2k8's Ratings or Maddens old number system?

[LaW97]

i dont want a new system,
jus for them to make the current rating catergories work properly.

[kcarr]

Quote: Originally Posted by KBLover

I think Madden's problem is that the ratings are all too high. There's so many 80s and 90s guys as if every player in the NFL is above average. Or if 80 is "Average" then 90+ doesn't stand out as much. If average players were in the 60s and elite players were in the 90s then I bet there would be more distinction (assuming ratings mattered as much as they should)

I actually tried stretching out the ratings in 09 quite a bit and it really seemed to improve gameplay. I haven't tried it with 10 yet, would have if you could edit ratings in franchise to adjust progression to make up for the greater spread in ratings and also be able to edit incoming rookies so they weren't all way stronger than the rest of the league as they wouldn't be spread out.

As for the rest of what you said, I agree. Nearly all the ratings are needed and they really need to add more to differentiate other areas but only after they fix their programming to allow ratings to have more effect on gameplay.

[CreatineKasey]

Quote: Originally Posted by kcarr

Madden has the tools in their system to take into account intangibles and physical abilities as much or more than APFs system. I actually prefer 2k8s system to the current madden one but don't think that is the best way to go. I will agree that there needs to be a clutch rating but the workhorse rating could easily be shown by having more stamina than most other players as it will allow your player to become better in comparison. The problem is the stamina and durability ratings really need to be spread out accross the board making more seperation.

I totally understand your position and it's a solid one. I, like Tito explained very well, think that you can make M10 more complex by simplifying the rating system. It isn't about deciding the difference between a 95 and a 96. It is about characterizing athletes and making them individuals that have different skills than their counterparts. Now, M10 did a far better job this season than in the past no question.

I just really got a really good feel from APF and its ability system. I was able to clearly visualize and use the strengths of my team and be completely aware of my weaknesses. It wasn't as straightforard as "bad wR" or "fast RB". It's more like: my Wr's are good at short routes, and can make tough catches. My RB is a physical bruising RB who excels at stiff arms and ball security.

Now, I am fully aware this can be characterized in M10, but once you add in intangibles I really feel like the game feels more alive. Add that with a clearer picture of my team overall and you get a more enjoyable and personal experience with the players used. I was far more attached to my favorite APF players than I ever will be with my Steelers in M10. It's because those players have more individual character and have more to attach to in my opinion.

[KBLover]

Quote: Originally Posted by CreatineKasey

Now, I am fully aware this can be characterized in M10, but once you add in intangibles I really feel like the game feels more alive. Add that with a clearer picture of my team overall and you get a more enjoyable and personal experience with the players used. I was far more attached to my favorite APF players than I ever will be with my Steelers in M10. It's because those players have more individual character and have more to attach to in my opinion.

Madden has intangible ratings.

AWR, PRC, STA, INJ, PAC, RTE, MCV, ZCV - All of those are "non-tangible", i.e. you can't measure them with straight quantifiable measures like 40 times or number of reps or how high a player's vertical leap is or use a radar gun to see how much velocity is on a pass.

Madden needs to spread these intangible ratings out much more (if not all the ratings) so that the good and bad are far more visible, but it's not as though M10 has no intangibles in it.

The picture is probably clearer in APF because the guys with the attributes stand out more than ones that don't. Madden doesn't have that because 80 vs 95 really doesn't matter a ton, except in a few areas.

I don't see how APF is any more "simple" if only by the plethora of abilities/traits that exists. I saw that list someone posted up that had all the possible abilities in the game. There's a lot of them so the number of combinations and who has what and how many doesn't look very simple at all.

M10 can do this and it's just a matter of having the player ratings not all be around 80-90 for just about every one. Players need true weaknesses and ratings that indicate clearly what situation a player does well in. No more 75 MCV and ZCV, why not 80 MCV and 50 ZCV? Why not 60 FMV and 85 PMV? A HB with 95 TRK but under 50 for all other moves. Stuff like that will get the M10 system closer to the abilities system without changing anything else (except ratings differences meaning much more).

[kcarr]

I think a lot of the problem is how overrated everyone sees these players as being. Adrian Peterson is an excellent example of this. He is, in reality, a great back because he can run with both power and elusiveness to go along with very good speed.

That said, he is nowhere near where brandon jacobs or mike turner or some of the other top power backs are in terms of trucking. However, in the game, since they want him to be a 98 or 99 or whatever overall they only put him one point below jacobs and even with or above everyone else. He is a very fast back but shouldn't be within a point of CJ. He may be very elusive but in comparison with the most elusive backs in the NFL he is a step below them. It is the combination of all these that makes him great but he is not at or near the top in each of these areas.

[CreatineKasey]

I just think it's harder to visualize your team's strengths and weaknesses in M10's number system. It's harder to apply your strengths and actually see variance on the field outside of the basic speed/agil/accel. I definitely know it's there... but it isn't always that apparent... things are very subtle.

In APF I feel like I have a great handle on what identity my team has and how to utilize players. I know somewhat in M10, but there's still some things that aren't clear enough for me personally.