Will every completed pass still require a tackle...

[Tienshealth]

In the just ended African Cup of Nations the Pharoahs of Egypt proved their worth to the world as a whole. The made the Africans realise the error of not letting them qualifié for the World cup competition. Bravo les Egyptians. You're the best.

[Jono078]

Wow this is a great thread.

As poor as Superstar mode is, it is still my most used mode.

And I always like to play as the QB.

First problem is I use a rookie QB, and he is always rated as the best when it comes to stats, mostly I kill every other QB in YPA. I like the original post for perhaps having more animations where WR have to stretch out to make the catch and make it harder for them to actually make yards after the catch unless it's a perfect catch in the open with no defender in sight.

And also the first post LBZ guy made. I can't play on All Madden in Superstar mode because of how ****ed it is.

I will see my WR wide open and get the ball to them and either my QB throws the most ridiculously inaccurate pass or the WR drops it.

In fact after a few games I have 2 WR leading the NFL for most dropped catches, already into double figures and well ahead of the rest.. Says it all.

But great thread and I hope EA takes notice.

[mikeacard]

Quote: Originally Posted by KBLover

It shouldn't be totally in the hands of the user either. I mean if a user can "compensate" for an inaccurate QB - thus making him no longer be inaccurate, how is it then reflecting the fact the QB is inaccurate if he can be "user-ed" into throwing like Drew Brees. If the real life QB could "compensate" like the user controlled QB could...he wouldn't be inaccurate in the first place.

i think the best thing they can do is create windows where the qb will be at his best accuracy wise. the better the qb the larger the window. so for a guy like manning or brady they will be able to be accurate well after a guy makes his cut. for some of the lower guys it will be necessary to make throws right as the wr is making his cut. this stops the randomness of the bad throws and still gives the better qbs in the league an advantage over the bad qbs.


if inaccurate qb's start to have issues with missing guys after they make their cut it will make the mobile qbs much more realistic to play with. there is nothing more frusterating than having a perfect defense on for a guy like vince young only to watch the guy controlling young run around waiting for chris johnson to make a cut up field because for some reason after backs start to improvise they seem to get forgotten about by the defense. if that pass started being covered better and vince's accuracy took a major hit the longer he held onto the ball it would force people to actually learn how to play the game.

[TombSong]

I think what EA needs to think about when programming this is it needs to be a challenge to play with a bad QB not a game of frustration.

The "SIMS" want NFL stats no matter if it means taking control out of your hands. I am saying leave the control in the hands of the player BUT make the game a challenge as such that it will naturally bring about what the SIMS want.

As anyone who has played me in Madden or AP2K8 knows I LOVE to pass. I have played in the ACQB leagues for AP2K8 and Madden. I dropped 4K yards on the AP2k8 league with Unitas and over 5K yards with Drew Brees in Madden(500+passes/67% completion/30 INTs....out of 500=passes....alot of which were those DUMB pop up in the air INT's)

I could take Javaris Jackson and rip up a league in Madden, the only problem would be all those downs the ball would just go bonkers "just because." NOT because I am making bad reads or the defense is playing smart, but JUST because the game decides...NOPE you aint gonna make that throw....the "SIMS" stat engine says you should not. In AP2K8, I aint ripping up crap with a generic QB, I can play a respectable game(maybe) with one, but I aint gonna be winning alot of games with one and have NO running game to keep the chains moving.

Dont make the game where the engine negates my good gameplan/play calling. Instead make the game make me have to work to be successful with a scrub QB.

I cant believe we are talking about this like it dont even exist. Its in Ap2k8. Just take that and expand upon it.

[TombSong]

Quote: Originally Posted by mikeacard

i think the best thing they can do is create windows where the qb will be at his best accuracy wise. the better the qb the larger the window. so for a guy like manning or brady they will be able to be accurate well after a guy makes his cut. for some of the lower guys it will be necessary to make throws right as the wr is making his cut. this stops the randomness of the bad throws and still gives the better qbs in the league an advantage over the bad qbs. if inaccurate qb's start to have issues with missing guys after they make their cut it will make the mobile qbs much more realistic to play with. there is nothing more frusterating than having a perfect defense on for a guy like vince young only to watch the guy controlling young run around waiting for chris johnson to make a cut up field because for some reason after backs start to improvise they seem to get forgotten about by the defense. if that pass started being covered better and vince's accuracy took a major hit the longer he held onto the ball it would force people to actually learn how to play the game.

This is the kind of thinking that needs to go into the game...Good post.

[mikeacard]

Quote: Originally Posted by TombSong

This is the kind of thinking that needs to go into the game...Good post.

thanks, this game is much closer to being great than many will give it credit for. i still play 10 online almost daily. i try to play a straight up game unless my opponents tactics force me start doing things like only call a certain defense or exploit a glitchy defensive alignment.

it doesn't happen often but when i get a game against another guy who just plays straight up the game actually looks and feels like real football. as it stands right now it is just easier to exploit poor pursuit angles and other whacky a.i. issues. as those inconsistencies get ironed out it will be easier to see just how solid the foundation of the game actually is.

if they can start putting stuff like this in that will force people to play football the way it is actually played i think many will be happy with the foundation the they laid with this years version.

[JayhawkerStL]

Quote: Originally Posted by TombSong

When you played with a QB in 2K8 you had better understand what type Qb you had or you would be in trouble. There were routes you were gonna have problems making completions to because of your QB's skill set. You knew once you played with a QB for a while that his passes would either be short or off or he had a long wind up, or his balls took a little longer to get to the WR, or he would throw wild passes when pressure was in his face. It was innate. It was not random bad passes. In 2K8 you KNEW why your QB could not throw. It was not because of some random event. In Madden its a crap shoot. You can have your feet set, no pressure, and just throw a pass WAY over the WRs head and it happens too often.

While I don't agree with your take on Madden, as I thinking the QB play is better than you are describing, I 100% agree with you about the vastly superior QB play in 2K8. I did not make the jump to Madden until this last Christmas because the QB play just felt sterile compared to 2K8.

Not only did you have to understand you QB's strength's and weaknesses, but every QB felt like a completely different person, from the way he moved in the pocket to his throwing motion and how long it took him to get rid of the ball. Players found QB's that just felt right, as well as even Gold QB's that they couldn't excel with.

But I enjoyed Madden much more when I stopped comparing them. I'd like to see Madden QB play improved, but I do enjoy the way QB's are rated individually. Qb's do have individual strengths and weaknesses. EA just doesn't pull it off as well.

[kcarr]

Quote: Originally Posted by TombSong

I think what EA needs to think about when programming this is it needs to be a challenge to play with a bad QB not a game of frustration. The "SIMS" want NFL stats no matter if it means taking control out of your hands. I am saying leave the control in the hands of the player BUT make the game a challenge as such that it will naturally bring about what the SIMS want. As anyone who has played me in Madden or AP2K8 knows I LOVE to pass. I have played in the ACQB leagues for AP2K8 and Madden. I dropped 4K yards on the AP2k8 league with Unitas and over 5K yards with Drew Brees in Madden(500+passes/67% completion/30 INTs....out of 500=passes....alot of which were those DUMB pop up in the air INT's) I could take Javaris Jackson and rip up a league in Madden, the only problem would be all those downs the ball would just go bonkers "just because." NOT because I am making bad reads or the defense is playing smart, but JUST because the game decides...NOPE you aint gonna make that throw....the "SIMS" stat engine says you should not. In AP2K8, I aint ripping up crap with a generic QB, I can play a respectable game(maybe) with one, but I aint gonna be winning alot of games with one and have NO running game to keep the chains moving. Dont make the game where the engine negates my good gameplan/play calling. Instead make the game make me have to work to be successful with a scrub QB. I cant believe we are talking about this like it dont even exist. Its in Ap2k8. Just take that and expand upon it.

Noone is disagreeing that 2k did a better job of taking into account the surroundings when determining the random bad passes but that does not change the fact that there were sometimes random bad passes in 2k. There game is much better tuned and takes way more things into consideration but there is still a random factor in determining the outcome of their throws. If you take any qb, it is most evident with generic qbs as they are much less consistant as a group but you will on rare occasion get it with even the better qbs in the game, but if you throw the same pass to the same route with the same coverage and same pressure 100 times there will be sometimes the throw is on target hitting the receiver in stride, sometimes when he has to make more of a play on the ball, and sometimes it is just off. They do a much better job of tuning these percentages and making them feel different with every qb but no qb is going to hit the exact same spot every time on any given route. That takes some sort of ratings based random factor by the game's engine determining where the ball is supposed to go. Just because both games do it and 2k does it better is no reason for madden to remove it from the game.