis would be a terrible DE because of his speed and lack of size. Meanwhile, Warren would suffer a bit as a 4-3 because he's a big powerful end, who would be more suited as a DT in that scheme.
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Old 09-10-2009, 06:19 PM   #272
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Re: Madden 2006 Had Perfect Progression

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Originally Posted by MrNFL_FanIQ
This is one thing I really liked about Head Coach, the overall rating for a player was based on what your philosophies were. For example, if you ran a 3-4 defense, you would set the philosophy to favor a good 3-4 DE, which would make power/size much more valuable than speed/finesse.

On the current system, it's all the same. Robert Mathis and Ty Warren would both get high 80's ratings at defensive end. But in a 3-4, Mathis would be a terrible DE because of his speed and lack of size. Meanwhile, Warren would suffer a bit as a 4-3 because he's a big powerful end, who would be more suited as a DT in that scheme.
To be honest, I wouldn't doubt if this is in next year. This would add tremendous depth for franchise. The only problem I would forsee happening is if you import NCAA draft classes because the game wouldn't know who is a 3-4 OLB or 4-3 OLB for example. Like this year, hand crafted draft classes would be ideal (but change the names and schools to avoid having set draft classes).

And in regards to Madden 06, I dont know why you guys haven't mentioned 07 for the PS2. It had the same progression, but had player roles which added a unique element to franchise. I remember drafting Troy Smith in the 6th round and he had the role of "developmental prospect." He never panned out for me, but it was nice to see which players had roles. I also had a 1st round running back labeled an "underachiever" because he rushed for 2,000 in 4 seasons (3.4 ypc) and went from a 84 to an 76. Fun times.
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