More Links

NinersFan · 07-26-2003, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Omerta said:
If a company has a good product that most of its consumers like, you don't mess with the product. This is true of any business that makes and provides goods and services.

Almost, but I think the first sentence should read:
"If a company has a product that sells well, you don't mess with the product."

Quote:

Madden fans just want improvements every year... and Madden fans have received those improvements.

Have you been to a Madden board? The fact is, most Madden fans hate the gameplay issues that remain in the game year after year... suction blocking, weak DB AI, the dreaded catch-up code, etc, etc

Quote:

EA doesn't feel it needs to totally revamp a game or games, if the consumer is satisfied... which we can all see by the sales of Madden.

Again, almost. Substitute "the consumer is satisfied" with "consumers keep paying".

Madden is a long established videogame that has no problem selling because a) it's a big name, heavily advertised game with a massive fan base and b) it's a classic pick up and play title. It will probably out sell ESPN 9-1...

... but, barring a miracle, ESPN will offer the most realistic football gaming experience.

SPTO · 07-26-2003, 04:13 PM

Hey Klue I wanna answer that question too!

As someone who just got turned on to the NFL2K/ESPN brand and hearing how it's such a great hardcore football gamer's game of choice. I have to say i'm mildly disappointed. I know that they needed to add some polish this year and they did which i'm thankful for because it'll feel more like a real broadcast when I play the game.

I just think that Crib mode is a gimmicky thing that is analogous to MADDEN Cards. Altho I like the idea that all your records etc etc are there as well as having new furniture/merchandise based on your performance. I don't like the whole air hockey and watching SC commercials stuff tho.

FPM may end up revolutionizing football gaming forever but i'm not so hot over it as it looks a bit disorienting. I will say that I'll try it out and my tune may change. It's definately a mode that will bring people closer to the reality of the gridiron game.

As for MADDEN's Owner Mode....Let's just say it's a front office sim-fan's dream come true, if implemented properly. The Playmaker Control could get arcadey/cheezy so we'll have to reserve judgement on that.

So to sum it up the major mode/gameplay enhancements for both games go like this:

MADDEN: B
ESPN: B-

jmood88 · 07-26-2003, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Klue516 said:

Quote:

jmood88 said:
I would say that I don't like it. I don't like all that front office stuff. Franchise is one thing, micromanaging everything is another. I know that there are some people that like that stuff, but I don't. That's why I wouldn't buy front office football or some crap like that. I want to play football not look at menus and adjust prices.

How would you compare and rate the added features VC and EA have added this year?

Owners mode, Playmaker Control, etc to First Person, Crib, etc

First person is going to be great. I want to see if it looks like what I see when I'm on the field. The crib has over 500 stats for people who like that, you can unlock classic players, stadiums, play music over the pa system, watch replays and sportscenter commercials on the big screen tv, see all of your trophy's, and it looks much better then just endless menus. Also, what about the animations,cut-scenes, new play calling screen, better presentation, better pre-game, halftime, and post game shows, they made the already great commentary better, better franchise, actual superbowl show and all the presentation that is like the superbowl. What has madden done compared to this? Owners mode, playmaker, and a new playcalling screen. Playmaker is specifically suited to michael vick and a few other quarterbacks. Owners mode is the only major thing, but will only draw hardcore gamers. I'm sure madden is going to be a good game but vc has added and/or improved everything that they had in 2k3 and 2k3 was a great game.

Klue516 · 07-26-2003, 04:28 PM

Quote:

SportsmanTO said:
Hey Klue I wanna answer that question too!

As someone who just got turned on to the NFL2K/ESPN brand and hearing how it's such a great hardcore football gamer's game of choice. I have to say i'm mildly disappointed. I know that they needed to add some polish this year and they did which i'm thankful for because it'll feel more like a real broadcast when I play the game.

I just think that Crib mode is a gimmicky thing that is analogous to MADDEN Cards. Altho I like the idea that all your records etc etc are there as well as having new furniture/merchandise based on your performance. I don't like the whole air hockey and watching SC commercials stuff tho.

FPM may end up revolutionizing football gaming forever but i'm not so hot over it as it looks a bit disorienting. I will say that I'll try it out and my tune may change. It's definately a mode that will bring people closer to the reality of the gridiron game.

As for MADDEN's Owner Mode....Let's just say it's a front office sim-fan's dream come true, if implemented properly. The Playmaker Control could get arcadey/cheezy so we'll have to reserve judgement on that.

So to sum it up the major mode/gameplay enhancements for both games go like this:

MADDEN: B
ESPN: B-

Thanks SportsmanTO for your replay.

FPM sounds really cool, but as good as the mode will be, first person football will never take ME away from 3rd person (only because i have trouble dealing with the cam and needing 2 joy sticks (one to move and another to move my head) but other than that i'm expecting it to kick arse.

The crib, seems pretty tight. I'm a person who loves STATS, records, user profiles, etc. Bobble heads, aren't a big deal to me, but the Trophy room should be pretty damn kool.

Owner's Mode

= Klue's dreams, enough said.

Play Maker control sounds cool, but with Madden's track record of being more of an offensive game, i cannot help but worry about the cheese factor that could come out of this. Hopefully 15 yard drop backs, robo qb action, and more inaccurate passes are added to help cut into the power of the Playmaker control.

jmood88 · 07-26-2003, 04:31 PM

You only need to move your head before the play and that's only if you want to. People who have the beta version of the game said that you don't need to move your head.

NYJets · 07-26-2003, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Klue516 said:

Quote:

jmood88 said:
I would say that I don't like it. I don't like all that front office stuff. Franchise is one thing, micromanaging everything is another. I know that there are some people that like that stuff, but I don't. That's why I wouldn't buy front office football or some crap like that. I want to play football not look at menus and adjust prices.

How would you compare and rate the added features VC and EA have added this year?

Owners mode, Playmaker Control, etc to First Person, Crib, etc

Good Question. First Person Mode, I am pumped about. It looks great in the videos, and looks like it will be pretty playable. People with the beta have given it great reviews, so right now I think this feature is looking amazing.

Crib Mode. Well, it looks like Madden Cards, but looks to be much improved Madden Cards. But I never really like Madden Cards, so unlocking things doesn't really matter to me. There do seem to be some good parts to it like jukebox, and I think there is a trophy room. I'll have to reserve total judgement, but it seems like a nice addition.

Owner Mode, I really like. I'm a big franchise guy, and this looks like a great addition. Things I'm still waiting to see, how good will the stadium editor be. I'd like to give my Jets there own stadium, but not if it's just going to be some generic looking stadium. Also, I think like every managemant type of a game, this could get tedious after awhile. But it should still be fun for a long time, and is a great addition.

Playmaker- Never used it in an EA Basketball Game as I haven't played Live or March Madness this year. It could be nice, but I hope it doesn't become arcadish, as there aren't really a lot of moves that players do. I'll reserve judgement

So I say the new modes are about even. I'm really looking forward to Owner and FP, Crib mode seems like it will be pretty good, but it's mostly fluff, so it's not really a big deal to me. Not sure about Playmaker, but at least it's something new, and something to try and improve gameplay.

Omerta · 07-26-2003, 04:38 PM

Quote:

NYJets37 said:
I agreed with most of your post, until about halfway through when you said that because College and Pro players play Madden, that means it's more realistic. Do you really think these guys are hardcore gamers, and have tried out lots of football games, and given each a lot of playing time? I don't think so.

Not so fast NYJets37...

A lot of professional - athletes are 'hardcore - sports gamers'.

Now with this being said, are all the players I know or played against hardcore sports gamers? ... No!

But I know some of the players I played with while at Florida were and Dwight Smith, Donte' Stallworth, Jevon Kearse, and Jacquez Green are.

Maybe I did not convey my point correctly...
What I was trying to say is that if anyone should know if a football game imitates real life NFL football, it would be these guys.
These guys play the game on the field ... and can tell if a video game based on NFL football represents the real things that happen on the field during a game and during plays ... tendencies/way players react in situations/speed of the game/overall gameplay presentation/etc.

Game on...

Klue516 · 07-26-2003, 04:38 PM

Quote:

First person is going to be great. I want to see if it looks like what I see when I'm on the field. The crib has over 500 stats for people who like that, you can unlock classic players, stadiums, play music over the pa system, watch replays and sportscenter commercials on the big screen tv, see all of your trophy's, and it looks much better then just endless menus.

Agreed, FPM/Crib is going to be sweet

Quote:

Also, what about the animations,cut-scenes, new play calling screen, better presentation, better pre-game, halftime, and post game shows, they made the already great commentary better, better franchise, actual superbowl show and all the presentation that is like the superbowl

All of that stuff is great

Quote:

What has madden done compared to this? Owners mode, playmaker, and a new playcalling screen. Playmaker is specifically suited to michael vick and a few other quarterbacks. Owners mode is the only major thing, but will only draw hardcore gamers.

Now that was just wrong

, Madden has added Playmaker controll, more animations, new playcalling screen, total revamped playbooks, redone DB logic, redone OL/DL interaction, and lets not mention Owner's Mode. I just don't understand how you could say they didn't really added much

07-26-2003, 04:12 PM	#17
NinersFan Rookie OVR: 2 Join Date: Jul 2003	Re: Interesting difference between EA and VC... Quote: *Omerta said:* If a company has a good product that most of its consumers like, you don't mess with the product. This is true of any business that makes and provides goods and services. Almost, but I think the first sentence should read: "If a company has a product that sells well, you don't mess with the product." Quote: Madden fans just want improvements every year... and Madden fans have received those improvements. Have you been to a Madden board? The fact is, most Madden fans hate the gameplay issues that remain in the game year after year... suction blocking, weak DB AI, the dreaded catch-up code, etc, etc Quote: EA doesn't feel it needs to totally revamp a game or games, if the consumer is satisfied... which we can all see by the sales of Madden. Again, almost. Substitute "the consumer is satisfied" with "consumers keep paying". Madden is a long established videogame that has no problem selling because a) it's a big name, heavily advertised game with a massive fan base and b) it's a classic pick up and play title. It will probably out sell ESPN 9-1... ... but, barring a miracle, ESPN will offer the most realistic football gaming experience.

07-26-2003, 04:13 PM	#18
SPTO binging OVR: 53 Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: The 905 Posts: 68,062 Blog Entries: 46	Re: Interesting difference between EA and VC... Hey Klue I wanna answer that question too! As someone who just got turned on to the NFL2K/ESPN brand and hearing how it's such a great hardcore football gamer's game of choice. I have to say i'm mildly disappointed. I know that they needed to add some polish this year and they did which i'm thankful for because it'll feel more like a real broadcast when I play the game. I just think that Crib mode is a gimmicky thing that is analogous to MADDEN Cards. Altho I like the idea that all your records etc etc are there as well as having new furniture/merchandise based on your performance. I don't like the whole air hockey and watching SC commercials stuff tho. FPM may end up revolutionizing football gaming forever but i'm not so hot over it as it looks a bit disorienting. I will say that I'll try it out and my tune may change. It's definately a mode that will bring people closer to the reality of the gridiron game. As for MADDEN's Owner Mode....Let's just say it's a front office sim-fan's dream come true, if implemented properly. The Playmaker Control could get arcadey/cheezy so we'll have to reserve judgement on that. So to sum it up the major mode/gameplay enhancements for both games go like this: MADDEN: B ESPN: B-

07-26-2003, 04:17 PM	#19
jmood88 Sean Payton: Retribution OVR: 40 Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 34,640 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Interesting difference between EA and VC... Quote: *Klue516 said:* Quote: *jmood88 said:* I would say that I don't like it. I don't like all that front office stuff. Franchise is one thing, micromanaging everything is another. I know that there are some people that like that stuff, but I don't. That's why I wouldn't buy front office football or some crap like that. I want to play football not look at menus and adjust prices. How would you compare and rate the added features VC and EA have added this year? Owners mode, Playmaker Control, etc to First Person, Crib, etc First person is going to be great. I want to see if it looks like what I see when I'm on the field. The crib has over 500 stats for people who like that, you can unlock classic players, stadiums, play music over the pa system, watch replays and sportscenter commercials on the big screen tv, see all of your trophy's, and it looks much better then just endless menus. Also, what about the animations,cut-scenes, new play calling screen, better presentation, better pre-game, halftime, and post game shows, they made the already great commentary better, better franchise, actual superbowl show and all the presentation that is like the superbowl. What has madden done compared to this? Owners mode, playmaker, and a new playcalling screen. Playmaker is specifically suited to michael vick and a few other quarterbacks. Owners mode is the only major thing, but will only draw hardcore gamers. I'm sure madden is going to be a good game but vc has added and/or improved everything that they had in 2k3 and 2k3 was a great game.

07-26-2003, 04:28 PM	#20
Klue516 Plays well in Tennessee OVR: 16 Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 4,804	Re: Interesting difference between EA and VC... Quote: *SportsmanTO said:* Hey Klue I wanna answer that question too! As someone who just got turned on to the NFL2K/ESPN brand and hearing how it's such a great hardcore football gamer's game of choice. I have to say i'm mildly disappointed. I know that they needed to add some polish this year and they did which i'm thankful for because it'll feel more like a real broadcast when I play the game. I just think that Crib mode is a gimmicky thing that is analogous to MADDEN Cards. Altho I like the idea that all your records etc etc are there as well as having new furniture/merchandise based on your performance. I don't like the whole air hockey and watching SC commercials stuff tho. FPM may end up revolutionizing football gaming forever but i'm not so hot over it as it looks a bit disorienting. I will say that I'll try it out and my tune may change. It's definately a mode that will bring people closer to the reality of the gridiron game. As for MADDEN's Owner Mode....Let's just say it's a front office sim-fan's dream come true, if implemented properly. The Playmaker Control could get arcadey/cheezy so we'll have to reserve judgement on that. So to sum it up the major mode/gameplay enhancements for both games go like this: MADDEN: B ESPN: B- Thanks SportsmanTO for your replay. FPM sounds really cool, but as good as the mode will be, first person football will never take ME away from 3rd person (only because i have trouble dealing with the cam and needing 2 joy sticks (one to move and another to move my head) but other than that i'm expecting it to kick arse. The crib, seems pretty tight. I'm a person who loves STATS, records, user profiles, etc. Bobble heads, aren't a big deal to me, but the Trophy room should be pretty damn kool. Owner's Mode = Klue's dreams, enough said. Play Maker control sounds cool, but with Madden's track record of being more of an offensive game, i cannot help but worry about the cheese factor that could come out of this. Hopefully 15 yard drop backs, robo qb action, and more inaccurate passes are added to help cut into the power of the Playmaker control.

07-26-2003, 04:31 PM	#21
jmood88 Sean Payton: Retribution OVR: 40 Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 34,640 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Interesting difference between EA and VC... You only need to move your head before the play and that's only if you want to. People who have the beta version of the game said that you don't need to move your head.

	MLB The Show 24 Review: Another Solid Hit for the Series
	New Star GP Review: Old-School Arcade Fun
	Where Are Our College Basketball Video Game Rumors?

07-26-2003, 04:32 PM	#22
NYJets Hall Of Fame OVR: 26 Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 18,650	Re: Interesting difference between EA and VC... Quote: *Klue516 said:* Quote: *jmood88 said:* I would say that I don't like it. I don't like all that front office stuff. Franchise is one thing, micromanaging everything is another. I know that there are some people that like that stuff, but I don't. That's why I wouldn't buy front office football or some crap like that. I want to play football not look at menus and adjust prices. How would you compare and rate the added features VC and EA have added this year? Owners mode, Playmaker Control, etc to First Person, Crib, etc Good Question. First Person Mode, I am pumped about. It looks great in the videos, and looks like it will be pretty playable. People with the beta have given it great reviews, so right now I think this feature is looking amazing. Crib Mode. Well, it looks like Madden Cards, but looks to be much improved Madden Cards. But I never really like Madden Cards, so unlocking things doesn't really matter to me. There do seem to be some good parts to it like jukebox, and I think there is a trophy room. I'll have to reserve total judgement, but it seems like a nice addition. Owner Mode, I really like. I'm a big franchise guy, and this looks like a great addition. Things I'm still waiting to see, how good will the stadium editor be. I'd like to give my Jets there own stadium, but not if it's just going to be some generic looking stadium. Also, I think like every managemant type of a game, this could get tedious after awhile. But it should still be fun for a long time, and is a great addition. Playmaker- Never used it in an EA Basketball Game as I haven't played Live or March Madness this year. It could be nice, but I hope it doesn't become arcadish, as there aren't really a lot of moves that players do. I'll reserve judgement So I say the new modes are about even. I'm really looking forward to Owner and FP, Crib mode seems like it will be pretty good, but it's mostly fluff, so it's not really a big deal to me. Not sure about Playmaker, but at least it's something new, and something to try and improve gameplay.

07-26-2003, 04:38 PM	#23
Omerta Rookie OVR: 5 Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: TX. / FL. / Europe	Re: Interesting difference between EA and VC... Quote: NYJets37 said: I agreed with most of your post, until about halfway through when you said that because College and Pro players play Madden, that means it's more realistic. Do you really think these guys are hardcore gamers, and have tried out lots of football games, and given each a lot of playing time? I don't think so. Not so fast NYJets37... A lot of professional - athletes are 'hardcore - sports gamers'. Now with this being said, are all the players I know or played against hardcore sports gamers? ... No! But I know some of the players I played with while at Florida were and Dwight Smith, Donte' Stallworth, Jevon Kearse, and Jacquez Green are. Maybe I did not convey my point correctly... What I was trying to say is that if anyone should know if a football game imitates real life NFL football, it would be these guys. These guys play the game on the field ... and can tell if a video game based on NFL football represents the real things that happen on the field during a game and during plays ... tendencies/way players react in situations/speed of the game/overall gameplay presentation/etc. Game on...

More Links

Interesting difference between EA and VC...