Illogical.

[Flamehead]

Quote: Originally Posted by Krioniq

the tedious process that is quality assurance

IMHO, I don't think EA finds this one very tedious as it doesn't appear they spend much time or resources on it to begin with. I'm not talking about the little niggles either, I'm talking about the game-breakers that are easily spotted within a game or two. This leads to the impression of a beta-release in August, final product in December.

[ForeverYoung]

regarding the original post:
I agree that all of what EA said hints to a step by step implementation of the "new" franchise mode. This process will probably drag on for years.

So everyone who really thinks that M12 will be THE year for franchise mode will be disappointed.

[GiantBlue76]

Quote: Originally Posted by Krioniq

Their "crap" is obviously not below average given the review scores their game consistently garners and the amount it consistently sells. They're obviously doing something right.

We obviously have a different standard for what we've played in the past and you expect a lot less.

Last year Gamespot gave Madden 10 a 7.5. One other site ripped it also and the developers cried about it. Madden 10 was better than Madden 09, but it was still a mess. The majority feel that way even on this board and also on the EA boards.

Many folks aren't even asking for excellence, they are asking for something at least as good as what we had on the last gen. We aren't even there yet, more than a half decade later.

[HealyMonster]

Quote: Originally Posted by Krioniq

Their "crap" is obviously not below average given the review scores their game consistently garners and the amount it consistently sells. They're obviously doing something right. Further, in my opinion, Madden 10 was a great game, and Madden 11 is shaping up to follow suit. People are overreacting due to EA's admission of minimal franchise mode changes and completely ignoring and/or underestimating the effect that the additions of Gameflow, redone run blocking logic, and a new locomotion engine will add. In fact, people are praising NCAA 11 for the way it moves and feels (due to a similar new locomotion engine and new take on run blocking), but turning right around and bashing it in Madden. Quite the double standard.

Man, you are just sticking up for EA here, which is just as bad as someone bashing them for no reason IMO. Ian and the devs themselves have called half of the stuff last year "crap" Go watch the developer dairies. They "put in cutscenes just for the heck of it" "there was no rhyme or reason certain things would trigger". All the crap they talked last summer, they pushed off as last minute additions and for the heck of it. If they stood their ground and said :Look at our numbers...we know what we are doing: then yeah I wouldnt have anything to say to you and you would be 100% right, but if they are going to bash their own work, then im not going to listen to random people try and tell me their game is "solid". Madden 11 still doesn't compare to NFL 2K5. Regardless of what they do "good" regardless of how well locomotion is, it is sub par. they have 6 years on that game and we cant even compare them. Thats actually how big the gap is. Some of ytou guys love you some Madden, thats awesome. You dont want presentation, dont care about rocket catch, or stupid cutscenes,etc. Thats great, go enjoy Madden, but dont try to call me a fool for complaining about a game where its own devs say stuff sucked.

[thudias]

Quote: Originally Posted by Krioniq

So you should be able to appreciate the process that is planning out the game, UML-diagramming all the classes of the project so that it's known exactly what's needed to complete the project, writing code in two-weeks cycles assuming EA follows the agile philosophy, the tedious process that is code debugging, the tedious process that is quality assurance, and the time each of these tasks take, no? Doing something as large-scale as a video game franchise mode, which has to be designed to work and work well given nondeterministic operation by the user over a period of 30-or-so video game years of player progression, offseason roster moves, season simulations drafts, etc., is no easy task, and one that should not be taken lightly.

Really that is all automated now...QTP or Microsoft testing tools could go through any 30 year anything in a few hours.

[Netherscourge]

1. I'm 100% fine with them taking a extra year of development time.

2. I'm NOT fine with them trying to sell Madden 11 for $59.99 since it is, in fact, "FILLER" to keep us occupied for another year.

3. I hope to GOD they are building a whole new GAME ENGINE, and not just adding Hot Dog Prices and a Virtual City to the franchise mode for Madden 12. The core game engine is obsolete. It needs realistic physics and random/unique tackling. No more canned animations by themselves.

4. If Madden 12 is relesaed with the same basic game engine, then they're wasting everyone's time again.

[CM Hooe]

Quote: Originally Posted by Renegade44

Regardless of what they do "good" regardless of how well locomotion is, it is sub par.

I think this sentence unfortunately sums up the unfair mindset of a lot of people in this forum.

Quote: Originally Posted by tazdevil20

We obviously have a different standard for what we've played in the past and you expect a lot less.

Perhaps; I expect a fun and reasonably deep football video game. Madden and NCAA both deliver that and both have consistently met that expectation of mine over the years.

[HealyMonster]

Quote: Originally Posted by Krioniq

I think this sentence unfortunately sums up the unfair mindset of a lot of people in this forum. Perhaps; I expect a fun and reasonably deep football video game. Madden and NCAA both deliver that and both have consistently met that expectation of mine over the years.

Dont interpret my criticism of Madden as judgement on people that enjoy the game. There have been games that I enjoyed the heck out of that most people really didn't like at all and were very critical of. Thats the way life is, everyone is different, and I can respect others opinions, so Im not saying "Krionizq there is something wrong with you cause you like madden"!

My point is that people that like Madden, are often times very quick to come off like people criticizing madden are immature, reckless in their criticism, and unfair to EA, and that isnt the truth. I dont think people being up in arms are being unfair to EA. 6 years is a long time man, in the video game industry thats dang near a whole generation for the most part, and we payed 60 dollars for 06,07,08,09,10, and soon to be 11 and the developers continue to dance around, saying yeah, 087 was crap but 09 is great. 09 was crap but 10 is great, we did some random crappy stuff in 10 but in 11 we are "refining" and in 12 you will be amazed. Yet I put in 2k5 and all of the stuff I wish were in madden, is all right there in a game that came out in 04. It isnt like we are all even interpreting this stuff, they come out and say all these things that anger us. I couldn't make up half the stuff they have said about their own work, its just ridiculous.